FAQ |
Calendar |
Search |
Today's Posts |
|
#1
|
||||
|
||||
Where are the posters, George and others, that examine the exactness of God's words, and yet are silent with this absolute distortion of Scripture?
Underlining and bold mine for emphasis: Quote:
It is apparent that some among us have fallen into the trap of bigotry. Who are the Canaanites (who received the curse)? Quote:
This idea of equating the black-skinned person with the curse of Canaan is false, ignorant, and shameful. It needs to be retracted and rejected! |
#2
|
||||
|
||||
Quote:
I have computer problems at the moment, but needless to say, there is no link between Leviticus 18 and Genesis 9. I'll demonstrate what Noah "knew" was "done to him" and it wasn;t sodomy. The curse was fulfilled and does not extend into the Grace age, we were not prophesied in the Scriptures(Eph. 3) We were all, black and white, red, purple and green, out of the commonwealth of Israel BUT NOW made nigh by the blood of Christ. I find the whole premise as distasteful as you do. Grace and peace brother Tony |
#3
|
||||
|
||||
Brothers Tim and Tony,
I'm with you guys. I'm really, really tired of people reading into this passage -- both in making assumptions about what was "done to" Noah and assuming that our modern ideas of "race" can be grafted on to the curse in some way. |
#4
|
|||
|
|||
Quote:
Only when we are received into Glory will this topic be settled for me when I hear it straight from the Lords lips, as far as what was "done" unto Noah, does it matter to our salvation? no of course not, the trouble with speculation is that it is NOT exact truth, unless the Bible was absolutely CLEAR about what was done unto Noah, I choose not to speculate but simply rest in the fact all these questions I see through a glass darkly will one day be answered in a manner that no man on earth through speculation will ever attain to, the truth from the Blessed Saviour, the Word himself, the Lord Jesus Christ Until that day I pray that The Lord keeps my thoughts fuzzy and unclear when it comes to speculation, for I know I shouldn't be doing it. Psalms 19:14 Let the words of my mouth, and the meditation of my heart, be acceptable in thy sight, O LORD, my strength, and my redeemer. |
#5
|
||||
|
||||
There is two separate issues, though connected.
First, the act committed by Ham. Second, the false application of the curse to a group of people who were not in any way included in that curse. As far as the first, WE SIMPLY DO NOT KNOW what that specific act was. If God intended that we should know the details, HE WOULD HAVE TOLD US in no uncertain terms! Sufficient for us is that Canaan's decendents were cursed by Noah based on this act. We are simply given that the curse had a reason. We cannot even assume that Noah's curse carries the full weight of God's judgment. As for the second, this horrible, false connection between the history of the slavery of black-skinned people with the curse of Canaan is purely and absolutely based in bigotry and racism, and has NOT a SINGLE iota of Scriptural evidence. The reality is that there has been throughout history a continuous string of one people enslaving another people. I dare say that the total numbers of slaves throughout history is far greater among non-blacks than blacks. Using Chette's and KingSolomon's terms, "Hamites" have enslaved other "Hamites" just as much or more as any "Jephethites" have enslaved "Hamites"! Just how does the Egyptian (who were likely "Hamites") enslavement of "Shemites" fit?? This idea of Chette's is quite prevalent around here in Florida among a certain group of people. They still wear the pointed white hats when they have their meetings. I challenge Chette, an otherwise strong Bible student, to re-evaluate his prospective, and then publicly retract and reject this filthy idea. |
#6
|
||||
|
||||
I did notice the incorrect references to the Hamite curse.
I personally feel that conjecturing about things in scripture that aren't clear is not necessarily a bad thing as long as you realize it is indeed conjecture. Whether it's wise to post those conjectures on a public forum is another matter entirely. Maybe I'll try not to do that again. With that said, my other cynical comment about who's your baby's momma is not in character with my viewpoint on race, which is that it is not relevant in any way in the church age to God and it shouldn't be to us, either. I regret writing that comment. It was foolish jesting and certainly doesn't uplift Christ who died for ALL of the sons of Adam. Shortly after posting I felt slightly sick to my stomach about it but by then it was too late to edit. Hopefully, we have black brothers and sisters who read and participate on this forum and God forbid we should hurt or offend them in that way. If they read this thread and weren't offended but only saddened, as I'm certain Christ is, then they fill up the love that was missing here. The ignorance and lack of love displayed in this thread is also not a very good testimony to any unsaved people who might happen upon Brandon's website, either. I believe it undermines all of Brandon's purposes in providing this forum. I'm glad Brother Tim called us on it. He and Brandon and Tony are right and I agree. Last edited by greenbear; 07-03-2009 at 01:01 PM. |
#7
|
||||
|
||||
Conjecture itself may not be wrong, but basing one's belief or view of life on conjecture is wrong. Using one's imagination to fill in the scenes of the Bible may not be not erroneous in itself, but creating a doctrine or Bible interpretation on such is fallacy.
I have met far too many Christian folk in my life that somehow think that the "white race" is superior to the "black race" (although they used a far more derogatory term) based on what they have heard some preacher say about Ham's curse. It is the scourge of the common American church that there is such a saying, "The most segregated place in America is the Sunday morning church service." |
#8
|
||||
|
||||
The Mark Of Cain Myth
Quote:
God put a mark on Cain and many, many people stop there, and say, "h'it was black skin..." without reading what the Scriptures say. Why did God put a mark on Cain? "Wayall, he killded his brother..." Ge 4:15 And the LORD said unto him, Therefore whosoever slayeth Cain, vengeance shall be taken on him sevenfold. And the LORD set a mark upon Cain, lest any finding him should kill him. oops. All those hangings, burnings, shootings, stabbings, stonings, and dragging behind pickup trucks has put a lot of the white pointy kaps into hell. If the "mark" was "black skin", we should be as nice as we can to black folks because the "mark" was given for Cain's protection, not curse. It's possible if every murder in the Bible is studied, the identity of this "mark" might be revealed, if there is a reason God would want to have us know it. People have commented to me the mark of Cain and the mark of The Beast in Revelation is the same mark> Rationally I can;t see this as being the same mark. The mark of Revelation is a mark of damnation, the mark put on Cain was for his protection. I can also find no Scriptural evidence that God has cursed one race of people from nearly Adamic times to the present, considering that "Hamites" are Gentiles and according to Eph. 2 and 3 all Gentiles, from then to the revelation given to Paul of the mystery of Jew and Gentile in the same Body co-equal, we were all out of the Commonwealth of Israel, we were all afar off "but now" all made nigh by the blood of Christ, "Hamites" and "Japethites". An anthopological anomaly exists that cannot be explained by the JEB Stuart College Of Natural Sciences: The aborigines of the Solomon Islands are scientifically and anthropologically Caucasians, their skin is black as coal. The native tribes of Africa did not jump into little wooden canoes and cross the Atlantic to invade South Carolina in the 1600s, these people were brought here against their will, stolen from their homes and sent here in the most brutal conditions known to man and subjected to persecution that makes the children of Israel in Egypt look cushy. I'm a pretty hard person and I have a "secret sin" I make no secret of: I'm a cynic. I'm the person they used to invent the word "cynic". But there are two things I will absolutely not tolerate in a Christian setting of any kind where I hold the reins: Galatianism, being made nigh by the Spirit through the shed blood of Christ and then made "perfect" by "ordinances", "obediences", "traditions", "laws", and using the Scriptures to justify racism. My next message will demonstrate the Scriptures disconnecting Leviticus 18 from Genesis 9. Grace and peace friends Tony |
#9
|
||||
|
||||
Greenbear, I know that you have said that you were leaving, but I hope that you will see this and respond.
I do not understand what it was that caused you to make your last post here directed at me. I am going to reprint portions and comment, but first I appeal to you to continue posting on the forum. Because it does not fit this thread, I want to comment on the general chat part of the forum. I will answer your post here if we are reconciled on the other thread. |
#10
|
||||
|
||||
KingSolomon1611:
If you review posts #4, #5, #6, #10, and #11, the intermingling of the curse of Canaan with all Hamites should be observable. In the following quotes, I will indicate notable areas in bold underlining: In post #4, Chette said: Quote:
In post #5, KingSolomon1611 uses a quote from Luke, and then links (using the rules of pronoun - noun antecedents) the name "Ham", the question of sodomy, and his past knowledge of certain behavior. The phrase "their culture", the term "rappers" and immoral acts in prisons are brought together in one paragraph. Then in post #6, Chette poses a question of linkage as to whether or not many prisoners who are immoral were also Hamites. In post #10, KingSolomon1611 answers in the affirmative. Last, in post #11, Chette expands this linkage of Hamites and slavery: Note again that there absolutely no Biblical connection between Canaan's curse and Black slavery. Quote:
In post #12, I make my initial statement. In the part of the post where [King]Solomon's name appears, I am appealing to Chette, Solomon, [who have posted on the topic] and any others to show evidence where all of Ham's decendents are cursed. This statement did not claim that Solomon had made this statement any more than that any unnamed "others" had done so. Chette and KingSolomon had jointly tied the ideas together in their previous posts. Chette did so specifically, and KingSolomon gave supporting statements. KingSolomon, I did not claim that you said that the entire family of Ham was cursed. What was evident in your posts was that you did not disagree with Chette when he made that connection. It appeared from your responses that you may have agreed with that connection. I apologize if I read more into your posts than you meant. Also, I am in no way claiming or even implying that Chette is racist or bigoted. What is true is that there are those who are racists who do use this argument to support their "superiority" over black-skinned people. I do beseech Chette to clearly reject any connection with Canaan's curse and Black slavery. |
|
|