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  #101  
Old 02-25-2008, 12:44 PM
sting of truth
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Mat 23:24 Ye blind guides, which strain at a gnat, and swallow a camel. kjv

Mat 23:24 Ye blind guides, which strain out a gnat, and swallow a camel. kjv

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ok, do you realize that regardless if it is at, or out, it's still a correct translation because they both equate the exact same meaning?
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  #102  
Old 02-25-2008, 01:16 PM
jerry
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Actually, they do not say the same thing at all. One says strain at a gnat - ie. if they see a gnat, they strain because of it (but it does not indicate success - more their motivation for straining). The other phrase indicates what they do - straining out the gnat. The first one implies a hypercritical mentality that will pick apart little things, but be so far off on the big things (swallow a camel).

The King James says: Matthew 23:24 Ye blind guides, which strain at a gnat, and swallow a camel.

Where does that other verse come from - the NKJV?
  #103  
Old 02-25-2008, 08:36 PM
sting of truth
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jerry View Post
Actually, they do not say the same thing at all. One says strain at a gnat - ie. if they see a gnat, they strain because of it (but it does not indicate success - more their motivation for straining). The other phrase indicates what they do - straining out the gnat. The first one implies a hypercritical mentality that will pick apart little things, but be so far off on the big things (swallow a camel).

The King James says: Matthew 23:24 Ye blind guides, which strain at a gnat, and swallow a camel.

Where does that other verse come from - the NKJV?
strain out a gnat and strain out a gnat both appear in the kjv, one in the cambridge, and the other in the oxford,
out= cambridge
at= gnat

i started a thread about it here: cambridge vs. oxford printing of the kjv.
http://av1611.com/forums/showthread.php?t=76
  #104  
Old 02-25-2008, 09:36 PM
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"strain at a gnat" is the Cambridge KJB reading. See the other thread for continued discussion on this.
  #105  
Old 02-28-2008, 10:59 PM
Jot&Tittle
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Default Spelling-Onlyism ;o

Quote:
Originally Posted by jerry View Post
The only "updates" our King James has undergone since its printing in 1611 are the standardization of spelling and the correction of spelling errors.
Not exactly! Consider these:

Deuteronomy 26:1 And it shall be when thou art come in vnto the land which the Lord giueth thee for an inheritance, and possessest it, and dwellest therein:
Deuteronomy 26:1 And it shall be, when thou art come in unto the land which the LORD thy God giveth thee for an inheritance, and possessest it, and dwellest therein;

Joshua 13:29 And Moses gaue inheritance vnto the halfe tribe of Manasseh: and this was the possession of the halfe tribe of Manasseh, by their families.
Joshua 13:29 And Moses gave inheritance unto the half tribe of Manasseh: and this was the possession of the half tribe of the children of Manasseh by their families.

There are many more like this. Too often I have endured the argument that "if one word was added to or taken away from the word of God then God wasn't big enough to preserve his word" or some such variant.

Please do not misunderstand. My goal is to build peoples faith in the King James Bible, but to do so we must be accurate.
  #106  
Old 02-28-2008, 11:03 PM
Jot&Tittle
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jerry View Post
The Bible is already inspired - it doesn't become inspired as you read or study it. It never loses its inspiration.
Amen, amen!
  #107  
Old 02-28-2008, 11:15 PM
Jot&Tittle
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Default Verse comparisons KJB vs. NKJV

Genesis 22:8
King James Bible
And Abraham said, My son, God will provide himself a lamb for a burnt offering: so they went both of them together.
Genesis 22:8
New King James Version
And Abraham said, "My son, God will provide for Himself the lamb for a burnt offering." So the two of them went together.
Genesis 22:8

By adding the word “for” the translators of the New King James Version destroyed a clear prophecy of our coming Lord Jesus Christ’s sacrifice for our sins and the fact that Jesus was “God manifest in the flesh”
1 Timothy 3:16 states, “And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.”
Notice the text of the King James Bible states “God will provide himself a lamb for a burnt offering”, grammatically indicating that he (God) would be the lamb, where as the New King James Version states “God will provide for Himself the lamb for a burnt offering” grammatically indicating that God would get a lamb for a burnt offering but it would not be himself. This is a deliberate attack on the Godhead! Colossians 2:8-9 states, “Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ. For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.
Further, notice that Genesis 22:13 (in both books) shows that Abraham was provided a ram (not a lamb) in the stead of Isaac. John the Baptist twice referred to Jesus Christ as the “Lamb of God” (John 1:29 & 36)

Acts 17:22
King James Bible
Then Paul stood in the midst of Mars' hill, and said, Ye men of Athens, I perceive that in all things ye are too superstitious.
Acts 17:22
New King James Version
Then Paul stood in the midst of the Areopagus and said, "Men of Athens, I perceive that in all things you are very religious;
Acts 17:22
Again, the New King James Version translators expect you to believe that being “very religious” is a bad thing. Paul was admonishing the Athenians because of their multiple gods, even worshipping “THE UNKNOWN GOD” (vs. 23), therefore referring to them as “superstitious”.

1 Corinthians 1:21
King James Bible
For after that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe.
1Corinthians 1:21
New King James Version
For since, in the wisdom of God, the world through wisdom did not know God, it pleased God through the foolishness of the message preached to save those who believe.
1Corinthians 1:21
What is the New King James Version telling people? Should preachers be preaching “foolish” messages? The Bible has much to say about foolishness and it would never suggest anyone preach a foolish message.
The King James Bible also states in Ecclesiastes 12:10 “The preacher sought to find out acceptable words: and that which was written was upright, even words of truth.” Does that sound like a preacher preaching a “foolish message”?

Matthew 7:14
King James Bible
Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.
Matthew 7:14
New King James Version
Because narrow is the gate and difficult is the way which leads to life, and there are few who find it.
Matthew 7:14
“Narrow” and “difficult” do not mean the same thing, so which one is right? Jesus said in Matthew 11:30, “For my yoke is easy, and my burden is light.”

John 1:3
King James Bible
All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.
John 1:3
New King James Version
All things were made through Him, and without Him nothing was made that was made.
John 1:3
This is an attack on the deity of Jesus Christ. Either “All things were made by him…” or he was just a helper to God. Just as a city is destroyed by fire, it has to be rebuilt by men. Can you imagine anyone saying “the city was destroyed through fire, but plans are already in place for it to be rebuilt through men. It’s nonsense, and yet the translators of the New King James Version expect you to accept that “all things were made through Him”.

Jot&Tittle
  #108  
Old 02-28-2008, 11:20 PM
Jot&Tittle
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Default Word changes to the NKJV compared to the KJB

Testament vs. Covenant
King James Bible
For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.
Matthew 26:28
New King James Version
For this is My blood of the new covenant, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.
Matthew 26:28
Word definitions from Webster’s 1828 Edition:
Testament
A solemn authentic instrument in writing, by which a person declares his will as to the disposal of his estate and effects after his death. This is otherwise called a will. A testament, to be valid, must be made when the testator is of sound mind, and it must be subscribed, witnessed and published in such manner as the law prescribes.
Covenant
A mutual consent or agreement of two or more persons, to do or to forbear some act or thing; a contract; stipulation. A covenant is created by deed in writing, sealed and executed; or it may be implied in the contract.


Study vs. Diligent
King James Bible
Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.
2 Timothy 2:15
New King James Version
Be diligent to present yourself approved to God, a worker who does not need to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.
2 Timothy 2:15
Word definitions from Webster’s 1828 Edition:
Study
Literally, a setting of the mind or thoughts upon a subject; hence, application of mind of books, to arts or science, or to any subject, for the purpose of learning what is not before known.
Diligent
Steady in application to business; constant in effort or exertion to accomplish what is undertaken; assiduous; attentive; industrious; not idle or negligent; applied to persons.

Devil vs. Demon
King James Bible
The woman was a Greek, a Syrophenician by nation; and she besought him that he would cast forth the devil out of her daughter.
And he said unto her, For this saying go thy way; the devil is gone out of thy daughter.
Mark 7:26, 29
New King James Version
The woman was a Greek, a Syro-Phoenician by birth, and she kept asking Him to cast the demon out of her daughter.
Then He said to her, "For this saying go your way; the demon has gone out of your daughter."
Mark 7:26, 29
Word definitions from Webster’s 1828 Edition:
Devil
In Christian theology, an evil spirit or being; a fallen angel, expelled from heaven for rebellion against God; the chief of the apostate angels; the implacable enemy and tempter of the human race.
Demon
A spirit, or immaterial being, holding a middle place between men and the celestial deities of the Pagans. The ancients believed that there were good and evil demons, which had influence over the minds of men, and that these beings carried on an intercourse between men and gods, conveying the addresses of men to the gods, and divine benefits to men. Hence demons became the objects of worship. It was supposed also that human spirits, after their departure from the body became demons, and that the souls of virtuous men, if highly purified, were exalted from demons into gods. The demons of the New Testament were supposed to be spiritual beings which vexed and tormented men. And in general, the word, in modern use, signifies an evil spirit or genius, which influences the conduct or directs the fortunes of mankind.

Repent vs. Relent
King James Bible
For John came unto you in the way of righteousness, and ye believed him not: but the publicans and the harlots believed him: and ye, when ye had seen it, repented not afterward, that ye might believe him.
Matthew 21:32
New King James Version
For John came to you in the way of righteousness, and you did not believe him; but tax collectors and harlots believed him; and when you saw it, you did not afterward relent and believe him.
Matthew 21:32
Word definitions from Webster’s 1828 Edition:
Repent
In theology, to sorrow or be pained for sin, as a violation of God's holy law, a dishonor to his character and government, and the foulest ingratitude to a Being of infinite benevolence.
Relent
To slacken.

Servant vs. Slave
King James Bible
But now being made free from sin, and become servants to God, ye have your fruit unto holiness, and the end everlasting life.
Romans 6:22
For he that is called in the Lord, being a servant, is the Lord's freeman: likewise also he that is called, being free, is Christ's servant.
1 Corinthians 7:22
New King James Version
But now having been set free from sin, and having become slaves of God, you have your fruit to holiness, and the end, everlasting life.
Romans 6:22
For he who is called in the Lord while a slave is the Lord's freedman. Likewise he who is called while free is Christ's slave.
1 Corinthians 7:22
Word definitions from Webster’s 1828 Edition:
Servant
A person, male or female, that attends another for the purpose of performing menial offices for him, or who is employed by another for such offices or for other labor, and is subject to his command. The word is correlative to master. Servant differs from slave, as the servant's subjection to a master is voluntary, the slave's is not. Every slave is a servant, but every servant is not a slave.
Slave
A person who is wholly subject to the will of another; one who has no will of his own, but whose person and services are wholly under the control of another. In the early state of the world, and to this day among some barbarous nations, prisoners of war are considered and treated as slaves. The slaves of modern times are more generally purchased, like horses and oxen.
In Scripture, a slave; a bondman; one purchased for money, and who was compelled to serve till the year of jubilee; also, one purchased for a term of years.

Isaiah 14: 14 tells of Satan's ultimate counterfeit: ". . . I will BE LIKE the most High."

Jot&Tittle
  #109  
Old 02-29-2008, 12:06 AM
jerry
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jot&Tittle View Post
Not exactly! Consider these:

Deuteronomy 26:1 And it shall be when thou art come in vnto the land which the Lord giueth thee for an inheritance, and possessest it, and dwellest therein:
Deuteronomy 26:1 And it shall be, when thou art come in unto the land which the LORD thy God giveth thee for an inheritance, and possessest it, and dwellest therein;

Joshua 13:29 And Moses gaue inheritance vnto the halfe tribe of Manasseh: and this was the possession of the halfe tribe of Manasseh, by their families.
Joshua 13:29 And Moses gave inheritance unto the half tribe of Manasseh: and this was the possession of the half tribe of the children of Manasseh by their families.
You didn't specify, so I am assuming the first verse listed is the 1611. The easy solution is that there were printing/typeset errors that overlooked two words in each case - which were noticed and corrected in later printings. Not an error or change in the text of the King James, but in the editions that were printed. We see stuff like that happen all the time - even in our typing on message boards like these. Some people think faster than they can type and miss a word or too or type too fast and spell some words wrong. If I typed out a verse and accidently ommitted a word, the problem is with my typing of that verse - not with the verse itself.
  #110  
Old 03-01-2008, 10:17 PM
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Gal.3:16 Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified. kjv

Gal. 3:16 knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law but by faith in Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Christ Jesus, that we might be justified by faith in Christ and not by the works of the law; for by the works of the law no flesh shall be justified. nkjv

by changing these words we now give man [nkjv]the glory instead of God[kjv]
our belief or faith is not the cause to get eternal salvation it is the effect of God working in our heart, our justification is by Christ's faith . how can we justify ourself if our state is dead in tresspasses and sin. can a dead man do anything?
 

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