Bible Versions Questions and discussion about the Bible version issue.

 
 
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Old 03-14-2009, 04:06 PM
Bill Bill is offline
 
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Default Selectively Changing "Servant" to "Slave"

Reading the books of the New Testament from Romans through Revelation in the KJV and the NIV and noting where the word "servant" in the KJV has been replaced by the word "slave" in the NIV and where it has not been changed, it can be seen that the word servant has been left as servant where it would apply to religious authorities and changed where it would apply to a person under religious authority (laity).
The following verses are where the word servant would apply to lay people and has been changed to slave: Romans 6:16-22 (eight times); 1Corinthians 7:21-23 (four times) and 9:19; Galatians 4:1,7; Ephesians 6:5,6; Colossians 4:1; 1Timothy 6:1; Titus 2:9; Philemon verse 16; 1Peter 2:18.
The following verses are where the word servant would apply to a religious authority and has not been changed: Romans 1:1, 16:1; 2Corinthians 4:5, Philippians 1:1, 2:7; 2Timothy 2:24; 1Peter2:16; Hebrews 3:5; James 1:1; 2Peter 1:1; Jude verse 1; Revelation 1:1, 2:20, 7:3, 10:7, 11:18, 15:3, 19:2,5,
22:3,6.
There are more books of the Bible to be read for this type of word change. I think the word servant is used in the Bible over 860 times. There are some changed verses which I find ambiguous as to the positions of the people they describe and there are some unchanged verses such as Romans 14:4 which I think could apply to either authorities or laity, and 2Peter 2:19 where the word servant is correlated with bondage to sin and the change seems in line with the meaning of the verse. The translation changes are not total but extensive enough to show an intended patters. The verses with clear, unambiguous association with either religious authorities or laity are selectively changed according to the pattern.
The KJV uses the word bond, or bondage, as an equivalent to slave. Galatians 3:28 contrasts bond with free, as does Ephesians 6:8, Colossians 3:11, Revelation 19:18, and 1Corinthians 12:13. Hebrews 2:15, in agreement with Romans 8: 15-21 says that the fear of death causes bondage; a condition from which God delivers. Ephesians 6: 5-9 applies the word "master" to both a Christian with organizational authority and to God, which show that it indicates a voluntary arrangement. The KJV has the necessary terminology to describe the condition of slavery and does not apply it to a Christian life.

Last edited by Bill; 03-14-2009 at 04:08 PM. Reason: punctuation
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Old 03-17-2009, 11:41 AM
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BornAgainBibleBeliever514 BornAgainBibleBeliever514 is offline
 
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I remember that the straw which broke the camel's back and got me to leave the church I went to right after being saved (I was also baptized there), was when the notKJV (NKJV) called My Lord and Saviour a BONDSERVANT in Phl 2:7.

Also, 7 other times, writers of epistles are changed from being the willing servant to a bondservant in the NKJV.

The AV only uses this word once that I can find, clearly implying slavery:
Lev 25:39 And if thy brother that dwelleth by thee be waxen poor, and be sold unto thee; thou shalt not compel him to serve as a bondservant:

I do not serve my Lord because I must, or because I'm a slave, but rather because I want to out of gratitude.

I was already upset at the aformentioned church's policy of using the NKJV, and the lack of any decernment among the congregation, half of them didn't even bring their own Bibles. Why bother when there's a pew version there for you? It was enough to have had a few discussion with that pastor, he actually gave me a copy of White's book, the KJVO controversy, which was laughable.
But when one Sunday, his whole sermon was in Philipians 2, I couldn't take hearing my God called a slave any longer. I left.

Gal 4:31 So then, brethren, we are not children of the bondwoman, but of the free.

Ironically, that pastor still tries to point out errors in the KJB to me, he honestly thinks I have gone astray, into a cult
I still attend the Saturday morning men's Bible study group there, simply because I committed myself to that group and met some other Christian men there, and that church is close to my appartment. All the other pastor-parrots with their NKJV, NIV, CEV, etc just can't wait to get through the alloted time (We just finished the book of Revelation). I however am continually probing into the meat.
They chose to follow some booklet with questions in it designed for group study, and throughout the course, not only did the guide completely miss SO MANY amazing things to be found in the Book, it even implied some heretical ideas, like mid-trib, no rapture at all, works-based, etc. its sucked.
Perhaps I should just stop going to their Bible study group altogether, but that brings up something else:

The new KJO Bible-believing church I attend is doctrinally correct, however, the pastor there hasn't bothered to talk to me and even appears to not want my family there at all (small church, ~60 people).
He's old, harsh and elitist. Sigh, I guess finding a KJO church was almost too good to be true. My parents are much on guard towards him, but I just want to be included in the church family, yet they don't really seem to like 'outsiders' very much, even though I've been going there over a year.
There's a bunch of other variables, but the point is that the KJ correcting pastro was a better pastor to me in all other areas than the KJO pastor is now. Not to label them all, just my own experience so far.

I love straying off topic, eh?

Last edited by BornAgainBibleBeliever514; 03-17-2009 at 12:10 PM.
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Old 03-17-2009, 04:17 PM
Bill Bill is offline
 
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I like the name "not KJV" for the NKJV. I've heard the NIV called the "Nearly Inspired Version." The more I study the changes from the KJV I'm tempted to think of it as the "Never Inspired Version" or the "Newly Invented Version."
Concerning the pastors you mentioned, I think it is fairly natural for a person to be good at either truth or love but extremely difficult, requiring much "sanctification," for a person to be able to speak the truth in love with equal emphasis on both truth and love.
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Old 03-17-2009, 04:33 PM
Bill Bill is offline
 
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Default Nicolaitanes

In Revelation Chapter 2 verses 6 & 15 the deeds and doctrines of a group called the Nicolaitanes is identified as not only hated by God but also to be hatred by the church. Neither the deeds or doctrines to be hated are listed in the Bible as far as I know, but the meaning of the name tells the purpose of the Nicolaitanes. The name is composed of two syllables: Nico meaning "to conquer" and laitanes meaning "the laity." This meaning seems to me to be a good explanation for the way the NIV selectively changes the word servant to slave.
A relevant fact from the history of the use of the "Alexandrian" bibles from the time Constantine ordered their use is that when he legalized Christianity he made a law exempting the Christian religious authorities from taxes and gave the authority to tax the laity. Constantine seemed quite interested in setting up a religion of stooges he could manipulate.
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Old 03-18-2009, 12:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill View Post
I like the name "not KJV" for the NKJV. ......
Concerning the pastors you mentioned, I think it is fairly natural for a person to be good at either truth or love but extremely difficult, requiring much "sanctification," for a person to be able to speak the truth in love with equal emphasis on both truth and love.
Despite that Mobius we've all no doubt seen on the Nkjv, what got me calling the NOT King James was looking at the spine logo on some deacon's bible, which had gold lettering for the K.J.V., but the 'N' was a larger gold circle with a black 'N' inside it.

Its so true about the delicate balance between dealing with both truth and love.
Its like, the more truth you have to share, the harder it is to do it in love, especially in the perception of the hearer.

Gal 4:16 Am I therefore become your enemy, because I tell you the truth?

Eph 4:15 But speaking the truth in love, may grow up into him in all things, which is the head, even Christ:
 

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