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  #31  
Old 05-12-2008, 11:47 PM
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Paladin54:---Shaazaam-Someone actually responded to a post...

Yep. Don't go down any rabbit trails concerning the "R" word, or one of the Brit. posters can/will bring up that "R" thing in 1776.

The point is that many Christians have served their nation in uniform. When there has been a war alarm [call to arms] they have left the plow, picked-up their weapon and served to protect the country. {Which is exactly what The Lord commanded the Israelites to do!}

BTW-My newest Grandson is named "Jackson" for Stonewall's sake, after my Air Force son and his wife saw "God's and Generals".
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  #32  
Old 05-13-2008, 04:34 PM
Jeremy Jeremy is offline
 
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Speaking of War, were is the book and verses that describes going in and destroying everthing,including woman and children.
My dad had mentioned this,but could not remember where it was.

Turn the other cheek. What free country would exist if there weren't brave men and woman who serve in the military, fighting a war of idealogy,its like telling people its ok for them to fight,but christians are to stay sidelined?
I know many christians who proudly serve this country. We wouldn't have the freedom of speech or religion we enjoy today without them.
God bless our brothers and sisters in the military,let us not forget them!

What about Laws?
I Timothy 1 v8 But we know that the law is good, if a man use it lawfully; 9 Knowing this, that the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and for sinners, for unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers, 10 For whoremongers, for them that defile themselves with mankind, for menstealers, for liars, for perjured persons, and if there be any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine; 11 According to the glorious gospel of the blessed God, which was committed to my trust.

If there were no sin we wouldn't have laws or war.
People want to live in a free society, how can that happen when there are others out there ready to kill you for your beliefs, or to convert you to there way of thinking. Sound familiar? Islam! its happening to christians all around the world today.
Has WW3 not started?
The Rapture is close at hand.

Global Warming is real and its coming! Armegeddon! not what Al Gore thinks,those left behind
better get sun block 2500.
  #33  
Old 05-13-2008, 04:40 PM
Jeremy Jeremy is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Paladin54 View Post
From a Non-resistant point of iew, what do you think of the modern nation of Israel?
Does it have any right to exist? Can the nation (biblically) fight to defend themselves.?
Yes! Gods covenant with Isaac. They took out a Syrian Nuclear facility with little reaction from others.
American needs to remain Pro-Israel.
  #34  
Old 05-15-2008, 10:34 AM
Jeremy Jeremy is offline
 
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gwmNf...eature=related

Glenn Beck on Israels right to survive.
  #35  
Old 05-15-2008, 03:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PB1789 View Post
Paladin54:---Shaazaam-Someone actually responded to a post...

Yep. Don't go down any rabbit trails concerning the "R" word, or one of the Brit. posters can/will bring up that "R" thing in 1776.

The point is that many Christians have served their nation in uniform. When there has been a war alarm [call to arms] they have left the plow, picked-up their weapon and served to protect the country. {Which is exactly what The Lord commanded the Israelites to do!}.
Edited...

I am still laughing at the 'R' word, I am a Brit and personally i think the War Of Independance was legitimate... mind you if we had not worn the Red Coats you may not have seen us coming...

Ok back to Topic... as has been demonstrated elsewhere here, Israel of Old was commanded to defend herself etc.. Hitting the NT it is interesting that no where is Military life ruled out, John The Baptist did not say quit or become deserters.. Luke 3:14 Also Acts 10 Cornelius I do not read of him leaving the Army?? Then in History there is the Theban Legion all martyred under Diocletian's reign.. There is plenty of evidence down through history of Christians in the Military.

This subject cannot be taken in isolation as it throws up the concept of 'the just war' e.g. WW1, WW2, Korea, Vietnam, Gulf War 1 & 2, Afghanistan etc how many if any where 'Just Wars'??
To fight a just war requires personnel, we are citizens of our country as well as heavenly citizens Philippians 3:20 but if our country is threatened or attacked as christians do we stand idly by and let others make the sacrifice?? Is that loving our neighbour??

Where do we stop, do you not have Christian Law Enforcement Officers?? Personally if you see someone attacked would you intervene or become reluctant in case you had to exert violence??

Anyone who has been in the military/law enforcement and who have been in Combat will tell you, you do not take life lightly but it is at times a necessary evil. We live in a fallen world with fallen people as well as ourselves. We need to support our men and women in Green and Blue, and hold our Politicians to account so that War is the last resort and justified within the context of saving life liberty and justice...
Every Blessing
  #36  
Old 05-15-2008, 04:57 PM
toiwnz toiwnz is offline
 
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I'm a Marine and been in the Marine Corps now for 3 1/2 years. I've been praying about this very subject discussed in this forum. I'm torn between the two sides. I've heard evidence to support both sides but still I am torn. I don't know how many of the people that have posted comments so far ever served but let me try to give the view from a saved person serving in the Military that is torn between both sides.

Reasons to get out of the Military
-Immorality amongst it's members (sometimes I feel like Lot living in Sodom
every time I go to work).
-The teaching of killing (Almost everything I do is combat related. All of my
training is to prepare me for combat. I've even went to a month long
school to learn how to kill and defend better in order to teach others. My
job itself deals with the ammunition that goes on the jets.).

-The option to pick and choose is gone. If the government wants to fight a
battle that I don't agree with, then I don't have an option. I have to fight
or risk going to prison which would hurt my wife and child.

- The lack of biblical teaching (even the chapalans have to be politically
correct now. In this nations past, biblical teachings were apart of the
military)

Reasons to stay in the Military
-The fields are ready for harvest. There are so many lost that need to hear
the gospel either by word or seeing the christians in the military living it
through the lives. It's strange when a man doesn't go out with the guys to
get drunk and look for women. That is is a amazing witness for Christ.

- We help a lot of people whether is be through community services or relief
efforts. Being in a leadership position now, the Marines under me come to
me for help and advice and I use the scriptures to do this.

- It is a Job. Being a man with a wife and Kid, I must work

There are many more reasons that I have for both sides (such as swearing or taking oaths or providing for your family). This is something I must continually seek God on. I don't get out now until 2012 and at that I time I want to make sure I'm doing the Lord's will. When it comes to fighting I can say that I've been in for going on 4 years and never once been overseas. By no means is this mans doing. I now it was the Lord Keeping me. I'm not saying I don't want to go because if they sent me then I would go. Not with the intent to kill everything that moves but to protect the men under me and make sure they return safely. I appreciate all of the comments on here and they definetly given me something to think and pray about. I also thank you all for your work and finding the scriptures concerning this subject. Do remember that not every christian in the military is killing. We have many wonderful brothers and sisters in the military. Thanks again and sorry for the spelling mistakes (I guess I shouldn't went to college lol).
  #37  
Old 05-15-2008, 08:52 PM
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Chaplainles:---Very Good Post! You mentioned the Theban Legion. Did you see my post on page 3, with 2 links about St. Maurice of the Theban Legion?

BTW---Were you able to find that small Bible that you were looking for?

Oh, another BTW...as an American who has served, and is still on "the books" in Reserve status...as someone with mostly Brit blood in the veins and as a Christian, I've often asked myself what I would have done if I was alive in the 1770's in the "Colonies"---?? About 1/3 of the Colonists were "Tories", or Loyalists to the Crown. They thought that since The Lord God ordained the Monarch,,,then it is not right to fight against the "Crown".
  #38  
Old 05-15-2008, 11:28 PM
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toiwnz:---Hey there Marine! I'm a former 0331. One week after September 11th 2001, I called the Corps to help fight the moslem jihadists...(after waiting to see lines of young men outside every Recruiting Station in this land,,,and NOT seeing that-{as the Men did on December 8th 1941} ). The Corps had a special telephone line set up to handle all the Prior Service volunteers responding to the attack on our homeland. The Captain that spoke with me took down my info,,,then politely told me that I was too old to come back into the Corps--He was correct-- - my knees are not 20 years old anymore. So I joined the Army National Guard. A year and a half ago I was sent to a readiness processing station for about a week for Deployment. The Doctor said I had "shortness of breath", my left knee audibly "popped' in his presence during the leg-bend test, and my hearing isn't too good--(the 0331 MOS!) ---The above mentioned stuff is to let you know that I made myself available...and understand your concerns. "Cover and alignment, aye-aye sir."

I will remind you that you enlisted (you were not drafted) in a branch of the U.S. Military that is known for being warriors. I'm positive that there was at least one poster in the recruiters office that said things like "First to Fight--Join the U.S. Marines", or "We Don't Promise You a Rose Garden!" I'm assuming that you are either Aviation Ordnance or Logistics, so your chance of doing regular standard infantry 0300 tasks are very slim. If deployed you and your squad/platoon may pull "perimeter guard duty". All of this was explained to you when/before you signed the contract by the Recruiter. If you want a non-combatant job/MOS then you are in the wrong branch---Remember that every Marine is trained to qualify with and be able to use his Rifle.

The things you posted are true. Morality is a problem, but as someone who works in the civilian world, I can tell you; there is trash everywhere. We as Christians are called to be "Salt and Light"...preserving and illuminating. My son is Active Duty Air Force, and a Christian (and my Daughter-in-law) he just Re-enlisted while in a Hostile-Fire Zone--"Over There". He is an E-5 who will test soon for his E-6 stripe. True about many of the Chaplains, but what to do about that...? Leave,bail-out? Or,be Salt and Light? Start a Bible Study Group and/or find a good Bible trusting/Christ preaching Church near the Base...My son attended a good Baptist Church in the small town next door to his former AFB in Missouri. Seek and Ye shall find!

Here is a section of Scripture that is very germaine to this Thread and I hope you will read it and find encouragement. Have you ever heard of King David and his mighty men, or David's Men of Valor? Please look at 2 Sam. 23:8-39 and also 1st Chronicles chapter 11 thru chapter 12 verse 18. These men were warriors that served The Lord! Carry on Marine, out.
  #39  
Old 05-19-2008, 01:28 AM
fundy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stephanos View Post
I guess (without looking to deeply into that verse) one would truly be cursed if he kept back his sword from blood when the Lord clearly commanded him to not do so.

I know there are verses in the bible that speak of times the Lord called the people of Israel to go to war against the enemies of their nation, however I cannot in good faith seek out Scriptures that support my being zealous of a particular nation that I live in. I do not believe the nation I live has good intentions, despite the fact that God uses this nation. What I do believe is that my Master doesn't wish that I resist evil (this includes being a pacifist, which is resistance. We, the Anabaptists, are non-violent and non-resistant). I just think that the Masters commandments in regards to this are clear. Perhaps I'm in error in this, but my spirit does not attest to this.

Much Love in Christ,
Stephen
The Jehovas Witness cult also reject the idea of patriotism ( national zealouness), saluting the flag, joining their countries armed forces, as well as promoting a non-violent and a non-resistance ideology.

Where do you stand on the doctrines if Christs' diety and identity, salvation by grace through faith, eternal security and the final authority of Gods Word?

fundy
  #40  
Old 05-19-2008, 11:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PB1789 View Post
Chaplainles:---Very Good Post! You mentioned the Theban Legion. Did you see my post on page 3, with 2 links about St. Maurice of the Theban Legion?
BTW---Were you able to find that small Bible that you were looking for?
Oh, another BTW...as an American who has served, and is still on "the books" in Reserve status...as someone with mostly Brit blood in the veins and as a Christian, I've often asked myself what I would have done if I was alive in the 1770's in the "Colonies"---?? About 1/3 of the Colonists were "Tories", or Loyalists to the Crown. They thought that since The Lord God ordained the Monarch,,,then it is not right to fight against the "Crown".
Thanks PB1789 for the comments, yes I did see your Post. When I get time I want to scope out the Theban Legion more. Re: 1776 and all that big subject the 'knock on' effect to Britain is quite interesting as we went to War with our ahem.. European neighbours... But I never have believed in the 'Divine Right' of the Monarchy as such. But that brings up the English Civil War....

Ok, towinz, first off Bro. I am praying for you, I see from your post that you did not say if you were saved before you joined up? Nevertheless I have a saying, 'Bloom Where Your Planted'.
I see you have a lot of inroads into reaching your comrades with the Gospel, hey Bro. your a Marine so you must be made of the right stuff, so whats a little hardship if you can reach others???
If you leave WHO is going to reach those you leave behind? You need to have a mega close walk with the Lord though to see you through. IMHO at the moment you have job security (thats for your family) and you are where God wants you to be. 4 Years in and no overseas deployment whoooa... I can see Gods hand in that.
I know what you mean about Chaplains in the Military, the same happens over here, but Bro. You got the Book, you got to knees... get em working...
You take care brother in prayer for you... Semper Fi......
Every Blessing....
 

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