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Old 11-01-2008, 07:51 AM
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Default 7 Reasons Why Barack Obama is NOT a Christian

I have just viewed these on you-tube, after receiving an email from the The Christian Anti-Defamation Commission. (link not provided, google is your freind)

I am interested in the views of my Brothers and Sisters in Christ who face the real task of actually having to cast their vote next week.
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Old 11-01-2008, 10:54 AM
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Originally Posted by Gord View Post
I have just viewed these on you-tube, after receiving an email from the The Christian Anti-Defamation Commission. (link not provided, google is your freind)

I am interested in the views of my Brothers and Sisters in Christ who face the real task of actually having to cast their vote next week.
At first, I had planned on voting for John McCain, simply to try to keep Obama out of office. However, after seeing arguments from friends online, and talking to my dad and reading some information he had, and I realized that voting against my conscience would display a lack of faith in God. I believe that God is powerful enough to take care of the situation, regardless of who gets elected. Also I think that a little persecution is just what the church might need to get their collective butt in gear to do something for Christ.

I'm voting for Chuck Baldwin this year. I know he won't get elected, but I'm speaking out for what is right. If enough people get behind him, it might help wake people up to the fact that we're tired of the two-party system that we have, and we want fairness and equal opportunity for other political parties.
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Old 11-01-2008, 01:27 PM
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Originally Posted by MC1171611
At first, I had planned on voting for John McCain, simply to try to keep Obama out of office. However, after seeing arguments from friends online, and talking to my dad and reading some information he had, and I realized that voting against my conscience would display a lack of faith in God. I believe that God is powerful enough to take care of the situation, regardless of who gets elected. Also I think that a little persecution is just what the church might need to get their collective butt in gear to do something for Christ.

I'm voting for Chuck Baldwin this year. I know he won't get elected, but I'm speaking out for what is right. If enough people get behind him, it might help wake people up to the fact that we're tired of the two-party system that we have, and we want fairness and equal opportunity for other political parties.
I undertstand your feelings, brother; and, earlier in the year, I vowed that I'd never support McCain. I still don't, but I've changed my mind somewhat. Please hear me out.

Like any good Baptist preacher, I have three points:

1. Barak Obama is the most dangerous Presidential candidate in my lifetime. He's worse than Carter, Mondale, Dukakis, Gore, and Kerry combined. Each of those men, perhaps with the exception of Gore and Kerry, loved America, and thought that their stupid liberal ideas would be good for the country. Gore and Kerry were motivated by sheer ambition, the lust for power; but neither of them were as inexperienced as Obama. I honestly believe that Obama hates this country, and the ideals on which it was based; I am very disappointed that an honest liberal like Joe Biden agreed to share the ticket with him. (The only appropriate running-mate for Obama would probably be Al Sharpton or Charles Manson.) Furthermore, and may God forgive me if I'm judging unrighteously, I believe Obama to be a genuinely evil man. I would cut off my right hand before I'd vote for him: I'm not joking. If Obama is elected, I guarantee that we'll all be yearning for the "good old days" of Bill Clinton. Because Obama is a thousand times worse.

2. John McCain is a liberal in sheep's clothing. His Senate voting record, on most issues, is erratic and inconsistent: that's why they call him a "maverick." The most recent example was his vote, just last week, for the horrible, bloated "bailout" that Obama and Hillary also supported. Yes, his resistance to his torturers in Vietnam was heroic. Yes, he has a good voting record on abortion. But he is an angry, temperamental man, and I don't know how cool-headed he'd be in a crisis. He is also a warmonger: with McCain, war is always the first option, not the last. I'm not a pacifist, and I believe that when it's necessary to go to war, we should smash the enemy with everything we have (as we should have done in Korea and Vietnam). But I'm not a supporter of every war. I believe that McCain would protect us from our enemies, which Obama would not, and that's a big plus; but I fear he'd also get involved in unnecessary wars, killing thousands more of our young people, and that's a big minus. Here's a joke: asked about the war in Iraq, Obama says, "It's a bad war, and we should get out." Barr/Baldwin/Paul say, "It's a questionable war, but we must win it." McCain says, "It's the only war we've got, and we should be thankful for it!"

3. So I can't support either candidate, and I believe that a vote for somebody like Bob Barr or Chuck Baldwin, while temporarily satisfying, is a wasted vote - - - practically speaking, it's a vote for Obama. It might make you feel good, but it'll take a vote away from the only person who can stop Obama.

However, McCain has done one thing right: he's chosen an excellent running-mate. Sarah Palin, at the moment, really doesn't have the experience to be President. But she's been a Chief Executive: a mayor and a Governor, which neither Obama nor McCain have been. And, as Vice-President, she would learn the mechanics of Washington and the Federal government, and she'd have plenty of exposure to foreign leaders. The Vice-President also sits on the National Security Council, so she'd be briefed on intelligence and international problems right along with the President. If McCain died in office, she would be ready. And, from everything I've read, she's a quick learner.

I think it's unlikely that, if elected, McCain will run for re-election. He'll simply be too old. (That didn't stop Reagan, but McCain is no Reagan. Reagan was in excellent health; McCain is not.) So, in 2012, Palin, as sitting Vice-President, will be the automatic front-runner for the Republican nomination. And she'll be young enough to make the most of it: she'll only be 48 years old, with four years as Veep under her belt.

If McCain does not win, in 2012 Palin will be a very weak candidate (like John Edwards was this year), and the front-runner will probably be Mitt Romney. Which probably means that Obama would be re-elected; but even if he lost .... who wants Romney?

During the next four years, in my very humble opinion, we're going to be stuck with a poor, or very bad, President.

So, if anyone asked my opinion, I would advise that they grit their teeth, swallow their misgivings, and vote for Sarah Palin for Vice-President, even if that means four years of McCain. Voting for Palin is an investment in the future.

I know that some of the brethren have problems with the idea of a female President. I don't think it's God's ideal, either. But please consider the so-called men who are running, and who will be running. Palin looks awfully good when compared to them. (And, from all indications, she's a saved woman. If you asked Obama or Biden or McCain, "Is Jesus Christ the only way to Heaven?" they'd probably give you some doubletalk about "many ways to God." If you asked Palin the same question, she'd probably say something like "You betcha! He sure is!") And remember, if you're old enough, Margaret Thatcher: when all the male politicians in England were liberals and fruitbooties, she stepped up to the plate and said, "I'm with Reagan. Let's stop the Communists once and for all." And she was Reagan's greatest partner.

If Bob Barr or Chuck Baldwin or Ron Paul runs in 2012, you can support 'em then; but, in voting for Palin-McCain, you will have done your part to keep Obama out of the White House.

If you're still undecided, think of this: the Bush-Cheney administration has invented a theory of government called the "unitary executive." Basically, it's the idea that the President should have lots more power, and the Congress should have less. So now we've got warrantless searches, and wiretaps, and other such things.

Whether Bush has abused those powers is a subject for debate. But just think: what would Obama do with so much power? I mean, apart from unlimited partial-birth abortions at government expense?

If you have any witnessing to do, you'd better do it now. Because, if Obama wins, there'll be "Hate Crimes" legislation for sure. (No, he won't wait for legislation; he'll just issue an Executive Order.) Criticize homosexuality or Islam, and you're committing a "hate crime." Tell somebody that their religion can't save them, and you're committing a "hate crime." And, if you talk to your grandmother or your grandchild on the phone, and say something about Islam or homosexuality, don't expect any "privacy:" remember those wiretaps? Bush, supposedly, used them against terrorists. Obama will use them against us.

No, I'm not scared of Obama. I know that God is in control, and if Obama wins, it's because God allowed it. But I also know that America has become a Christ-rejecting, Bible-hating cesspool, and God owes America nothing.
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Old 11-01-2008, 02:18 PM
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"Always vote for principle, though you may vote alone, and you may cherish the sweetest reflection that your vote is never lost." -- John Quincy Adams

And think, is Sarah Palin truly Biblically qualified to be a leader? I think she'd be the best thing that happened to American politics in years, but that still doesn't make it right.
  #5  
Old 11-01-2008, 02:25 PM
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Originally Posted by MC1171611 View Post
"Always vote for principle, though you may vote alone, and you may cherish the sweetest reflection that your vote is never lost." -- John Quincy Adams

And think, is Sarah Palin truly Biblically qualified to be a leader? I think she'd be the best thing that happened to American politics in years, but that still doesn't make it right.
I think a vote for McCain/Palin is a vote for principle. The principle is this: Communists shouldn't be President!

But, as I've said, Palin's future as a candidate will be largely affected by this election. If she loses, she's "damaged goods;" if she wins, she's the logical frontrunner next time.

I'd happily trade four years of McCain for a chance at an American (very American!) version of Margaret Thatcher in the future!
  #6  
Old 11-01-2008, 04:38 PM
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"Always vote for principle, though you may vote alone, and you may cherish the sweetest reflection that your vote is never lost." -- John Quincy Adams
I'm voting on the principle that Obama is the most unqualified and dangerous person to ever get close to the job. Even if McCain wins and turns out to be worse than I expect, I will still be glad to be able to tell my son that I voted against Obama in 2008.

IMHO, a third-party vote is not a vote for my principles; it is a vote that helps Obama win. That's simply the reality of our system. Like it or not, our system is two-party, and me voting for a third-party is not going to change that one bit. I am not going to feel better about myself by effectively removing myself from the process by casting a vote for Barr or Baldwin.

God has put me in a country that gives me the civic responsibility to help select its leadership. I'm just engaging in that responsibility in the best way that I can to make things as best as possible for my family. No matter how you cut it, there is only the choice between McCain and Obama. And no matter how you cut it, Obama would be far worse for my family and loved ones than McCain.

But there is no judgment against someone who disagrees. Our system of government allows us to choose whom we want to cast a vote for. This isn't a Biblical right in any way -- it's a right we have because of the country God put us in. Use it according to your own concience.

As others have said, our true duty is to pray for our leaders, and I'll add:
Romans 12:18 If it be possible, as much as lieth in you, live peaceably with all men.
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Old 11-01-2008, 07:01 PM
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Brandon, I love you beyond words, and your position here is entirely just. However, there is one reason for a third-party vote that I feel is acceptable. It is that a message must be sent to the only major party of choice for Christians, the Republican Party, that we must not be taken for granted. The presidency is only one part of the program. The congress is crucial to every decision, especially the judicial appointments.

Your quote of Adams speaks as much for me not voting for McCain because I don't trust him as it does you voting for him as a vote against Obama. And, yes, I feel very alone with my vote, but I also feel very much at peace with it.
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Old 11-01-2008, 10:08 PM
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I admire the personal passion in your political beliefs, Canadian's are generally passive and willing to be led astray, unwilling to 'fight back' on simple things like fuel prices, and way too liberal for thier own good.
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Old 11-01-2008, 10:09 PM
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Earlier this year, I felt that I should not vote for either candidate, and would abstain or vote for a third party.

In the last two months, I have changed my perspective and decided that there was enough positive information about the McCain/Palin ticket for me to vote for them, with a clean conscience. So, I did.

But each of us needs to do as the Lord leads. He is in control, but that doesn't give us an 'out' to do what we wish, but what we believe He wills.
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Old 11-02-2008, 08:48 AM
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Your quote of Adams speaks as much for me not voting for McCain because I don't trust him as it does you voting for him as a vote against Obama. And, yes, I feel very alone with my vote, but I also feel very much at peace with it.
Just to be clear, the quote was made by MC. I quoted him quoting it.

I understand what you mean about the party not taking our votes for granted. It's certainly a reasonable point, and unless Florida comes down to one vote, I won't hold it against you.
 

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