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Old 03-24-2009, 08:41 PM
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Default Dr. Greg Estep's Daniel's 70 Weeks

I recently came across a truly amazing sermon set by Dr. Greg Estep, who is a KJO Dispensationalist, about Daniel's 70 weeks and there seems to be a revelation discussed in there that I'd like to start a discussion on.

It covers the 70 weeks, end-times prophecy and the period of the tribulation with a rare viewpoint: That the 70'th week started already, and then got paused for the church age, to resume after the rapture and continue 6.38 years, instead of the commonly preached full 7 years. This seems to explain all the apostolic miracles, the cessation of the sign gifts, parts of the plan for Israel, and sheds light on more than a few false doctrines derived from falsely dividing the Word of Truth.
It also draws some correlations between the Jewish feasts, and the time of the rapture, among many other great expositions.

Frankly, I'm quite blown away with the sermons, and I've been listening to them over and over, and I'd like to get some more input on the things he presents from other solid Bible believers.

Link to Sermon Audio

I know its six hours to listen to them all, but I can pretty much guarantee that you won't regret it, and his delivery is much like Gipp's, so he's almost fun to listen to.
If there are errors, I'd like to see them pointed out, but if this guy is bang-on, then it could be of much benefit to share this incredible teaching. I'm not saying this teaching is perfect, but my discernment is giving me a bright green light on this one, and I'd like to know if its wrong before adopting it.

It will definately be food for thought for any workman who seeks to rightly divide.
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Old 03-25-2009, 07:06 AM
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I'll listen to them throughout the day, but I don't think it will be new to me. It seems to be the same opinion I hold. Its not new or rare, only because of today's pre-trib doctrine is it not taught much anymore, other than by a few.

I posted my view a while back elsewhere, and someone said that was never heard of the 70Th week being stopped, and restarted again. I told them, they had just not been listening.

It all hinges around a disputed interpretation of Daniel 9:26-27. Which was all fulfilled by Christ' first advent, and later the Roman army. Including the Abomination of Desolation. Now unless you want to call this a dualistic prophesy, and there is no evidence of it. As after this you will fine no mention, of more than 3-1/2 years in the Scripture. That's all that remains 3-1/2 years.

If you read all the prophesies in the Old Testament, about the day of the Lord, this does not leave the Church (body) going through tribulation. But as Paul stated the Son of Perdition must be revealed, before the coming Day of the Lord. And the Gathering (rapture) of the Church; begins that Day. So it is not pre-tribulation, but pre-wrath.
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Old 03-25-2009, 09:31 AM
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Hi Samuel, thanks for venturing to listen to the sermon and giving me your thoughts.

Quote:
Its not new or rare, only because of today's pre-trib doctrine is it not taught much anymore, other than by a few.
Perhaps I didn't explain it accurately, but it sounds like you are thinking of a mid-trib rapture, at the abomination of desolation, but I could be misreading you.

What I understand Estep to be demonstrating is that something like ~220 days elapsed into the 70th week (Calvary to Acts) , then stopped when the gospel went to the Gentiles, and there are still 6.38 years to go, once the stopwatch starts again when the fullness of the Gentiles be come in, also when the rapture hits.

This would give ~2.88 years of tribulation left, then the abomination of desolation, then the 3.5 years of wrath, then the second coming.
As Estep points out, the Jews already made their covenant with the antichrist, or at least a type of him when they said:

"Jhn 19:15 But they cried out, Away with him, away with him, crucify him. Pilate saith unto them, Shall I crucify your King? The chief priests answered, We have no king but Caesar."

Just some thoughts on it, would like some more discussion. Not looking to argue with anyone or prove this point, just to find out if it makes sense to others too.
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Old 03-25-2009, 09:38 AM
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I listened to the first hour, and will later listen to the rest. At this point, I don't think he is presenting it the way I had in mind.

I need to listen to some more, and then decide. But as of right now, this seems to be another angle, which I cannot say I have heard.
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Old 03-25-2009, 11:55 AM
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Its quite a good listen, and the first hour doesn't do the whole thing justice.
At one point he sort of breaks down and chuckles that its hard to teach the whole Bible in one sermon. Its like he's trying to pour a lake through a handheld funnel!
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Old 04-01-2009, 01:21 PM
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Nobody else interested ?

I might be the only guy who listens to preaching on my computer as a complete replacement for TV, movies, music and video games, hence I listen to preaching pretty much everyday.

This was the most revolutionary sermon I'd heard in a long time, thought others might enjoy too.

I just grabbed all 314 sermons by Dr. David Peacock, who is KJO, and seems really good.
Any comments on him?
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Old 04-01-2009, 06:09 PM
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Default Re: " Dr. Greg Estep's Daniel's 70 Weeks"

Quote:
Originally Posted by BornAgainBibleBeliever514 View Post
"Nobody else interested ?

I might be the only guy who listens to preaching on my computer as a complete replacement for TV, movies, music and video games, hence I listen to preaching pretty much everyday.

This was the most revolutionary sermon I'd heard in a long time, thought others might enjoy too.

I just grabbed all 314 sermons by Dr. David Peacock, who is KJO, and seems really good.
Any comments on him?
"
Aloha brother,

I'm not into recommending men, especially preachers that seem to have "new angle" on Bible doctrine. Ever since you mentioned Gregg Estepp, I have been biting my tongue (to the point where it is nearly bleeding ).

There are some of us on this Forum that don't have a very high opinion of Gregg Estepp (and for very "sound Scriptural reasons"). If you want to know why, you can check out this Link:

http://www.freewebs.com/thywordis/DO...20Comments.htm
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Old 04-01-2009, 08:23 PM
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George I was quite shocked after only three paragraphs into your link. his salvation statement would have kept me from hearing this man any further.

How little does his teaching on submission have in resemblance to that which I shared in Doctrines of Christian living

Last edited by chette777; 04-01-2009 at 08:36 PM.
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Old 04-02-2009, 06:46 AM
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I was waiting to see how this went before posting. I did listen to the complete series, and found several points I could not agree on.

But this was not my biggest problem, his complete arrogance, and overwhelming attitude, that you are too dumb to know anything I know it all, was a BIG turnoff for this man to me.

I recorded it for the purpose of displaying to others, that this is not the way we should teach the Bible.
  #10  
Old 04-02-2009, 07:49 AM
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Hi guys!

I'm glad people are responding to my sincere question about that sermon. Please remember, I was asking for people's opinions on it, not promoting the man per se. I don't know much about him, or anything else he taught, other than finding the Charity Baptist website, which seemed ok at first look.

I started reading that article commenting his submission teaching et al, and I fully agree, according to the article, it looks bad.
I re-iterate: in no way was I promoting Estep to you guys as being the gospel truth embodied in a teacher, I wanted to talk about the Daniel's 70th week (for lack of a better word) hypothesis. About how it started right after the resurection of Jesus Christ, but then got paused at Stephen's stoning / Paul's conversion, until the fullness of the Gentiles be come in (rapture).

Oh, if its true his salvation doctrine is way off, then I am ashamed to have even brought it up at all, for it reflects badly on me, and could lead people astray, however in the particular sermon I was refering to, I didn't hear anything about salvation nor submission, so I wasn't aware...yet. The focus was on Daniels' 70th.

The "angle" I refered to was the pausing of Daniel's 70th week, leaving 6.38 years of tribulation to come after the rapture instead of the commonly taught full 7 yrs.
THAT's what I was seeking to discuss, because it seems like a nail in the coffin for alot of the signs and wonders heresies out there; healers, unknown tongues, prophets, etc.

I'll continue to read that long article on his other teachings throughout my work day, and I'll post again once I'm done (I get interrupted by my job duties).
I am NOT advocating his submission doctrine, but I did note that saying a word isn't found in the Bible makes a doctrine false, is a weak argument. Trinity? Rapture? I'm not saying his doctrine is correct, just pointing out that's a weak thing to say. The other points in your article on the submission thing are valid.. got to read the rest.


Thank you brothers, for responding, and please remember, I wasn't advocating the man per se, just the concept that the 70th week got paused.

Please continue to let me know what else was you all think about that "hypothesis", and Samuel, since apparently your the only one who listened to it so far, what else did you notice that you couldn't agree with?
I do agree he is a bit arrogant, but plenty of other, correct preachers are even more so (A certain favorite name probably pops into one's mind right about now )

Thanks once again, I'm only seeking corroborating or disproving evidence for the 70th week theory.
 

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