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Old 03-23-2009, 09:08 AM
RonB RonB is offline
 
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Default Sabbath observance

Hello folks, new to this forum but not the Bible and I know I can find an answer to my question which at 66, has really been on my mind, why?

Can someone justify through Scripture (not through fallen man) for not observing the Sabbath on the seventh day? I don't find it, I have found lots of Scripture twisting going on but I haven't found any true justification. This is serious business since it is in the Commandments. Ignorance may be one thing, but willful disobedience is not acceptable.

So now, if in fact this Commandment should be observed (since it is, after all, a Commandment), then how? I'm really searching here so let us reason together.


Blessings to all,
Ron
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  #2  
Old 03-23-2009, 09:44 AM
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Diligent Diligent is offline
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Originally Posted by RonB View Post
Hello folks, new to this forum but not the Bible and I know I can find an answer to my question which at 66, has really been on my mind, why?

Can someone justify through Scripture (not through fallen man) for not observing the Sabbath on the seventh day? I don't find it, I have found lots of Scripture twisting going on but I haven't found any true justification. This is serious business since it is in the Commandments. Ignorance may be one thing, but willful disobedience is not acceptable.

So now, if in fact this Commandment should be observed (since it is, after all, a Commandment), then how? I'm really searching here so let us reason together.
You say this is a question on your mind, but it sure sounds like you've already made up your mind about it.
Exodus 31:12-18 And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying, Speak thou also unto the children of Israel, saying, Verily my sabbaths ye shall keep: for it is a sign between me and you throughout your generations; that ye may know that I am the LORD that doth sanctify you. Ye shall keep the sabbath therefore; for it is holy unto you: every one that defileth it shall surely be put to death: for whosoever doeth any work therein, that soul shall be cut off from among his people. Six days may work be done; but in the seventh is the sabbath of rest, holy to the LORD: whosoever doeth any work in the sabbath day, he shall surely be put to death. Wherefore the children of Israel shall keep the sabbath, to observe the sabbath throughout their generations, for a perpetual covenant. It is a sign between me and the children of Israel for ever: for in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, and on the seventh day he rested, and was refreshed. And he gave unto Moses, when he had made an end of communing with him upon mount Sinai, two tables of testimony, tables of stone, written with the finger of God.
1. Are you part of Israel?
2. Would you put your children to death for not obeying the Sabbath?
3. Have you ever read Colossians chapter 2 or Romans chapter 14?
Colossians 2:16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:


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Old 03-23-2009, 10:10 AM
RonB RonB is offline
 
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No Brandon, don't be so quick to get personal, I'm ASKING for some Scripture here, okay? Some sound reasoning, some calm reasoning, some DISCOURSE, I'm not taking any position but this has certainly been on my mind and don't think this issue hasn't been taken up by other scholars and is coming back. Not so much in the legalistic sense either but as one of the commandments to be observed so if you don't mind take a breath.
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Old 03-23-2009, 11:03 AM
Bro. Parrish
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RonB, welcome to the forum!

Christians do not keep the sabbath because Christians are not under the law!
Christians are not law keepers, and the law is not a "salad bar" from which we can pick and choose what we like! If we tried to keep part of the law we would have to keep ALL of it, law keepers are UNDER A CURSE as we read here (caps mine):

"For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in ALL THINGS which are written in the book of the law to do them. But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, it is evident: for, The just shall live by faith. And the law is not of faith: but, The man that doeth them shall live in them. Christ hath redeemed us from the CURSE of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree: That the blessing of Abraham might come on the Gentiles through Jesus Christ; that we might receive the promise of the Spirit THROUGH FAITH." --Gal 3:10-14

RonB, the law is a schoolmaster designed to drive men to Christ, when we come to Christ, God writes his law in our hearts...

"Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be JUSTIFIED BY FAITH. But after that faith is come, we are NO LONGER under a schoolmaster."--Gal. 3:24-25

Here is a quick link to Galations chapter 3 so you can read it and see the entire context, ask God to show you the truth from His Word, hope this helps:
http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/...203;&version=9

Last edited by Bro. Parrish; 03-23-2009 at 11:14 AM.
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Old 03-23-2009, 01:12 PM
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Diligent Diligent is offline
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Originally Posted by RonB View Post
No Brandon, don't be so quick to get personal, I'm ASKING for some Scripture here, okay? Some sound reasoning, some calm reasoning, some DISCOURSE, I'm not taking any position but this has certainly been on my mind and don't think this issue hasn't been taken up by other scholars and is coming back. Not so much in the legalistic sense either but as one of the commandments to be observed so if you don't mind take a breath.
I gave you Scripture. Consider the verses I quoted, and the other passages I referenced. We are not under the law.

Your initial post does not read at all like a sincere question. It reads as though you want people to justify themselves to you. We have been down this road a dozen times on the forum -- someone comes in, pretends to ask a sincere question, but their whole point is to defend a hobbyhorse issue. Your very first post preemptively accuses people who respond to it of being "scripture twisters."

I would be happy to be proved wrong about the reason for your post. What are your thoughts on the verses I showed you that prove the Sabbath is for Israel, and that we are not to be concerned with what holy days each other keeps?
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Old 03-23-2009, 02:03 PM
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Luke Luke is offline
 
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A more reasonable question would be

"What Biblical evidence is there for observing ANY Sabbath day, whether the sixth or seventh day, or any other holyday, by the New Testament Christian".
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Old 03-23-2009, 02:42 PM
RonB RonB is offline
 
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There Luke, you have it, a better formulated question and thank you Bro Parrish for a reasoned and calm reply. I didn't come on this forum to be flamed, my question is sincere, I have no guile. I tried various searches because I knew beyond a doubt that this subject must have been discussed many times on this forum but I wasn't able to come up with anything.

Diligent, you need to be more restrained on the trigger my friend with that sort of jugular approach you may run off a truth seeker that is having difficulties. I've been through much so I have a thick skin but I appreciate CIVIL DISCOURSE.

Thank you,
Ron
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Old 03-23-2009, 02:51 PM
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Kiwi Christian Kiwi Christian is offline
 
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Welcome to these forums Ron, may God bless your time here!

I believe Bro. Diligent quoted some very relevant scriptures to your question in post #2, and I would like to hear what you think about them?
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Old 03-23-2009, 06:32 PM
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chette777 chette777 is offline
 
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RonB,

consider these scriptures ask which commandments are missing from the OT Ten commandments given to Israel. in the following verse.

Romans 13:9 For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet; and if [there be] any other commandment, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

you notice Paul only mentions certain commandments in regard to the Body of Christ. and he doesn't mention the sabbath at all.

Romans 14:5 One man esteemeth one day above another: another esteemeth every day [alike]. Let every man be fully persuaded in his own mind.

Paul doesn't' even advocate a Sabbath day for the Body of Christ but lets that stand by their own conscience as to what day they consider holy.

Col 2:16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath [days]:

Now if a man wants to observe a Sabbath (Saturday) then let him do so but he is not to judge another who does not observe the Sabbath and vise versa. Some people out their teach that if you don't worship on the Sabbath your not saved. even as far as to say if you worship on Sunday you have the mark of the beast. Their Problem is they are judging others and Paul says let them not do so

Be at peace brother RonB and let your heart tell you what day to observe. I personally worship everyday. Now concerning physical rest. you need one day of rest a week. this is a scientifically proven fact. you can work 16 hour days for 6 days, which is exhausting) but if you physically rest one day in 7 you can fully physically recharge.

one last verse for you to consider it is who is the law (ten commandments) for?

Mal 4:4 Remember ye the law of Moses my servant, which I commanded unto him in Horeb for all Israel, with the statutes and judgments.

the law is given to Israel not to Gentiles or the church age saints today.

Read also Acts 15. the Jewish Apostles state that not even their fathers could keep the Law so why should they burden the Gentile to do so? And they agreed not to lay the burden of the law on Gentiles but suggested they refrain from 4 things fornication, strangled animals, pollutions of Idols and from consuming or shedding blood.

I hope that helps you to see under the New Testament of our Lord Jesus Christ the body of Christ which is made up largely by Gentiles is under no requirement to keep the law of Exodus 20 given to the Jews except where it agrees with Paul's teaching.

Last edited by chette777; 03-23-2009 at 06:39 PM.
  #10  
Old 03-23-2009, 07:19 PM
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Originally Posted by RonB View Post
Diligent, you need to be more restrained on the trigger my friend with that sort of jugular approach you may run off a truth seeker that is having difficulties. I've been through much so I have a thick skin but I appreciate CIVIL DISCOURSE.
I'm more than happy to drop this, but since you keep trying to admonish me, allow me to demonstrate why I did not regard your original post as a sincere question by underlining parts of your initial post:

Quote:
Can someone justify through Scripture (not through fallen man) for not observing the Sabbath on the seventh day? I don't find it, I have found lots of Scripture twisting going on but I haven't found any true justification. This is serious business since it is in the Commandments. Ignorance may be one thing, but willful disobedience is not acceptable.

So now, if in fact this Commandment should be observed (since it is, after all, a Commandment), then how? I'm really searching here so let us reason together.
Your question was full of things you have already determined are true (ie, "This IS serious, since IT IS, willful disobedience." Add to that the implication that people who do not observe the Sabbath are "scripture twisting" and it's hard to imagine what exactly the "question" is -- it reads like a demand to defend.

And you've gone several posts now without commenting on all the scripture that has been provided -- are we here to reason amongst ourselves? What say you?

Now, if I've totally misjudged your initial post, I will gladly say so right here in public after you deal with the Scriptures that have been presented. But I can not help it -- I've been at this too long not to get suspicious when I see posts that look like yours. It sounds just like someone who is hung up on Saturdays trying to stir up a fight over the Sabbath. If you aren't claiming to observe the Sabbath, then good -- otherwise, please provide the Scripture you use to back up your implication that not observing the Sabbath is willful disobedience.
 

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