[PB1789]

Just-A-Thought:--- I must get to bed soon (too often I try and help/fix/inform folks on the internet and the clock keeps on ticking...).

Please look at the front page of this website. There are several things to read with information about versions and verses and things to be careful about.

The reason that I included the RSV [Revised Standard Version] in my post above is the horrid way they mutilated Isa. 7:14. It should read "Virgin", but they changed it to read "young woman". That is a prophetical verse about the birth of Our Lord Jesus Christ. If a Virgin gets pregnant...That is a miracle. If a young woman gets pregnant...well, that happens every day around the planet. What the RSV did was diminish the "special" or "extraordinary" aspect of what happened with Mary, Joseph, and Bethlehem. The RSV was funded/sponsored by The National Council of Churches. They are an ecumenical umbrella group. Fogs my mind how people that claim to be Christians would fund/print such stuff.

They now have the NRSV which has gone down the gender-bender road.

As to the NIV--- This is one of the worst ones because it to came about by some church folks in the U.S. that got together and decided that the youngsters in their churches didn't understand the Bible ,,,soooo, they wanted to translate/print one with several folks of good intentions (Evangelical type Christians.) , but they have done at least 2 big mistakes:

1st---> They adopted what is called the "Thought-for-thought" translation technique. { Hey Fred what thought do you think the Apostle Paul was trying to convey to people in Corinth in 50-60 A.D....and how does that thought get through to Susie Q. that lives in Chicago nowadays..?}

I like the "Word-for-Word" technique. Much less chance of human bias entering the text that way.

2nd----> They use the Alexandrian Texts and their translation is very close to the Roman Catholic editions. This is can be seen when they cut out part of The Lord's Prayer.... Just as The Douay-Rheims version did which was a Romish translation into English at about the same time as the A.V... Beware!

Another word that the NIV changes is a very important one. "Propitiation". ... Meaning: appeasing wrath. see Romans 3:25.

Several verses are not even printed in the NIV. If you attend a Sunday School or Bible Study group and the leader/teacher is going along reading the lesson...the NIV owner will be left in the dark. Check the front page of this website... I'm not making this stuff up!

Please click on this link to the Trinitarian Bible Society and get some more info. Look in the margins of their home page and see/click on "Articles". Read them and also order some of their pamphlets about the NIV/NKJV/The A.V. and many other topics. Read and think and read some more. Investigate.

www.trinitarianbiblesociety.org

Go over to Sermon Audio.com and look for messages/sermons from speakers of The TBS. I heard one earlier today by a gent named Blunt. He was talking about the many places that the NIV leaves out verses and the danger of hacking and chopping away at God's Words! ( I think it might have been called: "The Danger(s) of Modern Versions" ). Give it a listen. They also have many messages from Dr. D.A.Waite of New Jersey concerning the Bible and other versions/editions.

Basically the good manuscripts/copies/texts are known as the "Antioch"-- from the town where Christianity really got it's start in the early days.

The bad or not-so-good/questionable manuscripts/texts/copies are the ones called "Alexandria" (in Egypt). The city was home to many greeks and gnostic types. The gnostics did not like the idea that Christ Jesus {born of Mary in Bethlehem} was actually born/did actually have a human body. Whenever they could cast doubt upon Our Lord,,, they did...by either altering a verse, or leaving it out, or by making a note in the margin of the page.


Read "Which Bible ?" by Fuller and also "The King James Bible Defended" by Hills. These should help you and give you much information.

[kittn1]

And one many of you have probably seen called "Good News for Modern Man" (Todays English Version), it was paperback and had newspaper headlines printed on the cover... but inside was an easy read paraphrase with---do ya remember them?--Stick figure drawings of people throughout the text. It was aimed at getting the hippies/yippies/druggies/college-types (who would not pick-up a regular Bible) to read the Gospel message. It's nickname bacame: "The bloodless Bible", because wherever the word "blood" should have been used--the TEV changed it to "death"/"dead"...

The bloodless Bible? Really?? And, that's who it was aimed at??

Wow. That is the (per)version that I received from the United Church as a ten year old kid, in grade 5 Sunday School (1978). I never really looked at it because even at that young, and for me spiritually ignorant age, I knew that it wasn't really the Bible.

I also got my Gideon's NASB New Testament that year, and that's the first one I read, and where early seeds were planted that led to my conversion at age 29.

I think unwavering devotion to the KJV as God's pure word is something He grants to some of us anyway, only as we spiritually mature. "For unto whomsoever much is given, of him shall be much required:" Luke 12:48

[Brother Tim]

Laura said,

I think unwavering devotion to the KJV as God's pure word is something He grants to some of us anyway, only as we spiritually mature. "For unto whomsoever much is given, of him shall be much required:" Luke 12:48

This is an interesting prospective, but I would modify it slightly. God expects for all of His children to mature. Part of that maturing process is a deepening desire to know His Word intimately. As we do that, we are naturally drawn to His Perfect Word. It is not something God grants to only a few, but instead desires for all. Once we are faced with the Truth, we then make a choice to go forward or lag behind.

[kittn1]

Thank you, Brother Tim, but I'm not sure it's a modification ; I think you just explained it more fully!

You're right about it being a choice to go forward or lag behind once we are faced with the Truth. Every step of spiritual maturity I've taken has been the result of a choice that God has placed before me. When I've seen other folks in my life faced with similar choices, they've chosen differently than I would have and they seem to have stagnated spiritually. (Notice I said "seem;" only God knows the heart).

The choice to accept Christ for salvation is only the first decision we must make!

[Brother Tim]

Just-a-Thought, you said in post #20:

I do not think the KJV is perfect but instead very accurate.

and later,

I have studied rather deep on the Alexandrian Text...

Could you compare the KJB and NIV and tell me if the KJB is "very accurate" in the following verses, or is the Alexandrian text, represented by the NIV here, "accurate" in contradiction to the KJB?

Matthew 17:21, 18:11, 23:14
Mark 7:16, 9:44, 9:46, 11:26 , 15:28
Luke 17:36, 23:17
John 5:4
Acts 8:37, 15:34, 24:7, 28:29
Romans 16:24

(just to name a few)

[Just_A_Thought]

Originally Posted by Brother Tim

Just-a-Thought, you said in post #20:and later,
Could you compare the KJB and NIV and tell me if the KJB is "very accurate" in the following verses, or is the Alexandrian text, represented by the NIV here, "accurate" in contradiction to the KJB?

Matthew 17:21, 18:11, 23:14
Mark 7:16, 9:44, 9:46, 11:26 , 15:28
Luke 17:36, 23:17
John 5:4
Acts 8:37, 15:34, 24:7, 28:29
Romans 16:24

(just to name a few)

You chose verses missing out of the NIV...

I am aware that this is the case. I am not 100% why they have done this. I have read that this is due to a difference between the TR and AT. It was in the TR but not the AT. Also, some say do to poor re-copying over time that it is unsure what the text there even met so rather than write in some messed up scripture that they exclude it. I am actually looking into that but am currently finding little information.

I have noticed that the NKJV and the ASV had these verses though.

[Brother Tim]

I took it that since you said that you "studied rather deep" about the Alexandrian texts then you would have an answer for the missing verses. The obvious fact is that either the KJB has violated Scriptural mandates concerning adding to the Scriptures and therefore is corrupt instead of being "very accurate", or else the AT has violated Scriptural mandates concerning deleting from the Scriptures and is therefore corrupt. You can't have it both ways. Fish or cut bait, Brother!

[Just_A_Thought]

Originally Posted by Brother Tim

I took it that since you said that you "studied rather deep" about the Alexandrian texts then you would have an answer for the missing verses. The obvious fact is that either the KJB has violated Scriptural mandates concerning adding to the Scriptures and therefore is corrupt instead of being "very accurate", or else the AT has violated Scriptural mandates concerning deleting from the Scriptures and is therefore corrupt. You can't have it both ways. Fish or cut bait, Brother!

I have sudied rather deep but the truth is there is not a lot of info I have come across in this area yet. Keep in mind that I am a busy person so I only have so much time to reaserch. Plus, the KJV have all of I John 5:7 which was only found in 4 pieces that which makes up the TR. If we get this picky of every minor thing then we really run into problems because both sides could point fingures all day.

[Brother Tim]

Brother, I am just responding to your seemingly contradictory statement concerning the accuracy of the KJB. Either the TR family or the AT family is false or corrupted. They cannot be seen as mutually acceptable.

[Here Am I]

Originally Posted by PB1789

Some are garbage deluxe paraphrases such as The Living Bible" (which sold bunches!), "The Message", ugh!. And one many of you have probably seen called "Good News for Modern Man" (Todays English Version), it was paperback and had newspaper headlines printed on the cover... but inside was an easy read paraphrase with---do ya remember them?--Stick figure drawings of people throughout the text. It was aimed at getting the hippies/yippies/druggies/college-types (who would not pick-up a regular Bible) to read the Gospel message. It's nickname bacame: "The bloodless Bible", because wherever the word "blood" should have been used--the TEV changed it to "death"/"dead"... You can still see these at thrift stores and used book shops... about .50 cents each.

I had one of those...I remember now. Back when I was about twenty years old, and riding the bus into the city every day to work, I would bring a book with me for the ride. That's when I first read David Copperfield, and Good News for Modern Man. I remember liking it.

But I was unsaved, and remained so for another twenty years. Who knows, though, if some seeds were planted at that time, just to be watered and cultivated almost two decades later?