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#1
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Pastors/Shepherds???
I would like to discuss this idea.
THis was from Diligent in the I Cor. 3:16-17 thread: Quote:
Is it unscriptural to "shepherd" the flock of God? What is a pastor? Jer 23:1 Woe be unto the pastors that destroy and scatter the sheep of my pasture! saith the LORD. Jer 23:2 Therefore thus saith the LORD God of Israel against the pastors that feed my people; Ye have scattered my flock, and driven them away, and have not visited them: behold, I will visit upon you the evil of your doings, saith the LORD. It looks to me that a Pastor IS a shepherd by definition. consider Webster's 1828: Pastor - noun 1. A shepherd; one that has the care of flocks and herds 2. A minister of the gospel who has the charge of the church and congregation, whose duty it is to watch over the people of his charge, and instruct them in the sacred doctrines of the Christian religion. Eph 4:11 And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers; So we ARE pastors... I Peter 5:1 ¶ The elders which are among you I exhort, who am also an elder, and a witness of the sufferings of Christ, and also a partaker of the glory that shall be revealed: 2 Feed the flock of God which is among you, taking the oversight thereof, not by constraint, but willingly; not for filthy lucre, but of a ready mind; 3 Neither as being lords over God’s heritage, but being ensamples to the flock. 4 And when the chief Shepherd shall appear, ye shall receive a crown of glory that fadeth not away. 5 ¶ Likewise, ye younger, submit yourselves unto the elder. Yea, all of you be subject one to another, and be clothed with humility: for God resisteth the proud, and giveth grace to the humble. It appears to me from this passage that the elders are to feed and lead the flock (sheep!) just as a shepherd would. The appeal is that we are to treat the flock as the Great Shepherd would; in other words, we are shepherds underneath the chief shepherd. We are not cattle-drivers; we are shepherds. I am curious to hear from others on this subject. |
#2
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I think of myself not as a shepherd, but as a senior sheep. I have learned to watch the Shepherd as He shows me where the better grass is and where the waters flow safe. I encourage the younger sheep to follow me as I follow the Shepherd, thus being an "ensample" to the flock. Remember the unique meaning of the word "ensample" versus "example".
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#3
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My old pastor used to complain a little about these TV preachers. Folks would send off their money and write letters for help. He used to say, "Try calling one of these fellows when you are in the hospital and see if he shows up!" |
#4
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#5
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My point is that this forum is not a Baptist church, it's private property. many on the forum are users of the SWORDSWEARCHER program. The free ONLINE BIBLE program has a neat, almost instantaneous word search feature, the free E-SWORD program has multiple corrupt version feature, but for pure KJV Bible study there is no finer computer program, free or commercial,, than SWORDSEARCHER. Another feature of this website is that it provides links and much study material for the defense of the KJV as inspired Scripture. This forum does not need multiple moderation. Brandon has done, is now, and will continue to do a good job, so I see no need for multiple moderation. He has his standards of rule, many I agree with, and most of all he protects his members and stands up for them, particularly, as mentioned before, the new Christians and those not fully grounded yet. Grace and peace brother Tony |
#6
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Tony, I am not sure where you are coming from.
I was accused of "reading people's hearts..." etc in the I Cor. 3 thread. I responded that as a Pastor (which I am) I am in a position where I must make judgment on a continual basis. I never said that I was a pastor or the pastor on this forum. I have no idea where you and Brandon got that thought. I was making an illustration. I find it interesting that Brandon can (falsely) accuse me of trying to "pastor" on this forum, while he gets to be the "pastor." hmmm - not sure I follow that! If you had read my original post in response to Brandon on the I Cor. 3 thread, I have already addressed this! I was making an illustration. I guess there are too many people on this forum that have "kneejerk" reactions, without any regard to anyone but their "buddies." I am here for the edification. Now, How does your response answer my OP? My OP is about the leadership in a local church. Brandon says that it is only the new versions that say that a pastor "shepherds" a church. I disagree. The word "pastor" means "shepherd" so by definition we are shepherds, and as such must "shepherd" the church. |
#7
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#8
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The Shephard (Pastor) is to watch over his sheep, to feed & to care for them. I find this verse very interesting: Jer 23:1 Woe be unto the pastors that destroy and scatter the sheep of my pasture! saith the LORD. Jer 23:2 Therefore thus saith the LORD God of Israel against the pastors that feed my people; Ye have scattered my flock, and driven them away, and have not visited them: behold, I will visit upon you the evil of your doings, saith the LORD. I do not know what makes a shepherd do this: after all I believe that it is the Lord that adds to the church, so why would the shepherd subtract from the church? We are all members of one body, so this Bible verse is very interesting: Eph 4:11 And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers; I believe we are to edify & love one-another, that the members may grow & understand how we are expected to be Christ-like in our walk. |
#9
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Jer 23:1 Woe be unto the pastors that destroy and scatter the sheep of my pasture! saith the LORD. Jer 23:2 Therefore thus saith the LORD God of Israel against the pastors that feed my people; Ye have scattered my flock, and driven them away, and have not visited them: behold, I will visit upon you the evil of your doings, saith the LORD. I Peter 5:1 The elders which are among you I exhort, who am also an elder, and a witness of the sufferings of Christ, and also a partaker of the glory that shall be revealed: 2 Feed the flock of God which is among you, taking the oversight thereof, not by constraint, but willingly; not for filthy lucre, but of a ready mind; 3 Neither as being lords over God’s heritage, but being ensamples to the flock. 4 And when the chief Shepherd shall appear, ye shall receive a crown of glory that fadeth not away. I guess verse 4 is where the idea comes from that since Jesus is the chief Shepherd, the Pastor must be the plain ole shepherd. But I do not see scripture ever referring to a pastor as a shepherd. That's a stretch in my understanding. I agree though, the Bible is clear...feed the flock. |
#10
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First, we all know Brandon can take care of himself, but I'm going to speak for a friend and brother when I feel led to, and this time was one I was led to. I found the author of this thread to be very subtle and then flat deny his insinuations when confronted with clear dissertation. The entire gist of the message was that Brandon was not moderating the forum in that there seemed to be doctrines taught here the author of the thread didn't care for. So we need a "board" of moderators. Right. This is the forum for the SWORDSEARCHER Bible program's website, a commercial product, and not subject to any democratic perambulations. This is a private website. At the same time the moderator has governed it in a fair and Scriptural manner. Those who "correct" the Scriptures or teach false doctrine are disciplined with the methods of the moderator's discretion. That goes for me as much as it did for Tandi and Nehemiah. Otherwise, we are free to spread our wings so to speak, teach, be taught, and comment. I love it here. I just need a computer that works dependably. Grace and peace my friend Tony |
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