#1  
Old 05-22-2008, 07:31 PM
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Debau Debau is offline
 
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Originally Posted by Renee View Post
OK, so how about somebody starting a thread where we can learn some bible doctrine? Forget about hair covering or women in pants, or men with beards or not. Think we covered that enough in the other forum/threads. Please, somebody?

OK. I know this has been covered somewhat before.

Isaiah 43:10 Ye are my witnesses, saith the LORD, and my servant whom I have chosen: that ye may know and believe me, and understand that I am he: before me there was no God formed, neither shall there be after me.

11 I, even I, am the LORD; and beside me there is no saviour.

12 I have declared, and have saved, and I have shewed, when there was no strange god among you: therefore ye are my witnesses, saith the LORD, that I am God.

I think these are the seminal verses for JW's.

How do we show JW's who is the Saviour-Jesus Christ-Jehovah, in the corrupted NWT where it agrees with the KJB, so they can be confounded by their own perversion (NWT), and may see the glorious light of the gospel of Jesus Christ? You would need to know where the corruptions in the NWT are. I didn't do my homework. Maybe you did it for me?
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  #2  
Old 05-22-2008, 09:02 PM
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George George is offline
 
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Default Re: Post #11

Quote:
Originally Posted by Debau View Post
OK. I know this has been covered somewhat before.

Isaiah 43:10 Ye are my witnesses, saith the LORD, and my servant whom I have chosen: that ye may know and believe me, and understand that I am he: before me there was no God formed, neither shall there be after me.

11 I, even I, am the LORD; and beside me there is no saviour.

12 I have declared, and have saved, and I have shewed, when there was no strange god among you: therefore ye are my witnesses, saith the LORD, that I am God.

I think these are the seminal verses for JW's.

How do we show JW's who is the Saviour-Jesus Christ-Jehovah, in the corrupted NWT where it agrees with the KJB, so they can be confounded by their own perversion (NWT), and may see the glorious light of the gospel of Jesus Christ? You would need to know where the corruptions in the NWT are. I didn't do my homework. Maybe you did it for me?
I have only seen one Jehovah's Witness (a Young Couple) turn from that pernicious cult and that was because they were "new" to it, and we (2 of us on personal work) were able to deal with them, not about "salvation" (at first), but with the Deity of the Lord Jesus Christ.

Because of that experience I developed a response to Jehovah's Witnesses. (Somewhat along the lines you mentioned). I have never been able to go through all 6 points with any Jehovah's Witnesses that I have "witnessed" to since then. They normally can take 2 or 3 points and then they find some "excuse" to move on to "greener" pastures.

The interesting thing though, is after my testimony to them, it may be "years" before another JW "darkens" (and I mean DARKENS!) our doorstep again.

If you would like you can find that response on my web page at:
http://www.thywordistruthkjv.com/ Under "Bible Lessons" > "Questions for Jehovah's Witnesses".

The Lesson Covers These Six Questions - with verses from both the New Testament and the Old Testament (Isaiah).

WHO:

#1. IS THE CREATOR?
#2. IS OUR SAVIOUR?
#3. IS THE FIRST & LAST?
#4. Is It That Every Knee Shall Bow & Every Tongue Shall Confess To?
#5. SHARE’S GOD’S GLORY?
#6. IS EQUAL TO GOD?

When I deal with them - I always go to the New Testament (FIRST) and get them to "confess" (with their own mouth) that the Lord Jesus Christ is: (#1, #2, #3, #4, #5, & #6.) I then go back to Isaiah where the LORD (Jehovah) states unequivocally that HE ALONE: IS THE CREATOR; IS OUR SAVIOUR; IS THE FIRST & LAST; IS THE ONE That Every Knee Shall Bow & Every Tongue Shall Confess To; SHARE’S GOD’S GLORY; IS EQUAL TO GOD.

Like I said, I haven't been able to go through all six points in 35 years with a Jehovah's Witness before they skedaddle down the road. They are in a quandary because these verse comparisons prove that the Lord Jesus Christ is indeed the "JEHOVAH" of the Old Testament! and with their own mouth they confess it to be so - before they suddenly "realize" what they have said!
  #3  
Old 05-22-2008, 09:28 PM
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Debau Debau is offline
 
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Quote:
deal with them, not about "salvation" (at first), but with the Deity of the Lord Jesus Christ.
That's the crux of the issue, aye?

Quote:
If you would like you can find that response on my web page at:
http://www.thywordistruthkjv.com/ Under "Bible Lessons" > "Questions for Jehovah's Witnesses".

Thank you George.

I also found Fundy's response from back when. Someone had a brilliant idea and put in a "search" on this site! Took me some time, but I figured it out...I typed in "JW's".

I have no illusions and expectations, but I have prayer and hope for at least one dear lady.
  #4  
Old 05-22-2008, 10:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Debau View Post
That's the crux of the issue, aye?

Thank you George.

I also found Fundy's response from back when. Someone had a brilliant idea and put in a "search" on this site! Took me some time, but I figured it out...I typed in "JW's".

I have no illusions and expectations, but I have prayer and hope for at least one dear lady.
Aloha brother,

If you try to deal with most JW's about "Salvation" - they have been "trained" to use the "same words" that you use in regards to "salvation", but they will "mean" something totally different! It gets into a "semantics game".

Almost all the JW's that I have met consider themselves "intellectuals" and knowing far more about spiritual matters than us ordinary mortals. When in reality they are "pseudo-intellectuals", who have had their minds corrupted to the point where they can not think for themselves.

For the most part, they cannot "think" outside the "box". For example: years ago I would use the term "Trinity" to describe the Biblical word "Godhead" and when I would deal with a JW (any JW) they would have a "stock" reply: "Why that's a Catholic term". I then started to use the Biblical term (Godhead) with a JW and inevitably they would (at some point) say: "Do you mean the Trinity?" and I would respond - "Why that's a Catholic term" and they wouldn't know what to say or do.

The point being simply - they don't think for themselves. If you can get a Jehovah's Witness to "see" that Jesus Christ is indeed "JEHOVAH" - they'll get saved. They are already "religious" - they just need the Truth.

May the Lord bless your endeavors on her behalf.
  #5  
Old 05-24-2008, 02:04 AM
fundy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Debau View Post
That's the crux of the issue, aye?




Thank you George.

I also found Fundy's response from back when. Someone had a brilliant idea and put in a "search" on this site! Took me some time, but I figured it out...I typed in "JW's".

I have no illusions and expectations, but I have prayer and hope for at least one dear lady.

Hi Debau,

My wife was born in the Phillipines, so we get regular visits from the Phillipino members of the local "Temple of Doom",as my daughter calls it. As most Phillipinos are of Catholic background, they have no Biblical knowledge to start with and can be easily scammed by the J.W. speil.

Not so my wife,who is born again, and knows her Bible. Nevertheless we get lots of J.W.'s visiting, but funnily enough, NEVER the same ones twice.

As you say, the main issue with them is the identity of Christ.

My favourite approach is to first ask them if they believe that the KJB is the pure, preserved Word Of God. They always say yes, because they simply do not know of the differences that exist between the KJB and the NWT.

After they have committed to the fact that the KJB is the Word of God, It is simply a matter of letting your Bible do the talking and asking them to explain away the verses that cross reference from the OT and NT that prove Christs' Diety, at the same time pointing out that their NWT has changed the meaning of the same verses.

You will have to study these out and you will come up with some that are you favourites. Mark your Bible with the cross refernces and use them...dont go into a conversation without your Bible ( Hebrews 4:12)

Quite simply, they cannot explain away the differences, and cannot deny what the KJB is saying, especially since you have already gotten them to admit that it is the pure Word. When they do try and say that the KJB is wrong, just remind them of their earlier admission to the purity of the KJB.

Stunned silence and lots of open mouthed eye blinking confusion usually follows.

Remember, though, you are not trying to "beat them up", but get them saved. Always be friendly and invite them back for another chat whenever they feel like it.

Another thing to remember is that one of the pair is usually an experienced "Elder" while the other is a novice and may have only just been roped in to the cult, so after identifying which is which, I always, after presenting the Elder with a question that he/she cannot answer, turn to the novice and really hammer home the point of the contradiction or problem that the Elder is struggling with.

I have never seen one of these people converted on my doorstep, but have seen plenty go away visibly shaken and thinking hard about what they have heard. Plant the seed of doubt and let God give the increase from there.


fundy
  #6  
Old 05-24-2008, 11:03 PM
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George George is offline
 
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Default Re: Fundy Post #5 > JW's

Excellent point brother!

I practically "ignore" the "elder" JW and try to concentrate on the younger - if I can!

It's been so long since I have dealt with a JW, I had forgotten that point.
  #7  
Old 05-25-2008, 01:27 AM
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PB1789 PB1789 is offline
 
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George:---Good Post. {They never want to stick around when/if the person at the house starts "preaching/teaching" the J.W.s...they view us (Bible-believing garden-variety Christians) as part of "The Evil Slave class" and "Children of the Roman Catholic Whore"...Hence it is VERY difficult to get through to them.}


Fundy:--- Very Good Post! I would agree---Plant the seeds. Place questions in their minds. I heard the testimony of a man that used to work at the Watch Tower Bible and Tract Society in Brooklyn, New York (The J.W.s' official name). He related that one day a young theological student (Walter Martin) came into his building and started asking some very difficult questions which the J.W. employee had no answers for. The next week he came back to the building, but this the employee (sorry-forgot his name) saw Walter Martin coming and locked the door! Years later that man got saved and turned his back on the J.W.s....

Debau:---Hang in there and don't give up-Galatians 6:9. Very few people get converted "on-the-spot". BTW---They do accept the K.J. (A.V.) Bible but they (just like the L.D.S.Mormons) also have their own translation. The Watch Tower Bible and Tract Society came up with the new World Translation because they just had to get rid of that problematic wording found in the Gospel of John 1:1 .

P.S. As much as sometimes you might want to scream and shout and "knock-them-out"---(they can get bothersome, especially when they call you a "whore of babylon") maintain your "cool" and try not to yell at them...remember part of your ministry [ya needn't be ordained officially to speak to these folks---chances are they will come to your door] is to keep them on your doorstep for as long as possible. Why? Because if they are talking to you that means they are not talking/propagandizing your next-door neighbors. { Same for the L.D.S. missionaries when they come-a- knockin'}
  #8  
Old 06-04-2008, 08:52 PM
pneuby pneuby is offline
 
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Default

Quote:
The Lesson Covers These Six Questions - with verses from both the New Testament and the Old Testament (Isaiah).

WHO:

#1. IS THE CREATOR?
#2. IS OUR SAVIOUR?
#3. IS THE FIRST & LAST?
#4. Is It That Every Knee Shall Bow & Every Tongue Shall Confess To?
#5. SHARE’S GOD’S GLORY?
[LEFT][LEFT]#6. IS EQUAL TO GOD?

When I deal with them - I always go to the New Testament (FIRST) and get them to "confess" (with their own mouth) that the Lord Jesus Christ is: (#1, #2, #3, #4, #5, & #6.) I then go back to Isaiah where the LORD (Jehovah) states unequivocally that HE ALONE: IS THE CREATOR; IS OUR SAVIOUR; IS THE FIRST & LAST; IS THE ONE That Every Knee Shall Bow & Every Tongue Shall Confess To; SHARE’S GOD’S GLORY; IS EQUAL TO GOD.
George, I found the direct link to this lesson on your site.

http://www.thywordistruthkjv.com/Que...0Witnesses.htm

Thanks!
 

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