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  #21  
Old 03-24-2008, 07:47 AM
Pastor Mikie
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Thomas Nelson Publishers prints a KJB and puts there NKJV variants as "translations" in the margins. I've found this a bit upsetting. There are similarities between the KJB and the NKJV. And that is why I think it is more "dangerous" than the other new versions. Many people have gone to the NKJV thinking it is a King James Bible only "easier to read".

I'm very thankful to God for the KJB. An added benefit for me was the fact that because of reading it, I went from a 4th grade reading level when I graduated high-school to a college reading level within a few years of reading it. That's on top of the Spiritual growth. So that is "Blessing al a mode".
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  #22  
Old 03-24-2008, 09:00 AM
evstevemd
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Originally Posted by fundy View Post
If it walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck...its probably a duck.

The closest to being a cult are the sub group that declares no salvation for those who dont speak in tongues.

Only last week one of the newly saved Christians in our church was told by a tongue speaking workmate, using Mark 16 as a reference, that he wasnt saved because he didnt have the "gift" of tongues. 5 minutes with the Bible soon put his mind at ease.

Fundy
Ev. Steve, Do you support talking in tongues? YES.
Does it mean you are not saved if you don't speak in tongues? NO
So then what?
Both are Biblical, but don't confuse them please! Check what God says below!

1Co 14:2 For he that speaketh in an unknown tongue speaketh not unto men, but unto God: for no man understandeth him; howbeit in the spirit he speaketh mysteries.

Rom 10:9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

Ev. Steve
  #23  
Old 03-24-2008, 11:51 AM
Revangelist
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For Atlas:
The Assemblies of God, The Church of God and the Pentecostal Church of God do not teach speaking in tongues is necessary for salvation (there are others, but I know those 3 don't). Also, the Pentecostal Churches that do teach tongues is necessary tend to also believe in Baptismal Regeneration and a form of Modalism (Jesus Only). The above mentioned denominations are totally in agreement with the fundamentals of the faith. As a matter of fact, there are only to major areas of contention between Baptists and those 3 Pentecostal denominations: tongues and eternal security. But, I know there are at least 2 or 3 other threads that are discussing those issues. So, back to the topic at hand:

Pastor Mikie is correct. Not only does Nelson Publishing put in "Alexandrian" renderings in their margins, so do a number of others. You also have to watch out for parallel Bibles with the KJV as one of the versions. I got one hoping to be better armed but found the KJV was the 1873 "Paragraph Version" where one of the translators of the RV of 1881 had made changes to the text. Like Hebrews 10:23, "Faith" is changed to "hope".
  #24  
Old 03-24-2008, 12:03 PM
Revangelist
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For those who aren't Pentecostals on this thread, would you be happier if we Pentecostals didn't participate in the discussions on this forum?
  #25  
Old 03-24-2008, 02:18 PM
jerry
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It's Brandon's website and he has welcomed you here. Because I do not agree with Pentecostal theology, when it comes up I refute it. I pray the Lord gives me enough wisdom to know when to let something go, and not be argumentative just for the sake of being so (ie. in the sense of addressing every little disagreement) - of which I know I have failed in the past. Several people have asked to be able to address these issues without bringing up Pentecostal doctrine or practices - I agree we can have much better fellowship if we focus on areas other than that. (I am not saying to compromise - but we have stated where we each stand, and to keep debating those issues is not helping either side - it doesn't look like either side plans on changing their theology.)
  #26  
Old 03-24-2008, 04:03 PM
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Diligent Diligent is offline
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Originally Posted by Revangelist View Post
For those who aren't Pentecostals on this thread, would you be happier if we Pentecostals didn't participate in the discussions on this forum?
Why do you worry? This is a very open forum. I am not a Pentecostal, but this is "my" forum, and obviously I am not trying to squash discussion of related doctrine. You should not be worried about other people not "wanting" you here. This forum does not belong to a collective. But by the same token, you should not act as though you are offended when other people try to rebuke what they see as false doctrine.

The people who have taken the time to point out the errors of Pentecostal doctrine have done so because they care for the Truth and are not afraid to contend for it. They are not worried about being shunned by a collective, and you shouldn't be, either.

Just my opinion.
  #27  
Old 03-24-2008, 04:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Revangelist View Post
For those who aren't Pentecostals on this thread, would you be happier if we Pentecostals didn't participate in the discussions on this forum?
I for one do not object to Pentacostals being on this Forum - especially if they can expound their point of view with scripture (which you have ably done) without getting offended.

I stayed out of "the fray" on the debate on "eternal security", because I have observed that once a person embraces a belief, it is very difficult to "talk them out of it" - they become committed. However, on March 21 I posted an answer (or a challenge) for you to back up your claim: "For every Scripture you produce to prove eternal security, I can find one that counters it."

Years ago (right after "Diligent" [Brandon] produced his 1st Swordsearcher) I made a search of the scriptures seeking out as many verses on salvation as I could find (and with the least amount of personal bias that I could muster, since I also believe in the "preservation of the saints"). I have that list of verses (which equals approximately 18 type written pages) on my web site.

What I discovered was that 15 of those pages indicated that you can't lose it - 3 of those pages indicate that you can! [I found approximately 357 verses in support of the "preservation of the saints" as against approximately 38 verses that indicates that a person "can lose it" - that's nearly 10 to 1] I couldn't post all 18 pages on this forum so I encouraged you to go to my web site and check out the verses that I listed. I don't want to "rekindle" the debate, but I would like to have you post (somewhere - on your own web site?) as many verses to "counter" - as I supplied in favor of "eternal security".

You stated: "Eternal security is a careless doctrine." I believe that it is "careless" of anyone to make a claim if they can't back it up. Please produce the scriptures and I will promise you that I will read them (I will pay for the postage - if you have to send them by "snail mail). I am not trying to "push" my web site (it's not that special) but here is the address again: http://www.thywordistruthkjv.com/ If you go to the Section called "Bible Lessons" and the heading "Verses on Salvation" you will find the verses listed.

I am not claiming that I found all of the verses pertaining to salvation - but I did make a sincere effort to find as many as I could. Perhaps you can find more.

Yours for the Lord Jesus Christ and for His Holy Word,

George
  #28  
Old 03-24-2008, 04:43 PM
fundy
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[QUOTE=evstevemd;2164]Ev. Steve, Do you support talking in tongues? YES.
Does it mean you are not saved if you don't speak in tongues? NO
So then what?
Both are Biblical, but don't confuse them please! Check what God says below!

1Co 14:2 For he that speaketh in an unknown tongue speaketh not unto men, but unto God: for no man understandeth him; howbeit in the spirit he speaketh mysteries.



You cannot build a doctrine by pulling singe verses out of the context they are written in....oops, sorry, obviously you can, I should have said, you SHOULD NOT build a doctrine by pulling single verses out of context.

Fundy.

Last edited by fundy; 03-24-2008 at 04:47 PM.
  #29  
Old 03-24-2008, 04:56 PM
fundy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Revangelist View Post
For those who aren't Pentecostals on this thread, would you be happier if we Pentecostals didn't participate in the discussions on this forum?
No,not at all.

I, personally, would like to see more people of differing faiths to post opinions, just like you have.

I have stated in past posts that If a person speaks in tongues, it it fine with me,I dont believe it to be Biblically correct, but thats just me. The thing is, that if you are going to start waving the pentacostal flag, espouse a loss of salvation doctrine, or even start posting your reply in tongues....dont expect a warm and fuzzy group hug from those of us that disagree.

Fundy

Last edited by fundy; 03-24-2008 at 04:58 PM.
  #30  
Old 03-24-2008, 05:10 PM
Revangelist
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George, the fact you found verses that say you can lose your salvation makes my point. There is a paradox. So, I say both sides are true and I'm almost ridiculed for it. God says He's not willing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance. But, there are those who perish. Thanks for your civil answer. I appreciate it.
 

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