[pbiwolski]

Originally Posted by Forrest

...but I believe verse 9 is written specifically to all who are lost, in darkness, and have no fellowship with God the Father through Christ Jesus.

Well then the words we and us would have to be wrong. (See 2:19 - they)

The issue is easier than you're making it out to be. There is a doctrinal statement about forgiveness of sins found in 2:12

I write unto you, little children, because your sins are forgiven you for his name's sake.

There's your position in Christ doctrinally. Nobody has trouble with that.

1:9 (and context) is a practical statement about these sins. Practical as is your "practice" - day to day. This matches the context of "fellowship" (previously mentioned in thread) throughout the chapter. Notice the use of the word "walk" throughout these verses as well.

I started a thread some time ago about a guy in my church that got on this kick.
http://av1611.com/forums/showthread....ess+their+sins

Forrest, 1 John 1:7-9 has always been a tough passage for Christians and there are good men on different sides of the interpretation.

I think if you cross reference 1 John with Ephesians 5 it may help you... the context in both of these passages is believers WALKING IN THE LIGHT, and FELLOWSHIP of the believer...

check out this passage in Ephesians 5...

6 Let no man deceive you with vain words: for because of these things cometh the wrath of God upon the children of disobedience.

7 Be not ye therefore partakers with them.

8 For ye were sometimes darkness, but now are ye light in the Lord:
walk as children of light:

Now you see that thing right there about walking as children of light? If God's children cannot walk in darkness, then why in the world would the Bible instruct us to walk as children of light? Keep reading...

9 (For the fruit of the Spirit is in all goodness and righteousness and truth; )

10 Proving what is acceptable unto the Lord.

11 And have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness, but rather reprove them.

Now we see that thing about FELLOWSHIP again, and please notice the Christian can have FELLOWSHIP not only with God but also with the works of DARKNESS. WE have a choice every day of our lives who we will choose to have fellowship with. This theme fits perfectly with what John wrote in our KJV in 1 John right here...

6 "If we say that we have fellowship with him, and walk in darkness, we lie, and do not the truth:

7 But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.

8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.

9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

I honestly think the reason Christians get hung up here is because they confuse the POSITIONAL forgiveness and cleansing (based on grace) with the PRACTICAL side of daily fellowship with our Lord (as it relates to our joy). There is a beautiful verse that sits right in the middle of 1 John 1 that is often overlooked, but I think it holds the key to the entire passage. WHY is John writing this? Here's your answer...

"And these things write we unto you,
that your joy may be full." 1 John 1:4

[Forrest]

Originally Posted by Bro. Parrish

Forrest, 1 John 1:7-9 has always been a tough passage for Christians and there are good men on different sides of the interpretation.

I think if you cross reference 1 John with Ephesians 5 it may help you... the context in both of these passages is believers WALKING IN THE LIGHT, and FELLOWSHIP of the believer...

check out this passage in Ephesians 5...

6 Let no man deceive you with vain words: for because of these things cometh the wrath of God upon the children of disobedience.

7 Be not ye therefore partakers with them.

8 For ye were sometimes darkness, but now are ye light in the Lord:
walk as children of light:

Now you see that thing right there about walking as children of light? If God's children cannot walk in darkness, then why in the world would the Bible instruct us to walk as children of light? Keep reading...

9 (For the fruit of the Spirit is in all goodness and righteousness and truth; )

10 Proving what is acceptable unto the Lord.

11 And have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness, but rather reprove them.

Now we see that thing about FELLOWSHIP again, and please notice the Christian can have FELLOWSHIP not only with God but also with the works of DARKNESS. WE have a choice every day of our lives who we will choose to have fellowship with. This theme fits perfectly with what John wrote in our KJV in 1 John right here...

6 "If we say that we have fellowship with him, and walk in darkness, we lie, and do not the truth:

7 But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.

8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.

9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

I honestly think the reason Christians get hung up here is because they confuse the POSITIONAL forgiveness and cleansing (based on grace) with the PRACTICAL side of daily fellowship with our Lord (as it relates to our joy). There is a beautiful verse that sits right in the middle of 1 John 1 that is often overlooked, but I think it holds the key to the entire passage. WHY is John writing this? Here's your answer...

"And these things write we unto you,
that your joy may be full." 1 John 1:4

Brother Parrish. I need to rest. The MS thing. But I will give my understanding.

Forrest, every time you mention the MS it makes me think of one of my dearest friends in the Lord, who also suffers from this and he is like you a great student of the Bible, he ran a Bible Doctrines correspondence program for prisoners for many years. God bless...

[Winman]

I vote yes, and completely agree with Bro Parrish's post #25.

[Forrest]

Originally Posted by pbiwolski

Well then the words we and us would have to be wrong. (See 2:19 - they)

The issue is easier than you're making it out to be. There is a doctrinal statement about forgiveness of sins found in 2:12

I write unto you, little children, because your sins are forgiven you for his name's sake.

There's your position in Christ doctrinally. Nobody has trouble with that.

1:9 (and context) is a practical statement about these sins. Practical as is your "practice" - day to day. This matches the context of "fellowship" (previously mentioned in thread) throughout the chapter. Notice the use of the word "walk" throughout these verses as well.

I started a thread some time ago about a guy in my church that got on this kick.
http://av1611.com/forums/showthread....ess+their+sins

1 John 1:1 That which was from the beginning, which we have heard, which we have seen with our eyes, which we have looked upon, and our hands have handled, of the Word of life;

Who is the we in verse 1? Was it John and the Apostles? Surely others, at least one person, reading this letter heard, saw, and looked upon the Word of life.

It's more clear as we read this verse. (By the way, for clarification, I'm not just using the word "we" meaning you and I pbiwolski, I include all who read my comment here, saved or lost).

1 John 1:3 That which we have seen and heard declare we unto you, that ye also may have fellowship with us: and truly our fellowship is with the Father, and with his Son Jesus Christ.

So who is "ye" in verse 3 referring to? Would that be both the saved and lost? The saved only? Or possibly the lost only?

John already has fellowship with God and is in the light just as or in the same manner God is in the light. He believes in the person he is proclaiming and that is the only reason he is in the light as God is in the light. Others reading the letter also walk in the light as HE is in the light and have fellowship with the Father and His Son. And John talks to them in verse 7. "But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin" (1 John 1:7).

But to all reading who have yet to believe, who are walking in darkness and have no fellowship with God, he provides the solution in verse 9.

In my understanding, in context he is writing to a mixed crowd just like we (meaning you, pbiwolski, and I, Forrest) are in a mixed crowd.

He cleanseth me from ALL sin and it is not conditional to my confessing all sin since I am in Christ. His blood never stops cleansing me from all sin.

From the moment you (pbiwolski) first received Christ have you confessed every single sin? If not, are you still forgiven? Are you cleansed from all unrighteousness? Are you still in fellowship with the Father and His Son? Does the blood of Christ cleanseth you from all sin or not?

If confessing of your sins (no exception, don't miss one) as a believer is required to be forgiven of your sins and cleansed from all unrighteousness are you forgiven and are you clean?