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Old 09-18-2008, 08:59 PM
wwjd.usa
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Default Possible contradition in the KJV

I was reading the King James Bible, and in Matthew 5:22, Jesus said, "... but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire."

Then in Matthew 23:19, Jesus called the Pharisees fools.
Jesus said "Ye fools and blind: for whether is greater, the gift, or the altar that sanctifieth the gift?"

Does this mean that Jesus is in danger of Hell fire? Please explain.

By the way, since this web-site supports the KJV Bible, I quoted the scripture above from the KJV Bible. Please only use the KJV Bible when quoting scripture. Thanks.
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Old 09-18-2008, 09:00 PM
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It's referring to anger without a cause.
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Old 09-19-2008, 09:57 AM
peopleoftheway peopleoftheway is offline
 
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It is referring to anger without a cause but Christ could say those things also because.
He Did no sin, In him there is no sin, he knew no sin

1 Peter 2:22 Who did no sin, neither was guile found in his mouth:
1 John 3:5 And ye know that he was manifested to take away our sins; and in him is no sin.
2 Corinthians 5:21 For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.
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Old 09-19-2008, 10:10 AM
peopleoftheway peopleoftheway is offline
 
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But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire.

NIV Reads
But I tell you that anyone who is angry with his brother[a]will be subject to judgment. Again, anyone who says to his brother, 'Raca,[b]' is answerable to the Sanhedrin. But anyone who says, 'You fool!' will be in danger of the fire of
hell.

The KJB is clearly marking the context out with the statement "without a cause"
The modern version is the txt that removes it and makes it a contradiction.
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Old 09-19-2008, 10:54 AM
Manny Rodriguez Manny Rodriguez is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wwjd.usa View Post
...I quoted the scripture above from the KJV Bible...
And its a good thing to because if you would've quoted a Modern Critical Text-based Version, you would have a point about this being a contradiction. The MVs omit the words "without a cause". The KJV doesn't. So in the KJV this is not a contradiction because if the angered individual has a righteous cause for calling someone a fool, it is justified.

Since the MVs omit these important words (eike/without a cause), the MVs make Jesus a sinner for the times he got angry and rebuked the Pharisees by calling them fools. Yet another reason to stick with the KJV.
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Old 09-19-2008, 09:01 PM
wwjd.usa
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Manny Rodriguez View Post
And its a good thing to because if you would've quoted a Modern Critical Text-based Version, you would have a point about this being a contradiction. The MVs omit the words "without a cause". The KJV doesn't. So in the KJV this is not a contradiction because if the angered individual has a righteous cause for calling someone a fool, it is justified.

Since the MVs omit these important words (eike/without a cause), the MVs make Jesus a sinner for the times he got angry and rebuked the Pharisees by calling them fools. Yet another reason to stick with the KJV.
Lol, so hilarious
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Old 09-19-2008, 09:07 PM
wwjd.usa
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Mathew 5:22

"But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire."

when I read verses, I sometimes break the verses apart. Here is how broke apart this verse.

0) But I say unto you,
1) That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment
2) and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council:
3) but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire."

if you would remove the brackets and the numbers, then you would have the exact verse (no addition or subtraction of the verse)

To me it seems that "without a cause" only applies to the first part of the verse. The second and the third part of the verse says that without an exception, we are not to call anyone "Raca" or "fool". Please explain to me how you applied "without a cause" to the second and the third part of the verse.

So are you saying that we can call people "fool" or "raca" if they misbehave or if they deserve it?
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Old 09-19-2008, 09:42 PM
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Christ wasn't the only one to use such language, although He does it again in Luke 24:25 (and that time it's not religious hypocrites that He's speaking to).

Maybe Paul is in danger of hell fire for this slip of the tongue/pen.
I Cor. 15:36 Thou fool, that which thou sowest is not quickened, except it die:
The key to understanding the verse in question is understanding where and when the statement applies. Application is crucial. You've already noticed a problem when trying to apply the statement to Christ's later preaching. Again, you'll find trouble if applying it to the Apostle Paul's letter to Christians in Corinth. So, application is crucial.

Now, where and when does this teaching apply? The answer is in the chapter. As a matter of fact, it's all over the book of Matthew. The kingdom Christ is offering to "His own" is called the kingdom of heaven. The King (vs.35) was present and preparing His people for something that they rejected...and here we are as a result!

The statement in question (as well as those preceding and following) is aimed at the Jews whom Christ was coming to deliver. Forget about their rejection and the cross (hindsight will hinder you from understanding) and notice the message that Jesus Christ originally preached.
Matt. 10:5-7
5. These twelve Jesus sent forth, and commanded them, saying, Go not into the way of the Gentiles, and into any city of the Samaritans enter ye not:
6. But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.
7. And as ye go, preach, saying, The kingdom of heaven is at hand.
As for the application, the statement will be in force when the King comes back and sets up His kingdom. If it's for today, then there's a problem (as you've noticed) with the scripture.
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Old 09-20-2008, 01:21 AM
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Correct, the teaching of Jesus was for preparing Israel for the kingdom (millennial). Becaue during that time if you do a judgement you will be judge by your own heart and hell could be waiting for you. that is you could find yourself in hell just for that kind of judgmental attitude.

also the without a cause is ointing to the persons anger not to them calling someone crazy or a fool.

Imagine if that took place today. there would be no one left in the earth
  #10  
Old 09-20-2008, 10:11 PM
herami
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Great post, pbiwolski.

in fact, it is very tough to fit Matt. chapters 5-7 ANYWHERE in Scripture. It doesn't fit in with the OT law and it doesn't fit in with church doctrine.

The key is the Kingdom of Heaven.
Jesus Christ is laying down the groundrules for the physical, literal, visible, Jewish, Messianic, earthly Kingdom known as the Kingdom of Heaven in the book of Matthew.

Failure to recognize the uniqueness of the Kingdom of Heaven in the book of Matthew leads to all kinds of pitfalls.
 

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