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Old 07-15-2009, 02:41 PM
Brother-Smith Brother-Smith is offline
 
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Default Worship Music.

Hello everyone,

I have a question about worship music and psalms as used in the Word of God.
How is that to be applied in a local church.

The reason I ask is that I am a professional musician and a private tutor. The Lord has blessed me in many ways and I realize that my mission field is the people I come into contact with during the course of my day. (many students are getting the gospel when they come to guitar lessons, It just pops up.) However, when I attend a church service or listen to most "christian" music, it feels so fake and I don't seem to understand it. My Christian friends think something is wrong with me because I don't enjoy it. I love the OLD HYMNS from the hymnal. I like them because they have the "blood" and the "gospel" in them.

I am 37 years old and enjoy most styles of music. I enjoy the instrumental music most of all. Never have really listened to the lyrics of secular music much.

I have studied much on music in the word and also have seen the negative effects of music on people. Some even suggest that the emphasis on the back beat in Rock music is of the Devil, since it goes against the music that GOD has given to his creation. (bird songs, whale songs, etc.)

I am open to any help, words of guidance and scripture.

I can not stand contemporary worship music. It DRIVES ME NUTS and I am a musician. See my problem?


I guess I don't understand what roll music has in worship or the music I am hearing is not really glorifying to GOD.
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Old 07-15-2009, 03:45 PM
peopleoftheway peopleoftheway is offline
 
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Hey Brother

If I may add my thoughts, bearing in mind these things are NOT doctrine nor are they something which Christians should lose fellowship over.
I am the same age as yourself, well a couple of years younger at 35. In my former conversation with the world I was heavily into "trance" music, 140bpm pounding beats and melodic riffs, the music enslaves through the tribal beats and seducing rhythms, it complimented the use of narcotics in much the same way that "rock" music does, its all in the beat.
Trance music, rock music, in fact any kind of beat driven music, rap, hip-hop
(you get the picture) uses the beat to catch and snare the "attention" of the listener, complimented with the melody they elevate the listeners perception, in fact its a lot more dangerous than that, when used in connection with drugs leads to an experience that is truly devilish and deceptive and as far from Godliness as possible.
Music that causes an "emotional" response through beats and melody is used more an more in the Charismatic / Pentecostal movement, (Eg Hillsong)
Their Music leaves the listener in an emotional "state" after listening that I find quite frightening (you tube some hillsong concerts to get the picture) its the same spirit that trance music evokes, its an emotional response that Charismatics will attest to being the same feeling as when they are "slain in the spirit" claiming it is Gods Glory "all over them"
This spirit is NOT of God, it is Kundalini (a brief description of what Kundalini is) Please understand my perspective on this is from someone who used to be enslaved by this "type" of Music under whatever guise it presented itself through, this is experience and not just here-say, I will follow this with scripture.

Kundalini is Occult plain and simple, it is new age witchcraft, without going into a lot of detail as I don't wish to give place to the occult, Kundalini is the uses of chakra's, mantras, yoga, spiritualism, beats and rhythms that shamen used to "elevate" themselves on spiritual plains (Necromancy, wizardry) all evil and straight from the pits of hell
In a book from a Kundlini disciple
Sri's Book--Kundalini, The Mother-Power
The author states

Quote:
Sri says, "Kundalini power can perform all kinds of miracles" (such as turning invisible and curing all kinds of diseases).
This spirit I believe is what is "present" in Charismatic Churches and the Holy Spirit of God within me is grieved when I see anything like that, its is straight from the devil himself.

The Bible forbids us to have any dealings with the occultic New-Age Movement.

Deuteronomy 18:10-12: "There shall not be found among you any one that maketh his son or his daughter to pass through the fire, or that useth divination, or an observer of times, or an enchanter, or a witch, Or a charmer, or a consulter with familiar spirits, or a wizard, or a necromancer. For all that do these things are an abomination unto the LORD..."

The emotional response from this "spirit" leaves people in the same state as I have witnessed people in after a rave event, and If you are reading this and involved in the Charismatic movement and you feel emotionally drained after going to "worship" or to "Church" ask yourself why, WHY would I feel like this, does the Lord Jesus Christ want me to feel emotionally drained after worshipping him? the answer is a resounding NO!

I am with you Brother on the Old time Blood bought Hymns, Fanny Crosby wrote some wonderful Christ Honouring Hymns.
Contempory Christian Music has spawned "Christian" rock (The term makes me shudder)
I have heard music from certain Christian rock groups that sounds no different from the world, been a part of a Church that promoted this music, beat driven loud rock music that drowns out the singings, yes it may be lyrics about Christ but is your heart fixed and focused on Christ when you are watching the young woman swaying her hips in the pew in front of you?
I doubt it ( of course this is an example, but it happens every Sunday in Churches around the world), entertainment rather than the Gospel, seductively swaying females gripped by the music, probably even unaware of the response the music promotes in them, and the effect their dancing may have on a struggling Brother (Christ is far from honoured here in such a case)

I may have rambled on a bit, but the bottom line is that Music, worship should in all cases Honour the Lord Jesus Christ and his Holy written word, if the Music your Church is promoting causes an emotional response that feels seducing, if it is based on "your feelings" rather than glorifying your Saviour then the chances are that God by his spirit is showing you that is is not right
Ecumenical Churches seem to have adopted the "Christian rock" genre as a means to bring folks to their Church to be entertained, a crowd pleaser, a numbers game, rather than drawing them to be saved by the hearing of the Gospel of Grace

1 Corinthians 10:19,20: "What say I then? that the idol is any thing, or that which is offered in sacrifice to idols is any thing? But I say, that the things which the Gentiles sacrifice, they sacrifice to devils, and not to God: and I would not that ye should have fellowship with devils."

Rock music in whatever form it takes is from the devil, you can dress up pounding beats, screeching Guitars, heavy bass with lyrics about Jesus all you want, at the end of the day is Christ being worshipped and honoured or are you being entertained?

Quote:
"Abstain from all appearance of evil" 1 Thessalonians 5:22
I for one love the old time Hymns having spent my Childhood in Gospel halls, I listen to Keith and Kristen Getty from time to time (They are from Northern Ireland) a little on the contemporary side but I feel that the lyrics honour the Lord, I am sure there are many more "artists" who honour the Lord with their music, but at the same time there are many who are claiming to "worship" The Lord Jesus Christ when in fact they are serving their own lusts and their own belly!

James 4:7: Submit yourselves therefore to God. Resist the devil, and he will flee from you.

Finally let me finish with

Philippians 2:5 Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus

I do not believe that Jesus would "rock out" if he came back today as many of the Charismatics and "Christian Rock" bands would say, I believe he would rebuke it strongly knowing it is NOT of God.
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Old 07-15-2009, 05:29 PM
Brother-Smith Brother-Smith is offline
 
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Default thanks

I am really glad to know that I am not the only one who sees this.
Thanks for the names of the music artists you mentioned, I will check them out.
  #4  
Old 07-15-2009, 07:01 PM
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Jassy Jassy is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brother-Smith View Post
I am really glad to know that I am not the only one who sees this.
Thanks for the names of the music artists you mentioned, I will check them out.
Brother-Smith, you're not the only one that sees this. Now this may seem a bit odd, coming from someone who is DEAF, but I did grow up able to hear for 22 years... and I had music training. I played the flute professionally, before becoming deaf, and I also taught music theory and flute lessons. That said, for a bit of background, I also was heavily-involved in going to rock concerts in the 1970's. I graduated high school in 1975. I had a friend that worked at the former Tick-a-Tron and I got 3rd row center seats for some of the most popular rock bands and artists of that time period. These included but are not limited to: Chicago, Led Zepplin, Queen, Heart, Foreigner, Kansas, ELO (the Electric Light Orchestra), ABBA, Pink Floyd, Aerosmith, etc. I could hear at that time and my father will tell you that's why I became Deaf. (Not true... but it probably didn't help!) I never did drugs (which I am VERY thankful for!) but I was heavily involved in going to those live rock concerts and listening to all of that music.

I remember the strange feeling you get in your bones... you can feel it literally reverberating in your skull and all of your bones. The vibrations from the guitars and drums is EERIE. It plays a counterpoint to your heart rate. I've read quite a lot about research that has been done regarding the bad health effects of rock music on the body.

I truly believe, looking back, that rock music is of the devil. Much of the music MESSAGE is subliminal. It's hidden in lyrics, it's hidden in dischorant chords, in symbolism, and in a frenzied beat that revs people up and gets them in sync with evil spirits. Yes, I believe that it does attract demons!!

I've found a few websites that you might want to take a look at, regarding this topic. Those will be listed below.

With the rap music and hip hop music of today, I am every thankful that I am DEAF and unable to hear music. I'll be honest here, it really would have been a difficult habit for me to break and, had I become a Christian who could still hear, I probably would have slid right into so-called "Christian" rock. Listen, it's in the BEAT, and the chords, as much as it is in the LYRICS. Satan wants to get the body worked up and share subliminal messages via this ungodly music.

Don't be fooled - "Christian" rock or rap is NOT CHRISTIAN!! I have attended some of these mega churches that attract teens by the thousands, because of their cool Youth Pastors and Christian Teen Music Programs. Many even have laser light shows. I have attended several churches, since becoming Deaf and - let me tell you - you DON'T have to be able to HEAR to know that it is EVIL. I felt surrounded by something very evil - while this heavy beat reverbrated through the chair that I sat upon. I wanted to RUN. All I could think was "This is NOT a HOUSE OF GOD!!" The true Body of Christ would not push this as Christian. But the COUNTERFEIT "Body of Satan" - that mascarades itself as Christian - WOULD.

Now, true the Bible is pretty silent on the TYPE of music. But use your common sense - would God use the SAME type of music, set to supposedly "godly lyrics" in a worship service? I can tell you, there was NOTHING Christian about it. Not being able to hear did not separate me from being able to FEEL - and the Holy Spirit was NOT present in these churches! But oh yes, there was another type of "spirit" there and it was NOT good!!

A lot of these rock albums have satanic pictures and symbols on them. If your teen has them in your home... it's like giving an invitation to evil spirits... that they are WELCOME there.

I won't be as "kind" as to say that I think it's up to you... or that it depends on the lyrics being sung. People don't care about the lyrics - they care about the FEELING that it gives them... and it's not a good one.

As the other brother stated, watching Christians swaying with the music, dancing seductively, just like people had done at those secular rock concerts that I attended in the 70s, doesn't give me the indication that these artists are Christian or that they are truly uplifting Christians in an appropriate manner.

That is my humble opinion on the matter, mixed with personal experience.

And now the various websites:

http://www.jesus-is-savior.com/Evils...vils_music.htm

http://www.jesus-is-savior.com/Evils...lls_bells1.htm

http://www.av1611.org/rock.html

http://www.goodfight.org/a_music_articles.html

Jassy
  #5  
Old 07-15-2009, 09:34 PM
Brother-Smith Brother-Smith is offline
 
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Default Thank You Jassy

Thanks Jassy,

I will check out your links as well. Thank you for sharing with me.

Your brother in Christ,

Me


P.S. I am waiting for those Chocolate chip cookies and milk.
I will take you up on the offer in the kitchen of the master Chef.
We can spend an afternoon talking and listening to music the way our creator intended it.

P.S.S. Flute huh? Cool! I was a double bassist in symphony orchestras all through my 20's. I saw the light, so to speak, and went into pop music again. Teaching is my primary focus but I play secular music. God is working on me and I am willing for him to show me what to do. I do pray the blockhead prayer about it. You know... "God? I am a blockhead... I know... make it real obvious for me, please? Thanks."
I do get a chance to share Christ with many people, on tour or in the nightclubs. It is tough sometimes though.
  #6  
Old 07-16-2009, 08:53 AM
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pbiwolski pbiwolski is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brother-Smith View Post
God is working on me and I am willing for him to show me what to do. I do pray the blockhead prayer about it. You know... "God? I am a blockhead... I know... make it real obvious for me, please? Thanks."
I do get a chance to share Christ with many people, on tour or in the nightclubs. It is tough sometimes though.
There's a man in my church that's talented musically and has played in a band for years. They played local venues - pretty much whatever was asked of them. He (with the other members) was a member of a typical community church. A little soft gospel message with a lot of worldly appeal in music, events, dress, etc. - everybody's happy but the Lord.

He has been in my church for the last year, but continued to play here and there in this band. He would tell me about it from time to time as we talked, and I would feel like blasting him with how wrong it was - the environment, the "fellowship", using (abusing!) the talent God gave him in an ungodly manner...

Nevertheless, I knew he was not mature in the Lord enough to receive such a "rebuke" so I prayed for him and watched him grow. Things in his life have fallen apart in some ways (for the good), the band doesn't seem to have time to get together anymore (for the good), and he is now questioning if playing in this band is even right in the first place.

All this to say it was getting him in a Bible preaching church, around Bible believing Christians (that try to live holy and sactified), and away from the rest that allowed him to grow into the understanding of what the Lord's mind is in this area of his life. The answer he needed (as well as you need perhaps) has always been in the pages of Scripture. The eyes of his understanding are what needed to be enlightened. God's mind over the matter was and is the same before the band was ever formed.

It took "the entrance of thy words" (Ps 119:130) to understand this. When the word of God enters and is received, whatever is being held onto (maybe just enjoying playing that music itself) by a deceitful heart must be released.

As far as I know, he's done with the band. He is as faithful a member as anyone in our church. He desires to sing, enjoys "talking Bible", and is everready to serve the Lord in the ministries at our church.

Here's a verse has helped me in the areas that I have allowed to be questionable.

II Cor. 7:1 Having therefore these promises, dearly beloved, let us cleanse ourselves from all filthiness of the flesh and spirit, perfecting holiness in the fear of God.
  #7  
Old 07-16-2009, 11:38 AM
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Cody1611 Cody1611 is offline
 
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I have a question for those who are conservative and do not like music such as CCM. I don't either, by the way. I only listen to Gospel Hymns. Anyways, how do you guys feel about electric instruments? Such as Bass.
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Old 07-16-2009, 11:44 AM
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PaulB PaulB is offline
 
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Default Genuine Worship

The way that I look at it is that music is a form of accompaniment and worship is the expressed revelation of the glory of God from the soul. When the two are in harmony together it is the most beautiful expression of spiritual light that can be witnessed on this side of eternity.

A lot of what is happening today in church services is nothing other than religious entertainment – I played the clubs for around 20 years (before I was a Christian) and believe me there is hardly any difference (solo breaks, loud and overpowering sound systems and all followed with applause).

The music what used to be preached against is now endorsed as the “what worship is all about” – today there is more spent on that particular “ministry” than almost anything else. The word used to dominate the conscience – now it seems to be the beat, the jive and the latest release.

Not only that – but the “worship” has exchanged spiritual revelation for emotional sentimentalism where light and fluffy words of romance have replaced the doctrinal truths that express the Scriptural the position that God has over us – rather than the buddy/lover who can’t manage without me!

You are right in recognising something in the Hymns, as these do tend to reflect a time in history where the people that wrote them knew their God in a ways that still speaks volumes. I often think that modern worship is being used in way where people are trying to summons God!
I have experienced jazzy services where the music has been so entertaining that at the end of it (whilst all are still buzzing) the pastor has said “Oh what a wonderful sense of the presence of the Holy Spirit”.
After which I have often thought to myself; that if the Holy Spirit were truly amongst us then the evidence of that would be far different than what it would be if I had just heard the last waltz.
I’m sure that He would have something to say about the couples in here who are living with people whom they ought not to be with and doing the things so openly that they should be ashamed of.

For me spiritual truth hits the heart and the songs that we sing are the expressions of that. The reason for the change today is like it is with everything else – they are board with what we have always had and they want to have a church that they can redesign, patent & enjoy.

I can’t imagine a collective people trying to sing some of these mushy love songs when the church enters into perilous times – as our forefathers did with the hymns that they knew to be true when they were often tested.

God bless

PaulB
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Old 07-16-2009, 12:00 PM
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greenbear greenbear is offline
 
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Great topic, Brother Smith. I love the old hymns saturated with doctrine and the praise and worship of Jesus and the Father. Like you my husband and I haven't been to church much since we were married 15 years ago. We could never find one that didn't have errors that we could live with so we eventually gave up looking. Back when I was a new christian I went to a couple of charismatic churches, esp. Vineyard. I remember how grieved my spirit was with the music. It was superficial, it was all about how "I" worship You. How are we worshiping the Lord by singing about what "I" am doing? Let's sing about what He has done!!! They would never sing about Jesus, either. They would just skip the verses about our Saviour. It was all about the Holy Spirit and the Father. I believe that was intentional. I believe the pastor practiced witchcraft while the singing was going on by calling on "god" to place his mantle over the congregation. I could actually feel a heavy spiritual presence enveloping me and I believe the other people there.

I believe that musical talent and inspiration comes from God. That said, I also believe Satan is the authority behind the music industry. I have linked a site that sells a 10 hour video expose called "They sold their souls for rock and roll" by Joseph Schimmel. There is also a 3 hour video available. I don't know how anybody who watches even an hour of that video could doubt that to make it in the Rock music industry you have to acknowledge Satan as lord and that the music and lyrics are purposely designed to attract demons to the hearer. The "beat" is taken straight from pagan religious ceremonies. "Christian" rock has become every bit as Satanic as secular Rock.

I will also include a link to "Inside The Laurel Canyon" which I found astonishing just when I thought I was beyond being astonished by anything.

It's really good to have you on this forum.

Jennifer

http://www.goodfight.org/store/resou...stsfrar10.html
  #10  
Old 07-16-2009, 03:04 PM
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Jassy Jassy is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brother-Smith View Post
Thanks Jassy,

I will check out your links as well. Thank you for sharing with me.

Your brother in Christ,

Me


P.S. I am waiting for those Chocolate chip cookies and milk.
I will take you up on the offer in the kitchen of the master Chef.
We can spend an afternoon talking and listening to music the way our creator intended it.

P.S.S. Flute huh? Cool! I was a double bassist in symphony orchestras all through my 20's. I saw the light, so to speak, and went into pop music again. Teaching is my primary focus but I play secular music. God is working on me and I am willing for him to show me what to do. I do pray the blockhead prayer about it. You know... "God? I am a blockhead... I know... make it real obvious for me, please? Thanks."
I do get a chance to share Christ with many people, on tour or in the nightclubs. It is tough sometimes though.
Brother-Smith, Let me know what you think of those websites. It helped me to see the truth about rock music and the connection with Satan that I believe that it has. My focus with the flute was mainly in classical music. I occasionally did some jazz and I also played solo for some wedding events.

Since I became a Christian AFTER becoming deaf, the only music I really remember being related to the Lord is the song "Amazing Grace." I've never really heard hymns. I grew up in the Catholic church and the Catholic church of the 60's and 70's was not exemplary regarding music in the church. I played briefly in a folk music group in the Catholic church, comprised of about 4 other members. We occasionally played music at services. I remember playing such secularly-popular, quasi-religious songs as "Michael rowed the boat ashore, hallelujah" - not quite a Gospel selection! If I could hear, now, I am certain that I would greatly love hearing the Psalms set to beautiful music - or other strongly doctrinal music.

I'll pray for the Lord to bring you into a right relationship with music, that will be in-line with His Word.

Sounds wonderful for the cookie chip cookies and milk, in our LORD's Heavenly kitchen, and a discussion of godly music!

Jassy
 

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