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Old 07-07-2009, 05:27 PM
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George George is offline
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Default Re: "CALVINISM: Sound Doctrine?"

Originally Posted by Gord View Post
"Brother George, with all due respect and love,
you call my summary statement "In other words God elected those for his glory and that is His Grace." my rejection.

It's really showing me that "human pride" really is stronger than one cares to admit or even notice within themselves. I thought I explained correctly that I wasn't a 'Georgist' and agreed that you aren't a Gordist, and you take that a rejection.

It's no wonder Mohandas Gandhi said "The only thing that keeps me from being a Christian, is Christians." They disguise their pride as did the Scribes and Pharisees behind the cloak of religion.

But what was I thinking, a Calvinist (reformed based on the word of God) on a KJV only Baptist based forum, we could learn from each other but not when only one side pays attention.

I apologize ahead of time, for also letting my pride take this to a personal level, so I will excuse myself.

I appreciate your study in opening my eyes to the truth, my payer is you will understand
Aloha brother Gord,

Now I am going to be real careful here - because I am not out to offend you in any way.

you said:
"Brother George, with all due respect and love, you call my summary statement "In other words God elected those for his glory and that is His Grace." my rejection."
But I said nothing of the kind. I never referred to your "summary statement" once. I never called your "summary statement": ""In other words God elected those for his glory and that is His Grace." - "my rejection. "I'm afraid that you are putting words in my mouth. The following is what I said:

My quote:
"You got it brother! "BELIEVING" IS NOT A "WORK"! I thought, with all of the Scripture and illustrations that I provided, that I made that clear in my studies, but either brother Gord REJECTS the teaching, or he MISSED it."
My comment was in relation to my belief (expressed in several of my Posts on Calvinism) that "BELIEVING" is NOT a "WORK". The verse that brother JohnG cited (I include Romans 4:4 for "context".) is one of the strongest verses in the Bible in support of my "belief":

Romans 4:4 Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt.
5 But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness. {Notice the "contrast" between "WORK" & "BELIEVING"?}

Now, I was in no way referring to your "summary statement", I was referring to the fact that you either "missed" (which was possible) what I taught, or you "REJECTED" (which is your prerogative) what I taught - your ""summary statement" was not included in my comments at all!

In your Post #129 you said:
"Brother George, please don't feel saddened or disappointed. I'm am really not sure why it's so important to 'pigeon hole' people of varying thoughts or believes into a label? The uniqueness of everyone's understanding of God's Grace is as varied as the stars in the sky, and soon we will run out of labels."
But there is such a thing as God's "TRUTH"; and our "understanding" (or inability to understand) does not ALTER that "TRUTH". God's "truth" is not as "varied as the stars in the sky". God's "TRUTH" is "RIGHT" - regardless of "everyone's understanding": [Psalms 33:4 For the word of the LORD is right; and all his works are done in truth.]

Your Post #129 continued:
"By your definition, and need to for lack of a better term, 'pigeon hole', then I am what you call a Calvinist. But like you I too do not agree entirely with all Calvin taught, nor Arminus, so in reality I am just a Gordist, and you would be a Georgeist."
As far as pigeon-holing believers, I don't believe I engage in the practice. If a person is a Baptist they ought to declare themselves so (and more power to them). Brother tonybones makes no "bones" about being a "hyper-dispensationalist" - he declared so when he joined this Forum. If you want to be a Calvinist, that's your business. I wasn't berating you with my comment, I was just stating the obvious - you either have "missed" what I taught or you have "rejected" it.

As to declaring what I am (I am NOT a Georgeist) - whenever I am asked, I simply say that I am a Bible believing Christian. I stopped calling myself anything with a "ITE" after it or a "IST" after it over 20 years ago. I refuse to follow men (even those men that I may admire). With whatever time I may have left on this earth I am going to try to follow the Apostle Paul (as he has instructed us) as he followed the Lord Jesus Christ.

Philippians 3:17 Brethren, be followers together of me, and mark them which walk so as ye have us for an ensample.

According to the biographies on Calvin - John Calvin did NOT follow Paul. Please check out my last lesson (Post #96) on Calvinism where I gave a short biography of John Calvin's life. Neither John Calvin nor his "exemplar" "Saint" Augustine were "exemplary" Christians {And certainly not somebody who we should be following!}.

Your Post #129 continued:
"You should be delighted that your study sparked me to look deeper and discover this great mystery of our Lord and Saviour, I know I sure am humbled to know that I had nothing to do with it. Please see my response to Brother Forest for my reasons of that excitement. I thank you for challenging my mind ."
WHY should I "be delighted"? IF what you now believe is really "true", then I am WRONG; and what I am teaching is "FALSE", and therefore I am found to be a "FALSE TEACHER"! IF, on the other hand, what you believe to be "true" is "FALSE", then you have embraced a "FALSE TEACHING" - there are NO "TWO WAYS" about it! One of us is "WRONG" - terribly "WRONG", WHY should I be "delighted" in that?

1 Corinthians 11:1 Be ye followers of me, even as I also am of Christ.

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