[Winman]

Amen Brother George!

Years ago I learned a valuable lesson. I used to go soul-winning on Saturday's with my pastor. I think he was the most godly man I've ever known, a terrific person, and smart too.

I remember one day we stopped at this house and a 30'ish lady invited us in. My pastor sat down with the lady and opened the Bible to show her verses on salvation. I sat quietly and observed. My job was to take care of kids and especially dogs. I used to laugh, my pastor said dogs worked for Satan, they will always try to distract you when leading someone to the Lord.

Anyway, no dogs or kids this day, but as my pastor showed the lady verses, a couple of times she said, "well, I don't believe that". Suddenly my pastor closed his Bible, stood up and very kindly thanked her for inviting us in. I was confused, because he had stopped short of leading her to the Lord.

When we got back out to the car, I asked my pastor why we had left so suddenly and why he hadn't tried to lead her to the Lord.

He said, "Didn't you hear her? She said she didn't believe the Bible. If you don't believe the Bible you cannot be saved."

He used to also say, "Those convinced against their will, are of the same opinion still."

I learned something important that day. You are just wasting your time trying to talk to people who do not believe the Bible. The best you can do is pray for them that the Lord will open their eyes and mind to believe.

And of course, the Lord said,

Matthew 7:6 Give not that which is holy unto the dogs, neither cast ye your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under their feet, and turn again and rend you.

These folks simply do not believe God's word.

[George]

Aloha brother Winman,

Your Pastor sounds like a very wise man!

I have never heard: "Those convinced against their will, are of the same opinion still"; but I have believed that for about 40 years now, and I intend to use what he said, because I have never heard it said so succinctly.

Back in 1969-1972, I once was largely responsible for convincing an Independent Baptist Church on Kauai about the King James Bible being God's Final Authority and that statement was written into the "Constitution and By-Laws of the church. Within 3 short years (after Bob Jones University graduates came and joined the church) most of the people abandoned their "belief" in THE BOOK" and have been on a down-hill slide ever since.

That sure was a blow to my PRIDE, but I learned a huge lesson from that incident. You can't "force" people to genuinely believe anything, and you can't (on your own) "persuade" people to believe something.

If the belief does not come from an individual's own heart, it's NOT REAL GENUINE BELIEF! It's an assent, or an acceptance, or an acknowledgment, or an occurence (with the mind - NOT the heart) to someone's ideas or someone Else's beliefs - but it's NOT TRUE BELIEF!

Keep up the good fight brother, it's really good to have you on board.

[Just_A_Thought]

Originally Posted by MC1171611

And we keep this joker around because why?

The statement follows verse SIX, not verse FIVE. To say that verse SEVEN is talking about verse FIVE and not verse SIX is STUPID because that is a grammatical ERROR to do something so ignorant.

I hugged my wife.
I killed a man.
They put me in jail.

In effect, you're saying that they put me in jail for hugging my wife. That's the ludicrous ignorance that you're pushing here, and I'm flat tired of it, as are all the people that actually BELIEVE THE BIBLE. You don't believe the Bible, we understand; but go to a forum where you can talk with other apostates who believe like you do. You'll be much happier there, trust me.

I was not aware that I was unhappy here. I enjoy reading the posts here. I may not agree but I grew up with the same beliefs you have for the most part. My parents are KJVO and I was until about a year ago. I understand the idea of preservation and I think there are better verses to try to prove it. I may not believe the Bible is preserved on earth but have nothing against those who do. I was not aware I was an apostate but thanks for pointing that out. I am glad to see you are throwing some punches at me after I did not insult or attack you in any way. Way to show a Christ-like attitude...

[Just_A_Thought]

Originally Posted by Bro. Parrish

LOL, well I've been taking a look at your past posts, and I'm starting to get a picture of exactly what YOU think about the Bible... I guess most CBDs like yourself are softcore individuals who wouldn't know truth from a shadow, as shown by your reply to Brother Tim below back in October...





These are your words from your silly thread here:
http://av1611.com/forums/showthread.php?t=649

Just today, you have attempted to cast MORE doubt on God's KJV, by starting a new thread here:
http://av1611.com/forums/showthread.php?t=917

And I think showing a little more of your leaven will put everything in perspective for the readers:





So there it is, like a dead fish on the beach.
No wonder you have a problem with preservation.
You appear to be just another confused Bible denier who thinks there is no such thing as an inerrant Bible on Earth. Your comments do nothing to build this forum, I am surprised they are allowed to remain here, since I'm afraid your views are part of the problem, not the solution. Old news.

Wow! I am not sure to people checking into me like this. It does not bother me though. I stand by all my previous posts.

Shadows are dark shadows created by light and an object blocking the light. Truth is something that is correct opposite of a lie or error. I do not, however, know what a CBD is.

I believe Jesus is the Word and He is in Heaven. I even have two verses to back my point. I am no Bible "denier".

They let me remain here because I do not name call or try to stir up trouble. Besides, if I was not here to challenge points then who would you have to criticize?

[Just_A_Thought]

Originally Posted by Winman

I am personally not too keen on elitist intellectual types. I believe in good old common sense. It is pretty easy to see where all these elitist folks are taking the economy right now. Yep, PhDs from Harvard and Yale, and they run a company into the ground. I am no scholar, but I have supported a family for many years and am not in debt whatsoever. These companies should hire some blue-collar types to run their companies, then maybe they would be making a profit.

Thank you! I have never been called a "elitist intellectual" before. I guess there is a first time for everything.

[Winman]

Just a Thought

I wasn't necessarily speaking of you personally as an intellectual.

You say Jesus is the Word and he is in Heaven. I agree.

But look what Jesus said to Nicodemus in John 3:13

John 3:13 And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.

Now, here was Jesus talking with Nicodemus face to face. And Jesus was clearly speaking of himself when he said "the Son of man". Then Jesus says that he is in heaven at that very moment (present tense).

How do you explain that? You do not seem to be able to believe that God's Word can be both in Heaven and on Earth at the same time, but Jesus said it was so.

[MC1171611]

Originally Posted by Winman

Just a Thought

I wasn't necessarily speaking of you personally as an intellectual.

You say Jesus is the Word and he is in Heaven. I agree.

But look what Jesus said to Nicodemus in John 3:13

John 3:13 And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.

Now, here was Jesus talking with Nicodemus face to face. And Jesus was clearly speaking of himself when he said "the Son of man". Then Jesus says that he is in heaven at that very moment (present tense).

How do you explain that? You do not seem to be able to believe that God's Word can be both in Heaven and on Earth at the same time, but Jesus said it was so.

AMEN BROTHER!

Unbelief is the bane of Christianity! Shine the Glorious Light of Truth (Jn. 17:17) and the rats scatter.

Here's something else for the apostates to choke on: Jesus Christ is called the Word of God; why? If God has a written word, why would Jesus need to be called the Word? Come on, hit 'em where it hurts!

[Winman]

Oh, there's more.

Matthew 18:20 For where two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst of them.


Matthew 28:20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen.

Originally Posted by Just_A_Thought

Truth is something that is correct opposite of a lie or error. I do not, however, know what a CBD is.

I believe Jesus is the Word and He is in Heaven. I even have two verses to back my point. I am no Bible "denier"..

A CBD is a "Confused Bible Denier."
I don't use it a lot, but it seems to fit when people like yourself come on here and start throwing around labels like "KJVO," back in post no. 95. One label deserves another.

And I'm sorry my friend, but you have already proven yourself to be a Bible denier, by spreading the false teaching that God's inerrant Word is not preserved on paper today in the KJV, and we do not know which manuscripts are correct. You not only deny the preservation of scripture, you are projecting your views as if they are FACT, as shown below in your own blunt statements. What else can we call you, a KJV DEFENDER? Come on now...

I'm not attacking you, and I hope you see fit to rise above your confusion, but let's be honest---you have positioned yourself on the opposite side of the very heart of this forum. That's not a good place to be, if you expect people to take you seriously.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Just_A_Thought
..."God did preserve His word...IN HEAVEN! ...we do not know which manuscripts are right. So we can not say which one is 100% accurate."

Quote:
Originally Posted by Just_A_Thought
"God's Word has always been and always will be. He never promised us we would always have it on paper or in the English tongue."

[Just_A_Thought]

Originally Posted by Winman

Just a Thought

I wasn't necessarily speaking of you personally as an intellectual.

You say Jesus is the Word and he is in Heaven. I agree.

But look what Jesus said to Nicodemus in John 3:13

John 3:13 And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.

Now, here was Jesus talking with Nicodemus face to face. And Jesus was clearly speaking of himself when he said "the Son of man". Then Jesus says that he is in heaven at that very moment (present tense).

How do you explain that? You do not seem to be able to believe that God's Word can be both in Heaven and on Earth at the same time, but Jesus said it was so.

I agree that Jesus can be both in Heaven and on earth at the same time. He is omnipresent but I do not agree with the Word on man made paper and man made ink is Jesus. He is the Word but we can not create Him. I have heard that the KJV is a living, breathing book. It is not only the Word of God but it is God. I can not agree with this if that is where you are going with this.