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Old 07-22-2009, 10:35 PM
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Diligent Diligent is offline
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Originally Posted by Amanda S. View Post
Who is "all their flocks" referring to?
Have you ever called your church "my church?" Does that mean it is under you or that you are somehow separate from everyone else in the church?

You asked for the definition of pastor, and I gave you the closest thing the Bible has to a definition of the word.

Are you suggesting that this verse means that the pastor happens to be a shepherd and therefore because he is brutish that his flocks will be scattered?????
That sentence makes no sense to me. I don't understand what you are asking, since I maintain that the pastor is not a shepherd -- unless you are reading a modern non-KJV (think about that for a minute!).

And if all the points made previously as to the fact that a pastor is to feed the sheep and be an overseer, and leader then none of it makes any sense? How does a sheep feed another sheep?? How does he care for the flock if he is one of the flock so to speak? In another place Paul says
And here is the crux of the matter: you are trying to defend Nicolaism and set the pastor as someone separate from the church he is supposed to be serving.

1Co 4:21 What will ye? shall I come unto you with a rod, or in love, and in the spirit of meekness?

A rod? So, he's not a shepherd, but God let's him use His rod? (Figuratively speaking)
I'm no shepherd, yet the Bible tells me to use a rod (Pr 23:13). Also, nobody alive today is in the same position Paul was in, so the comparison doesn't stand. (Also, I wonder if you could find a verse that ever calls Paul a pastor.)

And how come most of the verses with pastor in it also have a reference to sheep? There must be some connection there?
Of course there is a connection. That doesn't make pastor synonymous with shepherd.

Again in Jeremiah 23:1-4
1 Woe be unto the pastors that destroy and scatter the sheep of my pasture! saith the LORD.
2 Therefore thus saith the LORD God of Israel against the pastors that feed my people; Ye have scattered my flock, and driven them away, and have not visited them: behold, I will visit upon you the evil of your doings, saith the LORD.
3 And I will gather the remnant of my flock out of all countries whither I have driven them, and will bring them again to their folds; and they shall be fruitful and increase.
4 And I will set up shepherds over them which shall feed them: and they shall fear no more, nor be dismayed, neither shall they be lacking, saith the LORD.
You're not seriously applying these verses about Israel to the Church, are you? Besides, that passage proves pastors and shepherds are different.

The pastors are replaced with shepherds in the passage you quote.

I thought the Lord was the only shepherd?!
Insofar as the Body of Christ is concerned, he is the only one called a shepherd. (My prior statements should be understood in that context -- sorry if I wasn't clear enough.)


Joh 10:16 And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepherd.
This verse also gives a hint as to the difference between Israel and the Church. Of which are you?

Obviously all of you know that the very definition of pastor is shepherd.
There you go again, using that word. Obviously, it is not obvious.