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Old 08-01-2009, 09:58 AM
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pbiwolski pbiwolski is offline
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Penna.
Posts: 223

Originally Posted by PaulB View Post
But my question is……….what do you see in the Scriptures concerning soul sleep, believers going to heaven when they die or remaining in the grave as these people teach?
First, a big problem that I've seen with defending the truth about this issue is that so many (of us) misquote (continuously) their "pet verse" for their defense. Then they (rightly) accuse the cult of the same practice, but they themselves (many on this forum) have been guilty.

Watch closely. Here's everyone's "pull out the sword and slay'em" verses.

II Cor. 5:6-8

Therefore we are always confident, knowing that, whilst we are at home in the body, we are absent from the Lord: (For we walk by faith, not by sight:)We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord.

But...maybe you didn't notice that these verses DO NOT SAY what so many quote them as saying. Read again carefully. Does the Bible say "to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord?" Does it????

The cult member that is throughly trained will be quick to point this one out while you're the one "bleeding" on your porch.

The verses say that we are "willing be present with the Lord" as in it is our desire to be with the Lord and not in these bodies. It's true. These are not the "proof text" verses that so many use and misquote to each other. Be careful.

Now, the cults are famous for misapplying certain verses to one's eternal soul by divorcing the said verse from it's full context. For instance,

Ecc. 9:5
For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not any thing,...

Psalm 146:4
His breath goeth forth, he returneth to his earth; in that very day his thoughts perish.

They've also stated that to be "unclothed" (II Cor. 5:4) is to be in a unconscious state awaiting a new body (house).

These go along with the numerous references to death being termed "sleep."

John 11:11-14
11. These things said he: and after that he saith unto them, Our friend Lazarus sleepeth; but I go, that I may awake him out of sleep.
12. Then said his disciples, Lord, if he sleep, he shall do well.
13. Howbeit Jesus spake of his death: but they thought that he had spoken of taking of rest in sleep.
14. Then said Jesus unto them plainly, Lazarus is dead.

I Cor. 11:30 For this cause many are weak and sickly among you, and many sleep.

What they fail to see is the difference in the body, soul, and spirit - a difference which shows a complete separation at death.

The last verse in Gen 49 and the first of the next chapter read...
And when Jacob had made an end of commanding his sons, he gathered up his feet into the bed, and yielded up the ghost (SPIRIT), and was gathered unto his people (SOUL, NOT BODY). And Joseph fell upon his father's face (BODY), and wept upon him, and kissed him.

Jacob's soul departed his body at death just like his wife Rachel.

Gen 35:18
And it came to pass, as her soul was in departing, (for she died) that she called his name Benoni: but his father called him Benjamin.

Paul said "the time of my departure is at hand" and "...having a desire to depart, and to be with Christ; which is far better..." To depart is to leave the body at death. Here's Simeon in Luke 2:26-29:

And it was revealed unto him by the Holy Ghost, that he should not see death, before he had seen the Lord's Christ. And he came by the Spirit into the temple: and when the parents brought in the child Jesus, to do for him after the custom of the law, Then took he him up in his arms, and blessed God, and said, Lord, now lettest thou thy servant depart in peace, according to thy word:

How about what happened at the death of our Lord Jesus Christ?

BODY - Luke 23:52-53 This man went unto Pilate, and begged the body of Jesus. And he took it down, and wrapped it in linen, and laid it in a sepulchre that was hewn in stone, wherein never man before was laid.

SOUL - Acts 2:25-27 For David speaketh concerning him, I foresaw the Lord always before my face, for he is on my right hand, that I should not be moved: Therefore did my heart rejoice, and my tongue was glad; moreover also my flesh shall rest in hope: Because thou wilt not leave my soul in hell, neither wilt thou suffer thine Holy One to see corruption. (see Eph. 4 - Christ descended)

SPIRIT - Luke 23:46 And when Jesus had cried with a loud voice, he said, Father, into thy hands I commend my spirit: and having said thus, he gave up the ghost.

Did you notice what David said about the body of Jesus as quoted by Peter in Acts 2? "Moreover my flesh shall rest in hope"!!! The body was resting...asleep! The Bible refers to the body (not soul) as being asleep and waiting for its redemption.

Matt. 27:52
And the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose,