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Old 07-17-2009, 12:43 AM
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tonybones2112 tonybones2112 is offline
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Originally Posted by Luke View Post
It's not about reconciling the Bible and Ghandi. It matters not what Ghandi says or said.

It's about the Pauline Epistles and the rest of the word.

Psalm 5:5 is true. But in the OT, the words "sinners" is used mainly of the gentiles and those israelites that chose to worship idols. In the NT, it becomes a common term for all men. Psalm 5:5 is also written BEFORE the crucifixion

The Pauline Epistles and the gospel and epistles of John speak of Jesus being propitious to the point of infinite. Therefore, if Jesus is the propitiation, and God is satisfied with the blood sacrifice, there is no need for God to be angry NOW, as all man can freely come to Him, because Christ has removed the barrier between God and man. Throughout the Johannine & Pauline Epistles, we find many verses on love. John 3:16, Romans 5:8, Galatians 2:20 to name a few. God's love to all sinners was demonstrated on the cross, and God's eyes are fixed upon the blood and upon His Son, which appeases his wrath. However, when a man stands before the Throne of God without the blood, that's a whole other story, and I wouldn't want to be that man in that day.

There is nothing stopping a sinner coming to God today, because God is satisfied with Jesus Christ. God is not mad.

This teaching that God is continually mad is Roman Catholic. I find little scripture except for two Psalms. It seems whenever this topic comes up, rightly dividing gets thrown out the window and God becomes a God of hate, because of two verses written in and for another dispensation.

HOWEVER, having said that, I do not think it is acceptable to tell people that they are OKAY IN their sin. But rather than tell them "God hates you" as some streetpreachers do, a better solution would be to first warn them of coming judgment because of who they are (sinners), and what they have done (sins), and then to expain God's grace to them this hour, and not to tarry, for the blood is there for them to wash in, but when they stand before God, it won't be.

God bless

EDIT: An additional note - as I spoke before about rightly dividing, the context of the Psalm is "STAND IN GOD'S SIGHT". One could take this to mean - before the Great White Throne. There are many fools who unrighteously stand before God and blaspheme his name today, but nothing happens to them... but something will, when they are in God's sight.
No truer words were ever spoken, Luke. This is why I despise the ministry of Kirk Cameron so much, is his condemnatory manner with sinners and why I have refused some people to participate in the street ministry we have here.

I don't mean to stray from Amanda's question, I think she brings up however what is most important in the most important thing we exist for: Bearig Christ's name to Gentiles, kings, and children of Israel. I know of nowhere the phrase is found as quoted in Scripture with the exact wording, the precept is found in the Scriptures:

Ro 5:8 But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.
II Cor. 5:18 And all things are of God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation;
19 To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.
20 Now then we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God did beseech you by us: we pray you in Christís stead, be ye reconciled to God.

This is no "great commission" in the Scriptures, there are seven "great commissions" in the Scriptures. Five are to the 12 Apostles regarding the restoration of Israel, one to Paul personally, the last one in II Cor. is found above and the only operative one today.

Luke, I sense a compassion in sister Amanda for the lost, and I know your heart, and I'd be proud to have either or both on the street with me.

Grace and peace