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Old 03-11-2009, 01:08 AM
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stephanos stephanos is offline
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Wenatchee WA
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Originally Posted by tonybones2112 View Post
Originally Posted by stephanos View Post
Now I want to comment on inspiration. I don't think the translators of the KJB were inspired in the way that, say, Paul was. But I don't see how they could have produced a flawless rendition of God's Word without the Spirit guiding their hearts and minds. So, if God was guiding the hearts and minds of these fallible men to produce an infallible Book, what does it say about the process? I know that many moderate KJBO folks want to stay clear of those that believe the KJB translators were inspired, but what I keep being lead to think upon is that I don't see how uninspired men could have produced an inerrant and infallible Book without some mode of inspiration. What say ye?

Peace and Love,
I say , brother Stephen; in the same way I believe the Spirit guided the placement of chapter and verse divisions.
The entrance of thy words giveth light; it giveth understanding unto the simple. Psalm 119:130

In Him, Laura
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Although many Charismatics follow the original manuscript fraud, many fundamentalist Christians try and define "inspiration" as a Pentecostal-like Magic Trance you go into and write or speak via automatic writing, which is occultic and the belief of the Greeks, their "Muse" or "daemons" speaking to and through them. We need to abandon this pagan magic trance view of inspiration and define the word Biblically.

Square one is the oracles of God are given unto the Jews. God will speak through no one but of His chosen people for initial revelation. Now, what about the king's decree in Daniel? Well, the Gentile king wrote it but God works effectually in those who read the decree and believe God, so Daniel(a Jew)recorded it in his book.

Square two is words are inspired, men are not. Nowhere did Peter claim to be inspired. The OT prophets all exclaimed, thus saith the Lord, but not my words, not my opinions, but HIS words. God's words are ALIVE, as uranium is radioactive, sodium is not. When Jesus raised Lazarus, He did not snap His fingers, he SAID, Lazarus, come forth. No electrodes plugged into his neck like Frankenstein, God SPOKE him to life. Peter said, I am not in a trance, I am a holy man of God speaking God's words as moved by the Holy Ghost for this scribe to record. Paul can be said to be the closest to declaring he was "inspired", yet he said the THINGS I WRITE UNTO YOU, are THE commandments of THE LORD, NOT ME.

Let me give an example of inspiration:

John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

I just wrote those words. I am not in a trance. The Holy Ghost moved me to check the copy I read them from as Job 32:8 and II Timothy 3:16 commands to write them accurately with nothing added or left out. This passage in John is ALL Scripture, it is INSPIRED Scripture, it is God's living words that give life to a lost soul, that works effectually in those who believe it after reading it. It is GOD who does all that, not ME. I was MOVED of the Holy Ghost to give whoever is reading this a living copy of His living word. It's not ME who is inspired, it is the WORDS I WROTE that are inspired.

Now the question is asked, who decided the canon? The oracles of God, Jews. Deut.17 says the Levites were given custody of the OT writings. The Apostles were given custody of the NT. I believe John decided the canon of the NT, that may be conjecture but he was the apostle "who Jesus loved" and who He gave the Revelation through. Whoever decided the canon did it under God's inspiration and was a Jew, not a Gentile.

Is it outrageous to say that God collected an inspired copy of ALL the original manuscripts together in one volume for the first time in history in a common language worldwide(KJV)?
Is it outrageous that there is a resurrection of the dead, a flood of water covered the earth, a sea parted to the dry bottom for a nation to walk through, ot that a God would take the form of His creatures and die for them becasue they could not satisfy His Justice?

I'm still the new guy, one of them "dry cleaners" and I hope you all pardon me being so dogmatic. I believe we need to be dogmatic about the truth. This is my best description of inspiration. God is inspiration(noun), men are not inspired(verb), Gods words ARE.

Grace and peace to all

Why is it that you keep trying to remind us that you're a hyper-dispensationalist? Is this a fact, or is this what some call you?

Concerning inspiration, the Scriptures tell us that:

All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: (2 Timothy 3:16 KJV)

If what you're saying is the case (and I think of a truth it is) then that would say that "all Scripture is inspired of God" but it doesn't. It says that it is "given" by inspiration. Here is the mode:

For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost. (2 Peter 1:21 KJV)

So you're going to have to shew that these words are alive as you described them to be. I agree that they are, but when dealing with the doctrine of inspiration you need to get your mode right.

For Jesus' sake,