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Old 06-13-2009, 11:56 PM
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greenbear greenbear is offline
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Ohio
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brother Tim View Post
In the "Love/Race" thread that morphed into "saved/unsaved" discussion, several who often pointed out that there is no Scripture forbidding marriage between a Christian and non-Christian also without exception (that I can find) strongly explained that none would recommend or encourage such a marriage. My question is "Why?"

I stated that I could not counsel a believer to marry a non-believer. I would do all that I could to discourage such. Why? Because I believe that the Scriptures taken as a whole do not allow for such a choice, just as marrying a divorced person is not allowed.

George, Renee, Jennifer, and others:
What would you say to a person who came to you with this question. "I am in love with a person who does not believe in the Bible as the Word of God. We are compatible in many other areas and I have known this person for much of my life. We fit each other very well. Could you show me in Scripture where I am wrong to get married?"

Now this in no way gives me permission to reject those who have so married. Mercy and grace still overrule law. When my son announced that he was in love with a divorced woman, my wife and I did all we could to discourage the relationship. Despite our best efforts, it estranged our son from us and built a thick wall between us and his girlfriend. This went on for almost five years. As their relationship went all over the place, we tried to show as much compassion as humanly possible. As time went on, it appeared that they were moving apart. Then he went to Basic training. The distance created a bond. When he returned and it was evident that things were stronger than ever, I sat down with them and in essence split myself into two separate persons, parent and pastor. As a father, I was going to accept whatever decision that was made and love them both as only a father can. As a pastor, I warned them that their choice to get married would open the door for God's judgment as He chose. In either case, I would help however I could.
They married three days before he left for Iraq. We are working very hard to show my new daughter-in-law and our two new grandchildren that there is no condemnation with us. And yet, I know that there are dark times ahead.
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Tim,

I am sorry that you have had to deal with the heartbreak of having your son marry a divorced woman. I know that is not what a father hopes for his child. This issue is very troubling and hard to come to grips with.

Quote:
I stated that I could not counsel a believer to marry a non-believer. I would do all that I could to discourage such. Why?
Because I believe that the Scriptures taken as a whole do not allow for such a choice, just as marrying a divorced person is not allowed.
My answer to the question "Why?" would be simply because they will have trouble in the flesh. Unless the unsaved spouse becomes a believer the saved spouse will never know the full joys of a christian marriage. The children have a split and confused example and world view from their parents. There are so many reasons you could probably fill a library of books with them.

Why do you believe that the scriptures taken as a whole do not allow for such a choice? You are saying that you agree with Pam's position? What scriptures can you bring to the table to show that it is not allowed in the same way that marrying a divorced person is not allowed? There are verses that deal specifically with marrying divorced people. There are a couple of exceptions to that rule like if the divorcee is a believer married to an unbeliever who left him/her then they are free to remarry.

Quote:
George, Renee, Jennifer, and others:
What would you say to a person who came to you with this question. "I am in love with a person who does not believe in the Bible as the Word of God. We are compatible in many other areas and I have known this person for much of my life. We fit each other very well. Could you show me in Scripture where I am wrong to get married?"
I would probably refer the couple to Paul's instructions to husbands and wives. Perhaps scriptures on raising godly children. I would describe in vivid detail the problems they will encounter. What I would not do is to refer to various scriptures that have no direct bearing on the issue and /or take them out of their context and apply them in a way they weren't intended to be applied.

My overriding concern in the Love and Race thread has been the misapplication of scriptures by certain individuals in an attempt to try to back up their personal opinions with the Bible, whether it be inter-racial marriage or marriage between believers and unbelievers.

The dispensation of grace as I understand it has few commandments. There is the exhortation for wives to submit to their husbands as to the Lord, husbands to love their wives like Christ loves the church, women not to teach men and to be quiet in public assembly, not to divorce, not to marry a divorced person, no fornication, no adultery, if there are more I can't think of them right now. All of these things can be clearly and in more than one place shown to be taught.

The Bible is perfect and infinite. If man would take one word away from it or add one word to it the infinite perfection suffers. The Bible is a system that's completely integrated within itself. I'm sure Will Kinney or bibleprotector could explain what I'm trying to say much better than I am. I think there are unseen, unintended consequences to building any kind of teaching on verses that only seem to apply in some general way, or verses that when examined, don't apply at all. I don't think we should lean to our own understanding when interpreting the scriptures. We shouldn't make them mean something they don't because we think it would help us to do a good thing or accomplish a worthy purpose.

Proverbs 3:5 Trust in the LORD with all thine heart; and lean not unto thine own understanding.

2 Peter 3:16 As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction.

1 Corinthians 1:19 For it is written, I will destroy the wisdom of the wise, and will bring to nothing the understanding of the prudent.

Romans 11:33 O the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! how unsearchable are his judgments, and his ways past finding out!

George and Renee have obviously lived their lives closely connected to this issue. Renee seems to me to have expressed the deepest insight into God's purpose and provision for sinful man in this matter:
Quote:
Like the divorce issue; because of the hardness of our heart, God provided a way of not condemning interfaith marriages. It is not His will or His way, but His permissive will. He knows the deceitful heart of men and made a way by which the unsaved is sanctified. The saved cannot become unclean so God sanctifies the unsaved because they are one.
We must remember that God's purpose is to save whosoever will believe on His Son and His method is grace. His purpose is not to have us perfectly keep commandments and always make the right decisions. He knows that's not going to happen.

These questions can become so complex if you really think about them. For example, do two people become married in God's eyes when they sleep together? How many people are virgins when they marry, even within the church? Are they commiting adultery when they sleep with a second person? Are they commiting adultery when they finally marry? If you dig too deep you realize it becomes as much of a morass as the inter-racial marriage issue. That is, how to determine your exact mixture of different nationalities to find a suitable mate.

Jennifer

Last edited by greenbear; 06-14-2009 at 12:19 AM.