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Old 05-20-2009, 07:26 PM
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George George is offline
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Broken Arrow, Oklahoma
Posts: 891
Default RE: " Do you have to be KJVO to be here???"

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brother Tim View Post
George, if I understand you, you advocate total separation from others based on discordant doctrine. How then can you fellowship with those of us that view dispensations differently, either extreme on one end, such as Tony, or oppositely, folks as myself? I would think that you would find some common ground and have fellowship where you could. Yes, there can come a point where separation is necessary, like Paul and Barnabas, but that should be a last resort.

While we believers are all "traveling" along on the way to glory, some get off the path and fall behind. Hopefully there will be someone to show them how to get back on track (James 5:19-20). Others make their true nature known and quit the path, returning back to their wallow in the mud (1 John 2:19).

Aloha brother Tim,

WHY would you have any "difficulty" with (George's Post #149):
Quote:
"I can "fellowship" with Christians that do not believe as I do about the King James Bible - I CANNOT "fellowship" with those "Christians" who SUBTRACT from it; or ADD to it; or CHANGE it. And I especially want NOTHING TO DO with those "Christians" who will ATTACK it; RIDICULE it; and MALIGN it."
I don't know HOW I can be much clearer. I DRAW THE LINE with Bible "Correctors", "Deniers", or anyone else who "claims" to be a "Christian", but WHO "ADDS", "SUBTRACTS", "CHANGES", "MALIGNS", OR "RIDICULES" the HOLY Bible. (Do you do any of those things? NOT by your testimony & conduct here!)

You said:
Quote:
"George, if I understand you, you advocate total separation from others based on discordant doctrine."
Brother, you DON'T understand me. This is NOT about "discordant doctrine" {I am real tolerant - unless it involves clear HERESY}; this about someone (who "claims" to be a "Christian"), WHO is "messing" with the Holy words of God! WHY would I want to have ANYTHING to do with such a person? Do you consider "ADDING", "SUBTRACTING", "CHANGING", "MALIGNING", or "RIDICULING" the HOLY Bible A "MINOR OFFENSE"? If you don't - WHY do you bother with these people?

HOW do you know these people are "saved" - because they say so? Now I DON'T KNOW whether they are "saved" or not, but one thing's for sure - they sure don't act like it! {by their "words" and their "deeds" you couldn't tell}

Are you aware of Paul's WARNING?
Quote:
Acts 20:28 Take heed therefore unto yourselves, and to all the flock, over the which the Holy Ghost hath made you overseers, to feed the church of God, which he hath purchased with his own blood.
29 For I know this, that after my departing shall grievous wolves enter in among you, not sparing the flock.
30 Also of your own selves shall men arise, speaking perverse things, to draw away disciples after them.
31 Therefore watch, and remember, that by the space of three years I ceased not to warn every one night and day with tears.
Do you "think" that this only happened "back then" and is NOT occurring TODAY? Aren't you in the least "concerned" that perhaps some of these men (after all, you DON'T KNOW them - they are "STRANGERS") may possibly be:
Quote:
2 Corinthians 11:13 For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ.
14 And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light.
15 Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed
as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works.
If there is a possibility that "some" of these men may actually be "wolves in sheep's clothing" - WHY bother with ANY of them? Are you so "hard up" for "fellowship" that you are willing to risk "fellowshipping" with a "false teacher"; a "deceitful worker"; a "minister" of Satan? Before I "fellowship" with anyone who "calls himself" a "Christian", I first determine whether that man "ADDS", "SUBTRACTS", "CHANGES", "MALIGNS", OR "RIDICULES" the HOLY Bible, and IF HE DOES - I WILL HAVE NOTHING TO DO WITH HIM - and honestly & truthfully I cannot understand how any genuine Bible believer can (for any length of time).

Ephesians 5:11 And have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness, but rather reprove them.

If you cannot be at least "fairly sure" about their salvation (after all they are "strangers") - WHY bother with them? IF there is "chance" that some of them are "lost" (or worse - i.e. Satan's ministers) - WHY engage them in "meaningful dialogue"?

2 Corinthians 6:14 Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers: for what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness? and what communion hath light with darkness?
15 And what concord hath Christ with Belial? or what part hath he that believeth with an infidel?
16 And what agreement hath the temple of God with idols? for ye are the temple of the living God; as God hath said, I will dwell in them, and walk in them; and I will be their God, and they shall be my people.
17 Wherefore come out from among them, and be ye separate, saith the Lord, and touch not the unclean thing; and I will receive you,
18 And will be a Father unto you, and ye shall be my sons and daughters, saith the Lord Almighty.

I am far more "tolerant" (and so was the Lord Jesus Christ) of ordinary Christians, who in the flesh, may have problems with alcohol, smoking, drugs, sex, etc., than I am of some educated smart alack, (i.e a Pharisee - especially a "pastor") who believes he can CHANGE the words of God in the King James Bible, (and get away with it). I especially get upset when these people from FFF come here and stir up trouble. It should be obvious that they are NOT "sincere" and that have a "destructive agenda" - witness how many of them have been BANNED!

WHO do you "think" these verses apply to today - Just the Apostate Protestant churches?

1 Timothy 4:1 Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;
2 Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron;


2 Timothy 3:1 This know also, that in the last days perilous times shall come.
2 For men shall be lovers of their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy,
3 Without natural affection, trucebreakers, false accusers, incontinent, fierce, despisers of those that are good,
4 Traitors, heady, highminded, lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God;
5 Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.
6 For of this sort are they which creep into houses, and lead captive silly women laden with sins, led away with divers lusts,
7 Ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth.
8 Now as Jannes and Jambres withstood Moses, so do these also resist the truth: men of corrupt minds, reprobate concerning the faith.
9 But they shall proceed no further: for their folly shall be manifest unto all men, as theirs also was.
10 But thou hast fully known my doctrine, manner of life, purpose, faith, longsuffering, charity, patience,
11 Persecutions, afflictions, which came unto me at Antioch, at Iconium, at Lystra; what persecutions I endured: but out of them all the Lord delivered me.
12 Yea, and all that will live godly in Christ Jesus shall suffer persecution.
13 But evil men and seducers shall wax worse and worse, deceiving, and being deceived.


2 Timothy 4:1 I charge thee therefore before God, and the Lord Jesus Christ, who shall judge the quick and the dead at his appearing and his kingdom;
2 Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine.
3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;
4 And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.
5 But watch thou in all things, endure afflictions, do the work of an evangelist, make full proof of thy ministry.


Titus 3:10 A man that is an heretick after the first and second admonition reject;
11 Knowing that he that is such is subverted, and sinneth, being condemned of himself.


We have to be on guard, because Paul said that the "wolves in sheep's clothing" are going to come within the ranks of the "leaders" of the church - i.e. the "pastors' and "elders". Paul describes them as "grievous wolves"; "false apostles"; Satan's "ministers" (who "APPEAR" to be "sheep" but are in reality: "transformed as the ministers of righteousness").

I DON'T KNOW any of the men on the FFF, but I do judge their "words" & "conduct"; and have examined their "fruits" (both here on the AV1611 Forums and very briefly on the FFF), and truthfully - their "FRUITS" stink to high heaven!

Matthew 7:15 Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.
16 Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?
17 Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit.
18 A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.
19 Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.
20 Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.

Let's examine their "FRUITS" shall we?

Galatians 5:19 Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness,
20 Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,
21 Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.

22
But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,


And can you tell me WHY is it that so much of their "conduct" emulates the lost?

Romans 1:28 And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient;
29 Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder,
debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers,
30 Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents,
31 Without understanding, covenant breakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful:
32 Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them.


Ephesians 5:9 (For the fruit of the Spirit is in all goodness and righteousness and truth

I have a lot of Scriptural reasons (and there's lots more verses) not to "fellowship" or have anything to do with these men - perhaps you can give me some verses of Scripture as to WHY you bother with them.

And perhaps you can tell us, IF, after having spent whatever time you have with these men on FFF - have you ever "persuaded" even one of them to "your point of view"?

Since "strife" and "contention" follow these men wherever they go, as soon as I determine (by their "words" & "conduct") that they are insincere, disingenuous, deceitful, and deceptive - I reprove them or rebuke them and then I leave them alone; and refuse to have anything more to do with them. Anything more is just "an exercise in futility"!

Proverbs 17:14 The beginning of strife is as when one letteth out water: therefore leave off contention, before it be meddled with.

Proverbs 17:19 He loveth transgression that loveth strife: and he that exalteth his gate seeketh destruction.

Proverbs 13:10 Only by pride cometh contention: but with the well advised is wisdom.


Proverbs 22:10 Cast out the scorner, and contention shall go out; yea, strife and reproach shall cease.