View Single Post
Old 05-26-2009, 09:10 AM
George's Avatar
George George is offline
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Broken Arrow, Oklahoma
Posts: 891
Default Re: "Is water baptism for today?"

Originally Posted by Bro. Parrish View Post
George, don't take this the wrong way brother, but I have noticed that you are very willing to go on and on (in great detail) about several things on this thread, also you have responded with much effort to Chette here, but you have never really given hardly ANY ATTENTION AT ALL TO THE TOPIC of exactly why you think water baptism is for believers today, even though I asked you about it specifically. Why is that?
Aloha brother Parrish,

Please don't take this the wrong way brother, but I answered your question back in 05/13/09
"This I do know - water Baptism conveys no special “grace” on a believer, but on the other hand, since Paul did Baptize (1 Corinthians 1: 13-17 - which he did do & didn’t deny); and he is our “example” [1Corinthians 4:16; 11:1; Philippians 3:17], I believe that water Baptism is one of the two main “ordinances” for a New Testament church – especially since there is NO clear commandment PROHIBITING its practice."
My problem is simply - WHY is the practice of water Baptism so important that this Thread has over 200 Posts in it? If it is just an outward profession ("symbolic") of an inward work of Grace (being "Baptized" by the Holy Ghost - Acts 11:16) WHY make such a "big deal" over it? WHAT MORE do you want me to say? I have already said that I disagree with brother Tony on this issue, and am in agreement with you - I believe that water Baptism is for the church today.

My Post #188 was in reply to a request by brother Chette to state my belief about whether the "gospel" the Apostle Peter preached in Acts Chapter 2 was the SAME as the "Gospel" that Paul preached - as you claimed in your Post #181, where you tried to illustrate that the "gospel" Peter preached in Acts Chapter 2 is the SAME as Paul's "Gospel". My reply was an attempt on my part to refute your claim. {By going through the verses and demonstrating that they can not be the SAME.}

The fact that Peter's "message" had some of the same elements as Paul's "Gospel" doesn't prove that what Peter was preaching was the SAME as the "Gospel" that Paul called MY "GOSPEL". {If the "subject" of the Thread has changed - I didn't change it. I was just replying to your Post #181}

My Post #196 was in reply to your Post #189; brother Winman's Post #192; and brother fredoheaven's Post # 194.

I apologize for my Posts being so long, but I have Scriptural reasons for everything that I believe; and I can't explain some of the reasons that I believe something in just a paragraph or two.

I am disappointed that, if you believe that I am wrong in my exposition of Acts Chapters 2 & 3, you haven't refuted my claims (with Scripture) rather than criticize me for not answering your question about water Baptism to your satisfaction, and intimating that I have veered off of the "Topic" of the Thread.

We are not talking about false doctrine or "heresy" here; we are discussing whether the word "gospel", as found in the Holy Bible, has always the SAME meaning. And whether the "gospel" that Peter preached in Acts Chapters 2 & 3 is the SAME as Paul's "Gospel". According to you, they are the SAME. I have gone to some length to demonstrate that they are NOT the SAME.

There is no reason to get upset or put out with me - if you believe that I am wrong, well then "prove it" (through the Scriptures). And if you don't care to disprove what I have presented, that's fine with me also. My beliefs are founded in the Scriptures; and on occasion, I can be (and have been) "wrong" about a Scriptural issue. If I am wrong on this issue, I am willing to change my belief - IF you can point out (from the Scriptures) where I am in error.

I am prepared to go through the Book of Acts (Chapter by Chapter) and demonstrate (over and over again) WHY the first few Chapters of Acts (Acts Chapters 1 -7) are "transitional", and WHY the "message" (words) that Peter and the rest of the Apostles and Disciples of the Lord were speaking was NOT the SAME as the "message" (words) that the Apostle Paul spoke after his "call".

I am prepared to demonstrate (by the Scriptures) that AFTER the stoning of Stephen ("symbolic" of the REJECTION of Christ in the persons of His Disciples by the nation of Israel's leaders - AGAIN! ) that Peter and the rest of the Apostles and Disciples, through the leading of the Holy Spirit, gradually (and "reluctantly" to begin with) turned to the Gentiles (Acts Chapters 8 - 10); and that with the call of the Apostle Paul (the Apostle to the Gentiles) - how that God sent him throughout the Mediterranean area spreading his "Gospel" (MY "GOSPEL") - the "Gospel of the Grace of God" (NOT the "gospel" of the Kingdom) wherever he went {to the Jew first; and also to the Greek" - Romans 1:16}.

Now you don't have to believe what I believe concerning these issues in the Book of Acts, but unless you can refute those beliefs (with Scripture) you shouldn't be "too critical" of them. You don't have to "accept" my beliefs, but you shouldn't think any LESS of me for believing the way that I do, if you cannot disprove (with Scripture) those beliefs.

I can drop this issue here and now, or I can go on with an exposition of the DIFFERENCE between HOW the Jews (Hebrews/Israelites) were saved in Acts Chapter 2 and HOW the Gentiles were saved in Acts Chapter 10. We are commanded to "rightly" divide "the word of truth" [2 timothy 2:15]. There are DIVISIONS in the Holy word of God; and "rightly dividing" the words in the Book of Acts is no simple chore, but if we want God's "approval" and if we don't want to be "ashamed" (for failing to "rightly divide"), we should thoroughly "study" these things out for ourselves and try to determine the TRUTH.

2 Timothy 2:14
Of these things put them in remembrance, charging them before the Lord that they strive not about words to no profit, but to the subverting of the hearers.
15 Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.