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But at the same time we still do, say, and think sinful acts, unrighteousness, and ungodliness. Quote:
Scott, I think you and People are saying the same thing. Both aspects apply. Our position in Christ is absolutely perfect. Our daily mortal life is still plagued with sins of thought, word, and deed. I think Romans 6, 7, and 8 deal with both sides of the issue. We conclude then that, "For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him" (2 Corinthians 5:21). "But we are all as an unclean thing, and all our righteousnesses are as filthy rags; and we all do fade as a leaf; and our iniquities, like the wind, have taken us away" (Isaiah 64:6). Peace and love, Brethren. |
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The purpose of me doing this, is try to please God as much as possible, and to try to end up in Hell. I'm not saying that a man can be justified by the law. I'm just saying that I'm trying to please God as much as possible. I know that I am saved by grace and all. Also, I know that if I can end up in Heaven if I sin more or less. However, the reason that I try to sin as less as possible, is that that God would be more pleased. |
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I disagree with this. |
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This is what I'm saying that a Christian can sin in his life. However, the sin should not appear every day. If the sin appears every day, then we are in an addiction of some sort. If we are in an addiction, then we need to pray and ask God for freedom from the addiction. What I'm trying to say, is that we should not sin every single day. If we do sin, then what are different from an unsaved person? What I'm saying that a Christian can sin once in a while, because the Christian did was not on guard. But the Christian should not sin regularly. Also, the Christian try his best to not sin. |
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How do you exaplain the phrase "go and sin no more" (John 5:14) |
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Thanks for answering my question. This answer, along with statements made by you in other posts make it clear that you are following a works based gospel. Whithout getting too personal, I would be interested to know what type of grounding you have had in Biblical study....were you involved with the Jehovas Witness's, Mormons or maybe have a Catholic background? In the meantime take the time to read carefully Hebrew chapter 10, at least 3 times, slowly and with concentration on each and every WORD that God wrote there. fundy |
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them. So I don't rely on the Bible schools anymore to form my doctrines. However, I still will finish the Bible school to receive certificates and college credits. I like to talk to other people who have different biblical beliefs, in order to see if I have a misunderstanding of the Bible. Really, if you come to my church, it would be hard to place a specific denomination on it. So we are non-denominational. What denomination are you? |
Today, at the church, people were discussing different topics. One person said that almost every day, Saten sends thoughts of sin to us. If we reject the thought, we have not sinned. If we accept the thought, we did sin.
For example, a person often recieves thoughts to lie, steal, commit adultry, or to do any sin. If the person accept the thought, and thinks, "This is a good idea", then the person has sinned. If the person rejects the thought, and thinks " Saten, get away from me", then the person did not sin. If you think about it, this is exactly what happened to Jesus when he was tempted. Since Jesus rejected all of the thought of saten, Jesus did not sin. I mean common, Jesus had thoughts of suicide, pride, lust of material possesions, and some other bad thoughts. Since Jesus rejected all of those thoughts, he did not sin. If a person says that he sins every days, then it's either the person misunderstands the Bible, or really does sin every day. If the person misunderstands the Bible, then that person thinks that he has sinned when a bad thought entered his brain. The person thinks that he that even thought he has rejected the though, he has sinned. However, that is not true. For if a person rejects a sinful thought, then the person has not sinned. If really does sin every day, then the person accepts every sinful thought that enters his brain every day. |
wwjd...I see now that your greatest need is to truly know the holiness, righteousness, purity, perfection, power, glory, might, strength, honor, riches, and eternal existence of God which is revealed to us in the Person of the Lord Jesus Christ.
When you, "...grow in grace, and in the knowledge of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ. To him be glory both now and for ever" (2 Peter 3:18), then and only then will you know how utterly wretched we are in our present mortal condition and understand that Jesus alone is our righteousness and victory! |
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If you worked to get saved, then you could lose your salvation. However, since Jesus did all the work, He keeps our salvation, and we cannot lose it even if we wanted to, and tried to. "And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand. My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand." (John 10:28, 29) Quote:
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And we know where we're going when we die, and we know He won't let us go...ever. We belong to Him. "That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me." (John 17:21) Quote:
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We sometime are so enmeshed with our short comings we just continue in our own view of ourselves rather that acknowledging how God see us. God is not lying his saint are not sinners, they are washed, cleaned and filled with the Holy Ghost. |
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You never did answer if Jesus took all you sin how much do you have? Jesus is bigger than your sin, even if you think you are such a big sinner. I fell sorry for you, what you call me your are walking in. ~Dedicated Service Romans 12:1 I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service. Romans 12:2 And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God. Romans 12:3 For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith. be healed, be transformed, God loves you |
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How about Psalms 119:11 Thy word have I hid in mine heart, that I might not sin against thee. God's word is very powerful, the traditions of men make God's word of none effect. |
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Amen! It says nothing about them being "sinless" at the time. They were cleansed by Christ, through their faith in Him! Judas was not cleansed because he didn't trust Christ, he was the betrayer. |
Scott, when I said I got drunk, that was before I was right with God. I don't go out now and get drunk.
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Now let me make something very clear to you, when I say that I am a "big sinner" as you put it, I am DECLARING TO THE WHOLE WORLD that Christ saved me FROM MY SINS and I Still feel wretched in his presence as I AM NOTHING and he made me something that I am not worthy of. Please do NOT feel sorry for me, My life IS TRANSFORMED, I KNOW God's love and BY HIS STRIPES I AM HEALED. |
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Ok, well what if a person come to God with a clean heart, and says "God, I'm sorry that I did bad things in the past. I want my sins forgiven, and I want to be saved" Do God forgive that person's sins at that moment? Is the the person saved at that moment? If the person dies the next day, would he go to heaven, or to hell? Then a year later, the person says to God, "God I do not wish to serve you anymore. Also, I do not want to have salvation" Is the person saved anymore? If the person dies the next day, would he go to Heaven or to Hell? Throught this example, I understand, that a person can have salvation, and then lose it. Another questions, What if a saved person sins with "the unforgiveable sin"? Is that person still saved? |
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The reason that God punished Moses, is that Moses saw the glory of God, knew God, and yet sinned. Notice that God did not punish Moses for killing, because at that time, Moses did not personally speak with God. God punished Moses when Moses knew God and sinned. In other words, If Moses would not sin after speaking with GOD, then Moses would have entered the promise land. Since Moses did commit one sin after being so close to God, then Moses was punished, and was not able to enter the promise land. |
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There is no prerequisite for salvation, except a willingness to admit that you are a sinner, and need the Lord to save you. It doesn't matter what horrible sins you have or have not committed, you just have to be willing to accept God's offer of salvation. Quote:
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The Lord says that we are sealed unto the day of redemption when we are born again, we are indwelt by the Holy Spirit, and have everlasting/eternal life. No, once you are truly saved, you cannot do anything to lose it. Quote:
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And since we're not able to save ourselves, we're certainly not able to 'un-save' ourselves. Quote:
Your turn. What did you think of the answers I gave you before? Do you have questions? Do you have doubts? What did you think? |
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Keep in mind that God has given us free will. Therefore, if we are in God's hand, we have the option to stay or to leave. However, no one can forse us out of God's hand. The only way that we can leave God's hand, is if we chose to do so with our own will. Quote:
What if a human want to stop being in God's hand? Does that mean that God will still hold the person in the hand? They were clean, washed of their sins, by their faith. However, they, as we, pick up daily dirt on our feet, we 'sin' in little ways even if we're very good. That's why we need to ask the Lord to forgive us and to cleanse us, daily, to get the 'dirt' off our feet. [/QUOTE] Like I said about the temptations of Jesus. (Matthew 4:1-10) That if a bad thought comes into your mind, and you accept the thought, then you sinned. If a bad thought comes into your mind, and you reject the thought, then you do not sin. According to your theory, Jesus sinned, while being in the desert, because there came bad thoughts into the head of Jesus. |
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You know, If you read the explanition of this parable, then you will see that some people truly come to God, and then fall away from God(Mat 13:20-21) The parable is in Matthew 13:18-23 Quote:
I was trying to ask "What if a saved person speaketh against the Holy Ghost?" Is he still saved or not Quote:
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"And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand. My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand. I and my Father are one." (John 10:28-30) Where does it say "If the person wants to be with God"? It doesn't. Where does it infer "If the person wants to be with God"? It doesn't. What does it say? 1) God gives us eternal life 2) We will never perish 3) No man can pluck them out of God's hand 4) God the Father, is greater than all 5) No man can pluck them out of God's hand 6) Jesus the Son and God the Father are one It does not say that we "will never perish unless we decide to not be with God anymore". Also, there's the difficulty of being forever sealed and indwelt: "And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption." (Ephesians 4:30) Sealed until the day of redemption. We also are part of Jesus once we are His, so how could we 'undo' that merger with the most powerful being in the universe? Is any of us that mighty? "For the which cause I also suffer these things: nevertheless I am not ashamed: for I know whom I have believed, and am persuaded that he is able to keep that which I have committed unto him against that day." (2 Timothy 1:12) "And now I am no more in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to thee. Holy Father, keep through thine own name those whom thou hast given me, that they may be one, as we are." (John 17:11) "Now he which stablisheth us with you in Christ, and hath anointed us, is God; Who hath also sealed us, and given the earnest of the Spirit in our hearts." (2 Corinthians 1:21, 22) God 'keeps' us, and 'seals' us once we are born again. Quote:
Why are you so eager to prove that you can lose your salvation? Is it because you feel that you have to do something in order to keep it? If that were so, then what was the point of Jesus dying on the cross? I mean, if you have to do something like keep the Commandments in order to keep your salvation, then you're making my Lord and Saviour into a pretty poor administrator of His grace and mercy. Most people I have met who insist that they have to 'do' something in order to 'keep' their salvation or even to 'earn' it, are trying to 'save' themselves, making the cross of none effect, basically saying that they don't need God to do anything, they can handle their own salvation, thankyouverymuch.... And do not forget... "What? know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own? For ye are bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body, and in your spirit, which are God's." (1 Corinthians 6:19,20) Once you have given yourself to God, have been born again, YOU ARE NOT YOUR OWN, YOU ARE BOUGHT (and owned) BY GOD. So, who is any one of us to say that our life is our own, once we have been saved? Once we are bought by His blood, He cannot deny us. "If we believe not, yet he abideth faithful: he cannot deny himself." (2 Timothy 2:13) Quote:
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The rest you added, I did not say it. I've already addressed the 'sin as much' as you want, idea, in a previous post. Nice try. :D Quote:
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Let me ask you three questions: When did you get born again? Has it been a year, yet? Do you want to be 'unsaved'? Just curious, it seems to border on an obsession with you. Quote:
I'll answer the rest in a bit, I'd like to see your response, first. :) |
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I await your answers to my answers to your questions... :D |
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non-denominational churches can more often than not be better described as "non-directional", in my opinion. This is the impression that I get about you from reading your posts. You seem to believe that it is your effort in obtaining Gods approval that is the primary factor in your salvation rather than Christs sacrifice, and that it is your own efforts rather than Christs that keeps you saved. This is not the Gospel of Christ, it is the gospel of cults such as the Jehovas Witnesses and other groups that do not hold the KJB as the final authority in all things. Hopefully you will read and understand the many good replies given to you by Bible believing Christians here on this site and you will come to a true understanding and acceptance of salvation. fundy |
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Jeremiah 17:9 The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked: who can know it?If you think someone has to have a "clean heart" to be saved, then you've put salvation out of reach. Your works-based gospel is false from the first assumption. |
I think we are to try as hard as we can to live as perfect as we can and please God in every way. I think for us ( as human beings ) to as perfect as Christ would be close to impossible because Jesus was perfect in every way. He came to do the will of His Father and nothing or no one would stop him and He did just that ! Living a godly live, as a light in the darkness, shining for the sinners, leading them and guiding them in the direction, away from evil, to the Lord through our faith and trust in God.
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http://av1611.com/forums/showthread.php?t=629 |
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Much Love in Christ, Stephen |
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