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-   -   Sam Gipp's degree (https://av1611.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1224)

peopleoftheway 05-14-2009 02:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tonybones2112 (Post 19749)
BTW, what is your IQ brother? It's important to know whether mines exceeds it or not.

Grace and peace

Tony:jaw:

Well My Internet Quota for the moment is quite High, I think I may be online too much, how about you ?:D

Greektim 05-14-2009 04:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by peopleoftheway
The reason this thread stirred up much controversy is the belief that some folks have that in order to be a Pastor / teacher / Evangelist a degree is needed or some kind of formal qualification to go out and "Preach the word" and this is just not the case.

I am not sure I agree with this. Can you point to the person and post that such a claim was made?

Bro. Parrish 05-14-2009 05:31 AM

Alas, it appears that some of the Bible correcting pink panty brethren have taken it upon themselves to use this issue to bash Bro. Gipp and the KJV:
http://www.fundamentalforums.com/bib...confusion.html

OOOPS, sorry Greektim, did I "drop a bomb" on you? :rolleyes:

peopleoftheway 05-14-2009 05:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Greektim (Post 19754)
I am not sure I agree with this. Can you point to the person and post that such a claim was made?

Quote:

Originally Posted by peopleoftheway
The reason this thread stirred up much controversy is the belief that some folks have that in order to be a Pastor / teacher / Evangelist a degree is needed or some kind of formal qualification to go out and "Preach the word" and this is just not the
Its the belief people have in this "requirement" to Preach I am refuting, and the controversy surrounding a mans "qualifications", I know of plenty of people who think that a pastor with Doctorate's and degrees is more suited to "Preach the word" than anyone else. If i had specifically targeted that statement for anyone on this forum I would have addressed them with that post.
Do you believe a man needs formal qualifications to be apt to teach and preach the word of God?

peopleoftheway 05-14-2009 06:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bro. Parrish (Post 19758)
Alas, it appears that some of the Bible correcting pink panty brethren have taken it upon themselves to use this issue to bash Bro. Gipp and the KJV:
http://www.fundamentalforums.com/bib...confusion.html

OOOPS, sorry Greektim, did I "drop a bomb" on you? :rolleyes:

The simple "question" that started this thread has turned out just how many knew it would from the get Go, in maligning a Bible believer, his qualifications and his integrity. And showing your little forum over there how harsh and unloving us bible believers are. :tsk:

1 Timothy 6:4 He is proud, knowing nothing, but doting about questions and strifes of words, whereof cometh envy, strife, railings, evil surmisings,

Proverbs 13:10 Only by pride cometh contention: but with the well advised is wisdom.

Greektim 05-14-2009 06:07 AM

You did nothing to me. In no way did I mention anything to do w/ Gipp's degree in relation to the video that I posted (which was only posted b/c I found it around the same time about this discussion of Gipp). I will agree that there are some on the FFF that are un-Christlike. But I never maligned him as you say. So no worries.

Bro. Parrish 05-14-2009 06:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by peopleoftheway (Post 19759)
Do you believe a man needs formal qualifications to be apt to teach and preach the word of God?

LOL, we might be giving Timmy too much credit brother.
It seems Timmy still hasn't even figured out what the Word of God is yet, much less who is qualified to teach.

Timmy quote: "I am extremely against the KJV only view."

Pastorpat 05-14-2009 07:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tonybones2112 (Post 19749)
I've spoken to people who make Gipp the subject, not his book. for some odd reason(I guess laziness)they prefer not to address the book point by point as most do not seem to have the wits to, but must undermine the messenger. The arguments I have seen are state accreditation of the school Gipp got his degree, if that is impeached his whole work is impeached, so goes the train of thought.

I guess that impeaches Simon Peter also, a mere fisherman, Matthew, who was an IRS agent and bookkeeper, and several apostles whose visible means of support are not named and a Nazarene carpenter of questionable parentage.

BTW, what is your IQ brother? It's important to know whether mines exceeds it or not.

Grace and peace

Tony:jaw:

It is very simple for me. I have a large library. I believe in every book I have, the author if he has some credentials never fails to put where he got those credentials. When I received the book, having never heard of Gipp, I was immidiately curious as to where he got his degree. It is the only book I have ever read where I still can't find out where he got his degree.

As far as I am concerned, I don't care whether a Bible college or seminiary is accredited or not. I attended one that wasn't accredited at the time but in the 20 years since, has gotten accredited. Makes no difference to me as long as they have a sound doctrinal statement and have integrity to teach according to that doctrinal statement. I think it is great that a church would have its own Bible school. In my opinion, that would be a great function of the local church.

As far as your concern as to my IQ compared to yours, I am not sure of what you mean by that or the spirit behind it.

Pastor Pat

Luke 05-14-2009 02:58 PM

The FFF are a bunch of fools. Almost every last one of them. I got my problems I know, but I don't pretend I don't.

They won't face the actual doctrine at all..

Do they want some ammunition to actually mock him about? Well, have a read of his commentary on the book of Acts. I won't say exactly what is in it that they will rant and rave about, but they will find something BIG! (If I do mention is specifically, they will all just quote me, even though I've never read it. Gipp told me about it over breakfast one morning and said all his notes on this particular view of his were in his book on Acts).

There argument goes like this

Gipp got his degree from PBI. Ruckman runs PBI. Ruckman is weird. Sam Gipp is weird. His degree is weird. Everything he writes is weird. Let's disregard it all because of that. If we can make people THINK he is bonkers, they won't actually read anything he wrote, but instead, copy and paste from me or someone else to support their reasoning. It's what they all do with Ruckman.

Test it. Start a thread on Ruckman on the FFF... say "Can I please have the address to Peter Ruckman's Bookstore Website". In 5 seconds, you'll have a bunch of parrots posting David Cloud's "expose" of Black is Beautiful, even though the thread had nothing to do with BiB.

I bet half of them own Lawrence Vance's "The Otherside of Calvinism". Vance was a PBI grad as well.

ChaplainPaul 05-14-2009 05:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by peopleoftheway
The reason this thread stirred up much controversy is the belief that some folks have that in order to be a Pastor / teacher / Evangelist a degree is needed or some kind of formal qualification to go out and "Preach the word" and this is just not the case.
Quote:

Originally Posted by Greektim (Post 19754)
I am not sure I agree with this. Can you point to the person and post that such a claim was made?

For example, you can look at the Gail Riplinger thread on the FFF forum and discover some of our friends using her secular degree to say she doesn't know anything about theology and shouldn't be writing on it. They used her degree in basketweaving or whatever it is as an "in" to malign her character. When I first started posting on that forum, they tried to bring my education into question, too, trying to fish for ammunition to use against me.

In general, in the Southern Baptist Convention, people look at the Master of Divinity degree as the professional qualification of a full-time pastor. In the land of the hirelings, if you don't have a degree, you're not getting a decent church-job.

Inquiring about the education of an opponent on a site which advocates a position you are extremely against can look like an "in" to malign his character because it is often used in this manner.

tonybones2112 05-14-2009 05:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by peopleoftheway (Post 19752)
Well My Internet Quota for the moment is quite High, I think I may be online too much, how about you ?:D

I must admit I spend a great deal of time at Crazy Crow Trading Post and Moscow Hide and Furs and not enough time amongst my cult following.

:D

Jeremy 05-14-2009 06:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Luke (Post 19805)
The FFF are a bunch of fools. Almost every last one of them. I got my problems I know, but I don't pretend I don't.

There argument goes like this

Gipp got his degree from PBI. Ruckman runs PBI. Ruckman is weird. Sam Gipp is weird. His degree is weird. Everything he writes is weird. Let's disregard it all because of that. If we can make people THINK he is bonkers, they won't actually read anything he wrote, but instead, copy and paste from me or someone else to support their reasoning. It's what they all do with Ruckman.

Yeah,so we are suppose to listen to a person who has a skull and cross bones for an avatar.:pound:

tonybones2112 05-14-2009 06:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Luke (Post 19750)
You know.. local church colleges with no 501c3 status or other government accreditation doesn't mean that they are diploma mills.

People work hard for those degrees, regardless of whether or not they COST $100 or $10,000.

You can't put a price on the study of God's word. And just because someone went to a great college doesn't make them a good student of the word.

Paul said he became all things to all men. His status as a Pharisee allowed him access to the synagogues, his status as a Roman citizen also allowed him a get out of jail free card for the jail at Philippi. Paul was certainly one of the most well educated men of his time. I know Dr. Ruckman's school is by no means a diploma mill, you have to move to Pensacola, find a job and a place to live as they have no dormitories and it's at least 2 years of rock hard Bible study. My buddy Pastor Jordan has for the last 25 years had what his church calls Grace School Of The Bible. It's straight bible study where he teaches through video. He issues no degrees but I think you have the option to be ordained. It's like 100, 200 bucks or something, most of that is just shipping for the videos.

I dont begrudge a man a degree, we have to keep it in perspective that God is not a respector of persons. OIf that degree is used to open doors of opportunity then all the better.

Grace and peace Luke

Tony

Luke 05-14-2009 09:36 PM

That clip they posted is three minutes of a 3 hour debate. The debate is really good to watch. For most of the debate, Gipp and the other KJB guy own them. Then they keep asking this dumb question about "where was the Bible before 1611". They actually cut a bit out where an editor of the NKJV loses his voice for a few minutes.

Sam Gipp answers honestly - WHO CARES! He wasn't there, so why does anyone care. Gipp owns this debate. White and Wallace are childish and continually interupt with baby questions and childish interjections. Gipp says something and they start running over him with "why why why" while he is in the middle of explaining why.

George 05-14-2009 11:41 PM

Re: "Sam Gipp's degree"
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Bro. Parrish (Post 19758)
Alas, it appears that some of the Bible correcting pink panty brethren have taken it upon themselves to use this issue to bash Bro. Gipp and the KJV:
http://www.fundamentalforums.com/bib...confusion.html

OOOPS, sorry Greektim, did I "drop a bomb" on you? :rolleyes: :(

Aloha brother Parrish,

Thanks for the heads up (the "link"). Isn't it interesting how Greektim is about as "two-faced" as a hypocrite can get?

If this young man had an honest or sincere question since he "joined" our Forum, you couldn't "PROVE IT" by what he says on the FFF!

Here is what he said over there:

Quote:

"Off topic...that thread was absolutely crazy. I just had a curious question and got unloaded on for asking."
For the record: He didn't just get "unloaded on for asking" a question! He was called on the carpet because his past Posts on the AV1611 Bible Forums (and his own blog) had already exposed him for someone who is not just asking honest questions, but who is: ". . . . extremely against the KJV only view." In other words, he came here with a hidden "agenda", and because he appears to be so "gentile", so "nice" and so "polite" - never speaking "harsh", always careful not to speak plainly, and cleverly avoiding answering direct questions; some people on this Forum have mistakenly judged him as being sincere. Well his own Posts (on this site and on FFF) have PROVEN OTHERWISE!

Romans 16:18 For they that are such serve not our Lord Jesus Christ, but their own belly; and by good words and fair speeches deceive the hearts of the simple.

And then in regards to those of us on this Forum he quotes (on FFF):

Proverbs 15:12 (NASB)
Quote:

Proverbs 1. A gentle answer turns away wrath, But a harsh word stirs up anger.
2. The tongue of the wise makes knowledge acceptable, But the mouth of fools spout folly.
What Greektim doesn't have the guts (or the honesty) to state here, he gladly "testifies" to on the FFF. {Where the Bible correctors & deniers can become a "Fundamental Pope" ("freesundayschoollessons"); or a "Master of Fundamentalism" ("timotheos" there - i.e. "Greektim" here) - "TITLES" that I am sure that most of here on this Forum "aspire to"! :rolleyes:}

So deep down in his little perverse heart, sweet "Timmy" really and truly thinks (and openly declares on FFF) that we are just a bunch of FOOLS that are just spouting FOLLY! Of course he doesn't DARE say that here, but over "there" his TRUE CHARACTER comes through = a disingenuous HYPOCRITE!

I just can't leave a 'quote' from the corrupt NASB, without citing the verses as recorded in the King James Bible.

The HOLY BIBLE:
Quote:

Proverbs 15:1 A soft answer turneth away wrath: but grievous words stir up anger.
2 The tongue of the wise useth knowledge aright: but the mouth of fools poureth out foolishness.
There is "no profit" in continuing trying to reason with this young man. He "already knows all there is to know", and he has judged us to be "fools", and what we believe, to be "folly"; what more do we need, before we separate ourselves from him and avoid him?

James 1:8
A double minded man is unstable in all his ways.


Psalms 12:2 They speak vanity every one with his neighbour: with flattering lips and with a double heart do they speak.

Romans 16:17 Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them.

peopleoftheway 05-15-2009 05:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Luke (Post 19843)
That clip they posted is three minutes of a 3 hour debate. The debate is really good to watch. For most of the debate, Gipp and the other KJB guy own them. Then they keep asking this dumb question about "where was the Bible before 1611". They actually cut a bit out where an editor of the NKJV loses his voice for a few minutes.

Sam Gipp answers honestly - WHO CARES! He wasn't there, so why does anyone care. Gipp owns this debate. White and Wallace are childish and continually interupt with baby questions and childish interjections. Gipp says something and they start running over him with "why why why" while he is in the middle of explaining why.

WHAT! :eek: those modern version advocates "edited" that video so that it "suited" their "purpose" and so that their view becomes the "correct" view.
Sounds a lot like what their scholarly translators did with their bible versions.:tsk:

Proverbs 26:11 As a dog returneth to his vomit, so a fool returneth to his folly.

I think by now "genuine" Bible believers on the forum and many who "lurk" know there is an agenda with these men. As brother George says their words are all sweet and "innocent" and speeches fair. I am certainly not deceived nor are many others.
let me put it this way and pose a question

"Would you(critic/corrector) walk into a Church, a bible believing Church and try and snatch the Book from peoples hands? and If so what would you put in their hands in its place?"

Galatians 6:7 Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap.

I thank the Lord that we do have a continual source of genuine Born again Bible believing Christians who find these forums by the grace of God and I pray that those who are "new" to manuscripts and "bible versions" come to see the "irrefutable truth" about where God has left his words for today, in one place, in one book, the AV1611.
Please do not be swayed, disheartened, or let your faith in the Book be diminished, God forbid!
Just study the Book, feed of the Book and know you have all the words of God in your hands and BELIEVE it and by studying the Perfect, Pure, Preserved Book, the counterfeits become oh so apparent.

The Bible is correct, we must submit to its teachings.

Romans 16:17 Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them.

The Apostle Paul "beseeches" that it quite urgent to avoid this type of man, while it is hard not to answer their fruitless questions, we must refrain until their puff runs out of steam

Webster's 1828 Dictionary [A-J]
beseech
BESEE'CH, v.t. pret. and pp.besought.

To entreat; to supplicate; to implore; to ask or pray with urgency; followed by a person; as, "I Paul beseech you by the meekness of Christ,", 2 Cor.10.; or by a thing; as, I beseech your patience.

There are many who join this forum who are NOT Bible believers, but are struggling with the question "Which Bible?" and I have all the time that God spares me for these people and I will not force what I know and believe down their throats but let scripture say more than I can ever say, Gods words wont return onto him void. As for the purposed deniers, critics, scorners, fundamental popes, masters of fundamentalism, Take it somewhere else.

2 Thessalonians 3:6 Now we command you, brethren, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye withdraw yourselves from every brother that walketh disorderly, and not after the tradition which he received of us.

Greektim 05-15-2009 07:13 AM

To reply or not to reply...
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by George (Post 19846)
Aloha brother Parrish,

Thanks for the heads up (the "link"). Isn't it interesting how Greektim is about as "two-faced" as a hypocrite can get?

I am hoping you will be able to show from my words where I have been hypocritical and disingenuous.

If this young man had an honest or sincere question since he "joined" our Forum, you couldn't "PROVE IT" by what he says on the FFF!

So here comes the proof....yes?

Here is what he said over there:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Greektim "Timotheos"
"Off topic...that thread was absolutely crazy. I just had a curious question and got unloaded on for asking."

For the record: He didn't just get "unloaded on for asking" a question! I feel that I did but whatever... He was called on the carpet because his past Posts on the AV1611 Bible Forums (and his own blog) had already exposed him for someone who is not just asking honest questions, Nothing from my blog or this forum would indicate that I had an agenda other than I am against the KJVO doctrine. You judged my motives before you even knew me. but who is: ". . . . extremely against the KJV only view." In other words, he came here with a hidden "agenda" that's your opinion (what would my agenda be anyways???), and because he appears to be so "gentile", so "nice" and so "polite" - never speaking "harsh" to this I do not apologize, always careful not to speak plainly, and cleverly avoiding answering direct questions; some people on this Forum have mistakenly judged him as being sincere. Well his own Posts (on this site and on FFF) have PROVEN OTHERWISE!

Still waiting to see clear statements from myself that actually proves otherwise.

Romans 16:18 For they that are such serve not our Lord Jesus Christ, but their own belly; and by good words and fair speeches deceive the hearts of the simple.

And then in regards to those of us on this Forum he quotes (on FFF):

Proverbs 15:1–2 (NASB)
What Greektim doesn't have the guts (or the honesty) to state here, he gladly "testifies" to on the FFF. What exactly do I not have the guts for? I will dialogue with anything you want, brother. {Where the Bible correctors & deniers can become a "Fundamental Pope" ("freesundayschoollessons"); or a "Master of Fundamentalism" ("timotheos" there - i.e. "Greektim" here) - "TITLES" that I am sure that most of here on this Forum "aspire to"! :rolleyes:} I don't care for those titles either.

So deep down in his little perverse heart ad hominem, sweet "Timmy" ad hominem really and truly thinks (and openly declares on FFF, of course you have proof for such a convicting claim...) that we are just a bunch of FOOLS that are just spouting FOLLY on the contrary actually...I appreciate your passion for the Word of God! Of course he doesn't DARE say that here, but over "there" his TRUE CHARACTER comes through = a disingenuous HYPOCRITE! Still would like some plain proof that I am being a hypocrite.

I just can't leave a 'quote' from the corrupt NASB, without citing the verses as recorded in the King James Bible.

The HOLY BIBLE:
There is "no profit" in continuing trying to reason with this young man. He "already knows all there is to know", and he has judged us to be "fools" would like to see where I make that statement about you, and what we believe, to be "folly"; what more do we need, before we separate ourselves from him and avoid him?

James 1:8
A double minded man is unstable in all his ways.


Psalms 12:2 They speak vanity every one with his neighbour: with flattering lips and with a double heart do they speak.

Romans 16:17 Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them.

Posts like these give the KJVO crowd a bad name and ruin your testimony. Fortunately, there are those who are kind-hearted and can discuss issues without the ad hominem attacks. I praise the Lord for your zeal for God's Word, but you are ready to call down fire from heaven when Jesus' method is love and deliverance (cf. Luke 9:51-56). As a personal testimony, the person with whom I have had the best dialogue with and have been challenged the most by is the perosn who has spoken to me with respect and honest debate yet rebuked me when I got out of line. It is from someone like this that will ever have an impact with people like me.

George 05-15-2009 12:22 PM

RE; "Sam Gipp's degree"
 
Aloha brother Steven (POTW),

Please notice what I have gleaned from checking out brother Parish's "Link":

Quote:

05-07-2009, 08:26 PM
freesundayschoollessons > Join Date: May 2008 > Location: Davison, Michigan > Posts: 2,676 {!}
Fundamental Pope
{NOTE: “freesundayschoollessons” was BANNED TWICE from the AV1611 Bible Forums!}

Sam Gipp: Degree confusion
Hey Timotheos: {“Greektim” on this Forum} I have been following your thread at av1611.com and found an interesting confusion on Gipp's site. He claims to have a Ph.D. then he claims to have a Th.D.

Did you notice this? Does he have both or is this a discrepancy?

Barry at www.freesundayschoollessons.org/forum/
My Facebook profile
  • The KJVO insists a small dot in one letter changes the whole interpretation of Psalm 12.
  • The KJVO insists that being "gathered" during a time of war does not mean being "captured." Isa 13:15

“Greektim’s” Response:
Quote:

05-07-2009, 10:18 PM
timotheos > Join Date: Dec 2008 > Location: σομαι ο εἰμί > Posts: 783
Master of Fundamentalism

I didn't notice the PhD. I just saw the ThD claim. Does anyone here know where he got the degree?

Off topic...that thread was absolutelycrazy. I just had a curious question and got unloaded on for asking.

Off topic #2...I'm wearin' my Wings jersey (end of 2nd period right now). I'm not ashamed either. I dress up for a hockey game
__________________
Τιμόθεος
Quote:

05-07-2009
Ransom > Join Date: Nov 2005 > Location: Ottawa, Ontario, Canada > Posts: 18,134 {!!!}
Forum Sage

From what I've heard, Sam the Gipper's "degrees" come from Pensacola Bible Institute and Clarksville School of Theology. The former is Dr. Petey Ruckman's church-basement toy "college," and the latter is a defunct degree mill in Tennessee. His academic credentials are, in a word, worthless.
Take care,

Scott
"I like children." - mstucky, preaching against "queers," reveals a little TMI.

"In the heat of composition I find that I have inadvertently allowed myself to assume the form of a large centipede. I am accordingly dictating the rest to my secretary." - C. S. Lewis
Ah now, can’t you just “feel” the “love” pouring out of every single word the “dear brother” uttered? What was that about ad homonym attacks?

Sam the Gipper's "degrees" / The former is Dr. Petey Ruckman's church-basement toy "college," / “the latter is a defunct degree mill in Tennessee. His academic credentials are, in a word, worthless.

Ah yes, aren’t these the kind, gentile, sweet, and lovely people? Wouldn’t you just want to be friends with them and fellowship with them? NOT!

WHY isn’t Greektim “offended” by these MALICIOUS REMARKS? Hmmm?

Proverbs 10:18 He that hideth hatred with lying lips, and he that uttereth a slander, is a fool.

Quote:

05-08-2009, 07:27 AM
freesundayschoollessons Join Date: May 2008 > Location: Davison, Michigan > Posts: 2,676 {!}
Fundamental Pope

Certainly, there is much lacking with Gipp's work to be considered him as having reached a terminal degree.
__________________
Barry at www.freesundayschoollessons.org/forum/
My Facebook profile
  • The KJVO insists a small dot in one letter changes the whole interpretation of Psalm 12.
  • The KJVO insists that being "gathered" during a time of war does not mean being "captured." Isa 13:15

Quote:

05-08-2009, 10:30 AM
SAWBONES > Join Date: Jan 2009 > Posts: 129
Master of Fundamentalism

I've lately watched sympathetically while friend timotheos has attempted to initiate honest interactions over at the AV1611 BB, but I don't and will not post there. I've been checking that board on and off for something over six months, and it's clearly quite unfriendly to anyone not a "member of the club". There are some occasional issues of interest brought up in posts, nonetheless, but it mostly seems to serve as a bastion of "KJVO political correctness".

If one inquires about or questions anything at all regarding the absolute preeminence of the KJV, and doesn't sycophantically conform immediately to the Party Line, he's branded as a "Bible Corrector" or given some other derogatory label. (They actually have ready-made lists of such!)

Questions about the education or authority of KJVO figureheads like Mr. Gipp or Dr. Ruckman are altogether off-limits.

Apparently nearly everyone there has a "KJV chip on his shoulder", and an unreasonable level of suspicion as well as a pre-prepared animosity ready to be directed toward any new poster until he says any of the magic phrases or passwords (to the effect of "I believe that the KJV is the only real and true Bible"), after which newbies are given a cautious or qualified welcome.

While it's nice for KJVO folks to have their own BB, it's too bad that they feel so defensive about their chosen version of the Bible that their first posture toward newcomers who don't correctly pronounce the shibboleth is one of hostile suspicion and outright rudeness.
Quote:

05-08-2009, 12:44 PM
jrw > Join Date: Jun 2006 > Location: TN > Posts: 330
Master of Fundamentalism

Wow, Tim... looked at the forums over there out of curiosity. You must have some thick skin. I've never seen so many person attacks based on a simple question...

Kind of amusing that they all accuse you of trying to drum up a person attack on Gipp based on where he got his degree, but have no problem making personal attacks on you based on a question about where he got his degree. Basically, "Don't try to attack him like we are attacking you right now!"
jrw
And here is Timotheus’ (i.e. “Greektim”) response to all of the above:

Quote:

05-08-2009, 02:41 PM
timotheos > Join Date: Dec 2008 > Location: σομαι ο εἰμί > Posts: 783
Prov 15:1-2 NASB
__________________
Τιμόθεος

{That's it! But here is what it says in the corrupt NASV}

Proverbs 15:1–2 (NASB)
Proverbs 15:1. A gentle answer turns away wrath, But a harsh word stirs up anger.
2. The tongue of the wise makes knowledge acceptable, But the mouth of fools spout folly.
Now WHO do you suppose - that "kind" & "gentile" (AND NEVER A "HARSH" WORD)) Tim was referring to? Hmmm? I may be dense, but I’m not that dense - not to see that those NASB “verses” were aimed directly at US!

They certainly weren’t aimed at the “Fundamental Pope” (“freesundayschoollessons”); or the “Master of Fundamentalism” (“jrw”); or the “Master of Fundamentalism” (“SAWBONES” – here on the AV1611 Bible Forums); or the “Forum Sage” (“Ransom”)! And if they weren’t in reference to all of those nice, sweet, and polite people, then WHO could young Timmy be possibly be referring to? Hmmm?

He couldn’t possibly be referring to us as “FOOLS” – could he? He couldn’t possibly be saying that when we defend the King James Bible that we are spouting “FOLLY” – could he? Oh no! He must be speaking about SOMEONE ELSE - besides US! :rolleyes: Except he is already recorded as saying that he is: “. . . . extremely against the KJV only view.” Then WHY is he here with us “FOOLS” and our “FOLLY”? Hmmm? WHO is the bigger “FOOL”? Hmmm? :confused:

We have these wonderful “brethren” who quote C.S. Lewis (instead of the Holy Bible); who denigrate and malign the brethren with wicked and malicious remarks; who write in “tongues” (rather than speak them); who come and “JOIN” our Forum and stir up trouble, confusion, and division, and when they are called down on their clever and deceitful questions, insidious tactics, & disingenuous comments they innocently proclaim: “WHO ME”? “I haven’t done anything”! “I’m the innocent injured party”!

These people are just exactly like the Pharisees of old. [2 Timothy 3:5 Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.] These people are the “blind leaders of the blind” [Matthew 15:14] and we know where they end up {“into the ditch”!}

WHY? WHY do they come here? We didn’t invite them. We have so little in common with them. WHY do they HATE us so? WHY can’t they stay in there “club” and we’ll stay in ours? WHY are they “lurking” in the background checking up on us? Hmmm? I wouldn’t think of going to their worthless Forum and “lurk” in the background to see what they believe, or what they are doing. I could care less! WHAT is it about them that compels’ them to come here and “spy” on us, and then go back to their “club house” and criticize and malign us? I have never gone to their site and done the same (I wouldn’t think of it – there is no “profit” or “edification” in it – it would be a total waste of my time.) – WHY do they come here and cause trouble?

Since brother Parrish gave us that “Link” I did a cursory search on the “Threads” dealing with the King James Bible issue. Just in case you “think” I have overstated something here, how about this list of “THREADS” from the FFF site:

Ruckmormon: Just for you Luke :D
freesundayschoollessons
Today 07:57 AM
by freesundayschoollessons

Any Bible Believers left here? (1 2 3 ... Last Page)
ChaplainPaul
Today 07:42 AM
by robycop3

The KJVO myth is from a CULT OFFICIAL'S book! (1 2 3 ... Last Page)
robycop3
Yesterday 06:57 PM
by robycop3

Kjvo Has No Scriptural Support! (1 2 3 ... Last Page)
robycop3
Yesterday 06:53 PM
by robycop3

Why KJVOs should not be depended on for vocabulary
freesundayschoollessons
Yesterday 11:35 AM
by freesundayschoollessons

Conspiracy theories!!!
freesundayschoollessons
Yesterday 10:01 AM
by freesundayschoollessons

You had a good run solabiblia! (1 2 3)
freesundayschoollessons
05-13-2009 04:40 PM
by Jackieboy
05-12-2009 09:03 PM
by WhyEvenBother

The AV1611 bears the print of Anglicanism (1 2)
likeuntohim
05-12-2009 02:32 PM
by freesundayschoollessons

K J V O- a damnable heresy! Or no? (1 2 3 ... Last Page)
Walkin' with Jesus
05-11-2009 08:29 AM
by SAWBONES

The Hermeneutic of the KJVO (1 2 3)
freesundayschoollessons
05-09-2009 04:32 PM
by freesundayschoollessons

Poll: Which Bible Do You Read (1 2 3 ... Last Page)
ILoveTheLord
05-09-2009 03:33 PM
by SAWBONES

Sam Gipp: Degree confusion (1 2)
freesundayschoollessons
05-08-2009 07:54 PM
by freesundayschoollessons

KJV settled in heaven... (1 2 3)
timotheos

Ed's Best KJV (1 2 3 ... Last Page)
1611ED
05-06-2009 10:29 PM
by 1611ED

Why such disdain for the originals? (1 2 3 ... Last Page)
freesundayschoollessons
05-01-2009 10:32 AM
by SAWBONES

English Is BETTER Than The Greek 4 (1 2 3 ... Last Page)
Jim Schoolfield
04-29-2009 10:31 AM
by Herb Evans

Which Bibles do not?
The Glory Land
04-24-2009 07:28 AM
by SAWBONES

Which KJV is inerrant?? (1 2 3 ... Last Page)
Stephen
04-21-2009 06:16 PM
by 1611ED

K J V O (1 2 3 ... Last Page)
The Glory Land
04-17-2009 09:38 AM
by The Glory Land

Just a thought (1 2 3 ... Last Page)
Just_A_Thought
04-15-2009 11:16 PM
by SAWBONES

This guy would make a great KJVO.
BuddingTheologian
04-12-2009 05:23 PM
by SAWBONES

Matthew 26:41 in the King James Version (1 2 3 ... Last Page)
LarryN
04-11-2009 01:48 PM
by Walkin' with Jesus

Origenal Sin: The Alexandrian "corruption" revisited (1 2 3 ... Last Page)
freesundayschoollessons
04-07-2009 01:36 PM
by freesundayschoollessons
To My KJVO Friends... (1 2 3)

A video to bring peace between the KJVOs and Modern Version advocates
freesundayschoollessons
03-30-2009 07:07 PM
by timotheos

Is the Anglican Version (AV) Translated from the Textus Receptus (TR)? (1 2 3 ... Last Page)
Dr. Bob Griffin
03-30-2009 08:10 AM
by Walkin' with Jesus

Does the Bible misquote Jesus?
BuddingTheologian
03-28-2009 10:20 PM
by BuddingTheologian

Earliest Preserved Greek mss.... (1 2)
BuddingTheologian
03-27-2009 08:26 PM
by freesundayschoollessons

Does Riplinger have a counterpart? (1 2 3 ... Last Page)
Panthera
03-27-2009 11:58 AM
by robycop3

Johannine pericope of the adulteress 7:53-8:11 (1 2 3 ... Last Page)
timotheos
03-19-2009 01:12 PM
by Brother Tim

Do modern versions contain the very words of God? (1 2 3 ... Last Page)
William S. Correa
03-19-2009 10:37 AM
by Walkin' with Jesus

if you know Latin or Greek sign here
petrvs
03-15-2009 08:35 PM
by timotheos

Latin,Greek Bibles are grammatically sluperior than English. (1 2 3 ... Last Page)
petrvs
03-14-2009 07:57 AM
by Ransom


They have 41 pages (20 Threads X 41 Pages = approximately 821 “Threads”) most of which are critical of either the King James Bible or of King James Bible defenders!

Do you recognize any names from the above partial list? timotheos (our very own “Greektim”); robycop3 (Banned from the AV1611 Bible Forums); Just_A_Thought (Banned from the AV1611 Bible Forums); freesundayschoollessons (Banned from the AV1611 Bible Forums – TWICE! The "second time" he SNEAKED in under FALSE CIRCUMSTANCES: in plain ("harsh") language - HE LIED!); solabiblia (Banned from the AV1611 Bible Forums); SAWBONES (still “lurking” in the shadows); Mitex (?) if I didn't know better I would almost believe there is a "conspiracy" over there to UNDERMINE our Forum, but that's not possible with such "nice" people - is it?

It's obvious that all those genuine Bible believers that have been on the FFF have not made even the slightest DENT on the unbelieving and faithless "position" that many (if not most) of the "Christians" there hold concerning the King James Bible! :(

My question is simply: WHY BOTHER? WHY bother debating and arguing with these people? It is a hopeless exercise in FUTILITY! :eek: Poor brother Tim, and chaplain Paul, and Herb Evans (and whoever else was a real Bible believer on that Forum); they must have felt like missionaries caught at a Cannibals conference! :eek:

I refuse to engage "Greektim" anymore. I will not engage him, debate with him, or have a "meaningful discussion" with him. This young man has proven to be dishonest, disingenuous, and full of guile (I don't care how "sweet" he may "appear" - the man is a "wolf in sheep's clothing" and I am done with him.)

The sooner that some other people on this Forum begin to understand the full impact and meaning of: "A little leaven leaveneth the whole lump." [1 Corinthians 5:6 & Galatians 5:9]; the sooner "Greektim" will get the hint and leave and rejoin all of his sweet and lovely "buddies" over there at FFF (Birds of a feather flock together) the sooner we will have some peace (until the next Bible corrector or heretick shows up!). They accuse of as being members of a "club", and in a sense they are right. Most of us here of of the "same mind" when it comes to the issue of the King James Bible being our FINAL AUTHORITY in all matters of faith and practice.

But what is true of us is also true of them. Most of them belong to another "club" (admittedly a much bigger "club"); and they are all of the same mind, in that they refuse to recognize ANY BOOK, or ANY "bible"; or ANY set of manuscripts as being THE perfect, Holy, inspired, and infallible (without error) word of God, and consequently they have NO FINAL AUTHORITY in all matters of faith and practice other than their own puny minds! :eek:

We are in a war brothers (and sisters), and the sooner we all realize that the enemy is NOT only outside of our ranks, but that they are also within our ranks, the sooner we will be able do the work of God without being hindered by Bible correctors; Bible deniers; false brethren; wolves in sheep clothing; and hereticks.

I have made it a practice to have nothing to do with these kind of people. After 50 years I have learned (after dealing with literally dozens of "Greektim's", "solabiblia's", "freesundayschoollessons", etc.) that it is "FRUITLESS"! [Proverbs 17:10 A reproof entereth more into a wise man than an hundred stripes into a fool.] I have never convinced a single one of these skeptics to believe in the King James Bible. Did you get that? After 50 years - I have NEVER convinced a single Bible "skeptic" to my point of view through "meaningful dialogue"! :eek:

Proverbs 26:12 Seest thou a man wise in his own conceit? there is more hope of a fool than of him.

Luke 05-15-2009 12:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Greektim (Post 19854)
As a personal testimony, the person with whom I have had the best dialogue with and have been challenged the most by is the perosn who has spoken to me with respect and honest debate yet rebuked me when I got out of line. It is from someone like this that will ever have an impact with people like me.

Keep it personal :D

This is typical. George has spoken with respect and rebuked you when out of line. You just can't see that. You think a rebuke must be sugar coated. Your manner is well spoken, but we can all read between the lines.

Luke 05-15-2009 01:04 PM

Also, to reply to my special thread

The fact I give Ruckman any breathing room is

#1 I don't live to denounce other men
#2 I haven't actually read his research, nor have I enough Bible knowledge to rebuke it.
#3 If you were to actually read BiB, especially the last chapter, you would see what his real views are on aliens. This has nothing to do with mormonism.
#4 Ruckman said he would not be inhabiting other planets. He will be a servant king, serving God, setting God's new creation down on other planets. There is a difference between that and what mormons believe.

The reason I am not posting on the FFF is because what's the point. I don't agree with anything you say. I really don't care if you don't appreciate Ruckman, or want to dismiss everything he says because of minor teachings of his.

I love Miles J. Stanford as a writer. But get this - he isn't KJBO, and he is a calvinist (albeit a pauline dispensational sovereign gracer).

I also guess my prediction was right... It would end up as ammo on the FFF. Glad I didn't say what sermon, so they could take it all out of context.

peopleoftheway 05-15-2009 02:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Greektim (Post 19854)
Posts like these give the KJVO crowd a bad name and ruin your testimony. Fortunately, there are those who are kind-hearted and can discuss issues without the ad hominem attacks. I praise the Lord for your zeal for God's Word, but you are ready to call down fire from heaven when Jesus' method is love and deliverance (cf. Luke 9:51-56). As a personal testimony, the person with whom I have had the best dialogue with and have been challenged the most by is the perosn who has spoken to me with respect and honest debate yet rebuked me when I got out of line. It is from someone like this that will ever have an impact with people like me.

Come on, really?
I went to one of the links about Solabiblia and to be honest its the last time I will go to your forum, its fruitless and pointless for me to do so, but I would just like to point out the infantile nature of you all over there and the obvious malignity from those posts

Quote:

Posted by Ransom (The guy with the freemasonry skull & Bones avatar)

Wow . . . the KJV drones on that thread are so ignorant, it actually hurts my brain.

And people wonder why I mock these idiots rather than actually try to reason with them.
__________________
Take care,

Scott
:tsk: No scripture, just hate.
Quote:

Posted by SAWBONES (who apparently lurks here a lot)

Too true in many cases, unfortunately.

I keep perusing that site, hoping for something of interest, but tidbits are few and far between.
I think it has a sort of morbid fascination, though.

So much contented, even luxuriant wallowing in ignorance ("Ah'm just a simple man, with simple beliefs, and I don't know nuthin' about no 'teks-tyu-al crit-ee-sis-um', but ah know the King James Version is the only Bible, and that all the other versions are just crap"), not to mention the frequent grammar errors, punctuation errors and misspellings!

Sycophantically spouting the "Party Line" over there always results in posts of approbation from the regulars, while asking any sort of question about the KJV results in instant interrogation ("why are you really here, so-and-so?") and suspicion from the same crowd.

Not much fun. They even seem to eat their own from time to time
Wow, what can I say about that poisonous venom, I will assume the bold is mocking me for claiming to be a simple man, how dare me. Now its down to criticizing bad spelling and grammar
Lots of love from there then Tim?


Quote:

Posted By Ransom in response to Chaplain Paul
Chapped-lip Paul said:

"Now therefore be ye not mockers..." - God, in Isaiah 28:22

Bible verses quoted by purveyors of false doctrine carry no credibility.

And those who mock God by teaching stupidity have no business telling others not to mock.
:tsk:

And finally, Because they are so infantile over there when a man is sincere about not being well educated or able to speak Greek or Hebrew, I
MAKE NO APOLOGY for stating that I am not a well educated man yet I clearly have more discernment than a lot of you.


Quote:

Here are a couple of nuggets from a guy who is obviously scared to death of educated people:

Posted by Jackieboy
Ah sure just leave them there to their manuscripts and intellect

And the "Aw shucks I'm just a good ole boy" defense--same poster.

Why don't you stay on your forum and discuss your textual beliefs and theology and use your fancy words I truthfully don't understand, I don't understand as much as you all do in regards to texts, Greek, Hebrew, my IQ is not high, I am a simple man and I do not take kindly to those of a Higher intellect coming here and telling me I am wrong for trusting that God preserved his word in the KJB, blinding me with your intellect

I think he's confusing intellect with education
No I am not, there are many educated men on this forum who I look up to and they certainly try and explain the "weightier matters" in such a way as us less educated people can fathom. However many of your critic friends come in and try to appear "enlightened" on matters and puff themselves up with knowledge. However please don't demean me for being sincere, the Lord Jesus Christ knows my heart and knows I am a simple man and I make again NO apology to anyone for claiming this. I am blessed that the Lord has given me a humble spirit when before in my conversation in the world I was full of pride and arrogance.

Matthew 11:29 Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls.

Psalms 25:9 The meek will he guide in judgment: and the meek will he teach his way.

Psalms 10:17 LORD, thou hast heard the desire of the humble: thou wilt prepare their heart, thou wilt cause thine ear to hear:

Proverbs 29:23 A man's pride shall bring him low: but honour shall uphold the humble in spirit.

Matthew 23:12 And whosoever shall exalt himself shall be abased; and he that shall humble himself shall be exalted.


Now Greektim, I read one thread from your forums and Do you know what I felt so spiritually hurt by these things that I read that I am almost in tears, not because I am weak, no, because people write those things and have the cheek to do it while calling themselves a born again christian! Many get rebuked on this forum with "Holy Scripture" on your forum you men and I use that term lightly as you don't behave as men, have a real LACK of Holy scripture use in your posts and more "personal opinions" you behave like infants in a playground.


2 Peter 3:3 Knowing this first, that there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts,

2 Timothy 3:1-5 This know also, that in the last days perilous times shall come. For men shall be lovers of their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy, Without natural affection, trucebreakers, false accusers, incontinent, fierce, despisers of those that are good, Traitors, heady, highminded, lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God; Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.

slatts1611AV 05-17-2009 12:26 AM

Hi All
 
Hi everyone,
I was registered here last year sometime, but I had major pc problems, lost all my info password, etc, and couldn't log on. I opened a new account not to break rules, but simply because I couldn't figure out how to retrieve my old info. If a mod can help me recover all my old info, that would be great.I have been saved since 1991, and thru alot of 'stuff', the one thing I always knew was that God ws right, and I was wrong, EVERY TIME, and the Holy Bible IS the 1611 Authorized Version.

Anyway, in the past I have had dealings with robycop and the rest of the crew, I have had my email box spammed by the 'brethren', etc, etc. I do not know any Greek or Hebrew, and to be honest, do not feel the need to do so. I do have a pretty good working knowledge concerning manuscript evidence, and which readings are found in which manuscripts, and all of that. I have read most books on the subject as well. In the past I have handled myself pretty well with most of the folks who think that they can correct the KJV, or ANY version with the Greek. I have reasoned with them , dealing with the fact that there is no 'original greek' manuscripts on earth, etc, etc
Guess what? I don't debate anymore with them. I simply rebuke them. Know why? Because why in the world would I waste my time debating some practical atheist like robycop concerning something he has never seen? It would be like arguing with an atheist about God. I don't deal with people who quote Black is Beautiful out of context either. What is the point brothers, in dealing with a bunch of dirty Bible rejecting liars like that crew?
Honestly, let robycop, and the rest of the devils over there have fun in their greek sandbox. I KNOW at least, that I have a book that T KNOW IS the Scriptures.
NONE of those geniuses over there could say the same thing. Let them whine and spin and spit. All devil controlled Bible rejecting silly asses do the same thing
Let them go out in the graveyard and howl at the moon. They probably listen to ozzy osbourne anyway :D

ChaplainPaul 05-18-2009 10:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by slatts1611AV (Post 19931)
I don't debate anymore with them. I simply rebuke them. Know why? Because why in the world would I waste my time debating some practical atheist like robycop concerning something he has never seen? ... What is the point brothers, in dealing with a bunch of dirty Bible rejecting liars like that crew?
Honestly, let robycop, and the rest of the devils over there have fun in their greek sandbox. I KNOW at least, that I have a book that T KNOW IS the Scriptures.
NONE of those geniuses over there could say the same thing. Let them whine and spin and spit. All devil controlled Bible rejecting silly asses do the same thing
Let them go out in the graveyard and howl at the moon. They probably listen to ozzy osbourne anyway :D

Gee, Slatts, do you think you could tell us what you REALLY think? :eek:

You used your very first post to do this? Why do you speak this way? There's no call for it. You call them devils and devil controlled Bible rejecting silly asses. I'm sure you think you can justify it, but I think you're way out of line. What you're doing is is not a rebuke, or an exhortation, or a correction and is not edifying in any way. There is no spiritual gift called ridicule. I can appreciate being angry and frustrated at these people; but be ye angry and sin not.

Brother Tim 05-18-2009 11:08 AM

Slatts, I have to second Paul's admonition. Wrong is wrong, no matter who is involved, and you are stepping way over the line of godly rebuke into taunting and name-calling. Some of these of whom you speak are true brethren, though terribly misguided. Some are wolves, intent on tearing the sheep. The attacks won't diffuse them.

I do look forward to speaking with you face-to-face, but I cannot let your post stand unanswered.

peopleoftheway 05-18-2009 11:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brother Tim (Post 19996)
Slatts, I have to second Paul's admonition. Wrong is wrong, no matter who is involved, and you are stepping way over the line of godly rebuke into taunting and name-calling. Some of these of whom you speak are true brethren, though terribly misguided. Some are wolves, intent on tearing the sheep. The attacks won't diffuse them.

I do look forward to speaking with you face-to-face, but I cannot let your post stand unanswered.


I will agree with both Brothers here, there are definitely some misguided brethren on that forum and as Tim stated there are plenty of wolves as well, but it is best to withdraw from them that are intent on trouble and avoid those who cause strife and division. To call them names is only adding fuel to the fire.
I don't know what they have said to you or emailed you about but we shouldn't match railing for railing only railing with rebuke (scriptural rebuke)


1 Peter 3:8-9 Finally, be ye all of one mind, having compassion one of another, love as brethren, be pitiful, be courteous: Not rendering evil for evil, or railing for railing: but contrariwise blessing; knowing that ye are thereunto called, that ye should inherit a blessing.

Matthew 5:44 But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;

It is hard I know not to let the carnal man take over when people are so vile and nasty to us, but as I am ever learning we heap coals of fire on their heads by not railing them back.

Proverbs 25:21-23 If thine enemy be hungry, give him bread to eat; and if he be thirsty, give him water to drink: For thou shalt heap coals of fire upon his head, and the LORD shall reward thee.

Romans 12:20 Therefore if thine enemy hunger, feed him; if he thirst, give him drink: for in so doing thou shalt heap coals of fire on his head.

Jassy 05-18-2009 02:10 PM

Hello GreekTim,
I'm not sure where Dr. Samuel C. Gipp received his degree. I read his book "An Understandable History of the Bible" (about 500 pages) and I felt very blessed by reading it. It helped me to understand where the KJV came from and how BLESSED we are to have it! It doesn't matter to me where someone gets their degree from (or whether they even have one), as long as they're uplifting the TRUTH.

Luke 05-18-2009 02:35 PM

We've come back full circle..

People who read Gipp's work (and Vance's) will hardly be interested in where they got their degree. A degree does not automatically validate (in fact many degrees help to show their bias toward one particular theology or another) anything in their book. I am more interested in where they got their information and is it biblical and historically accurate.

Luke 05-18-2009 02:38 PM

Also, Sam is not the Gipper.

That's what he calls his wife!

slatts1611AV 05-18-2009 02:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brother Tim (Post 19996)
Slatts, I have to second Paul's admonition. Wrong is wrong, no matter who is involved, and you are stepping way over the line of godly rebuke into taunting and name-calling. Some of these of whom you speak are true brethren, though terribly misguided. Some are wolves, intent on tearing the sheep. The attacks won't diffuse them.

I do look forward to speaking with you face-to-face, but I cannot let your post stand unanswered.

You know, about two days after I posted that I realized I had stepped over the line....I was wrong in going so far overboard, so I fully accept the rebuke by you and others

slatts1611AV 05-18-2009 02:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brother Tim (Post 19996)
Slatts, I have to second Paul's admonition. Wrong is wrong, no matter who is involved, and you are stepping way over the line of godly rebuke into taunting and name-calling. Some of these of whom you speak are true brethren, though terribly misguided. Some are wolves, intent on tearing the sheep. The attacks won't diffuse them.

I do look forward to speaking with you face-to-face, but I cannot let your post stand unanswered.

Yes Brother Tim I too look forward to meeting you face to face as well, and I also accept your correction and admonition.
Slatts

George 05-18-2009 03:15 PM

Re: "Sam Gipp's degree"
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by slatts1611AV (Post 19931)
Hi everyone,
I was registered here last year sometime, but I had major pc problems, lost all my info password, etc, and couldn't log on. I opened a new account not to break rules, but simply because I couldn't figure out how to retrieve my old info. If a mod can help me recover all my old info, that would be great.I have been saved since 1991, and thru alot of 'stuff', the one thing I always knew was that God ws right, and I was wrong, EVERY TIME, and the Holy Bible IS the 1611 Authorized Version.

Anyway, in the past I have had dealings with robycop and the rest of the crew, I have had my email box spammed by the 'brethren', etc, etc. I do not know any Greek or Hebrew, and to be honest, do not feel the need to do so. I do have a pretty good working knowledge concerning manuscript evidence, and which readings are found in which manuscripts, and all of that. I have read most books on the subject as well. In the past I have handled myself pretty well with most of the folks who think that they can correct the KJV, or ANY version with the Greek. I have reasoned with them , dealing with the fact that there is no 'original greek' manuscripts on earth, etc, etc

Guess what? I don't debate anymore with them. I simply rebuke them. Know why? Because why in the world would I waste my time debating some practical atheist like robycop concerning something he has never seen? It would be like arguing with an atheist about God. I don't deal with people who quote Black is Beautiful out of context either. What is the point brothers, in dealing with a bunch of dirty Bible rejecting liars like that crew?
Honestly, let robycop, and the rest of the devils over there have fun in their greek sandbox. I KNOW at least, that I have a book that T KNOW IS the Scriptures.

NONE of those geniuses over there could say the same thing. Let them whine and spin and spit. All devil controlled Bible rejecting silly asses do the same thing.

Let them go out in the graveyard and howl at the moon. They probably listen to ozzy osbourne anyway :D


Aloha brother,

I am not going to "pile on" you, since several brothers have already "reproved" you. I will say this though - don't lose your love for the Holy word of God or your contempt for Bible correctors (or deniers). What you need to do is learn to "temper" your speech (somewhat).
Quote:

1 Corinthians 9:25 And every man that striveth for the mastery is temperate in all things. Now they do it to obtain a corruptible crown; but we an incorruptible.
Many of those men on FFF who ridicule the Holy Bible (and those of us who believe in it) are "Christian" Humanists and Sophists. Some of them are "wolves in sheep's clothing". None of them - that is, those who engage in destructive criticism of the King James Bible, ridiculing, and name-calling, are INNOCENT!

I am particularly "hard" on these men, but I won't call them "devils", or "silly asses", etc. (that's "name-calling" for the sake of "ridicule"). On the other hand, if after a while, they "prove" themselves (by their own "words" and "deeds") to be Bible "correctors", Bible "deniers", "Humanists", "Sophists", or indeed "wolves in sheep's clothing", I do not hesitate to call them what I believe they are.

Today's PC (Humanist) "Culture" frowns on this sort of behavior, (unless it's in reference to Bible believers!) but I am not supposed to "conform" to the world's standards (i.e. Humanism), I am supposed to be "transformed" and be like the Lord Jesus Christ (a Christian); and I am to follow the Apostle Paul [1 Corinthian 4:6, 11:1; Philippians 3;17].

Now, neither the Lord Jesus Christ nor Paul ever hesitated calling "a spade a spade", so it's not a matter of NOT "warning" or "admonishing" or "reproving" or "rebuking" - it's having the spiritual "knowledge", "discernment", "understanding", and especially "wisdom" to know HOW to go about doing those things; and WHEN to do it; and to WHOM you should do it.

You have "zeal" for the Lord and for His Holy word, and I don't want to discourage that (not ever!); but you must "temper" that "zeal" with those things I mentioned above. Those things {spiritual "knowledge", "discernment", "understanding", and "wisdom"} are "gifts" (given by God) and are acquired from God in his "own time" (since I am particularly "hard-headed" - it took a very long time for me).

You are not wrong in your "assessment" of those Bible "correctors", "deniers", "gnat strainers", and "railers". Whether they are aware of what they are doing, or not, they will "answer" for their unbelief - of that I am absolutely sure:
Quote:

Galatians 6:7 Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap.
What we have to do is be extremely careful that we do not become "like them" in dealing with them - because the same holds true for us also [Galatians 6:7]

Some of the brethren on the AV1611 Forum disagree with me on how to deal with these "people", and that is their right and prerogative. I believe that the Scriptures are crystal clear on WHAT, WHERE, WHEN, and HOW to deal with them; and WHO they are.

There are two things about them I know for sure:

#1. They may be "saved", but - They are NOT genuine "Bible" (ONE BOOK that you can hold in your hands) believers.

#2. They do NOT possess A SINGLE "FINAL AUTHORITY" for determining all matters of faith and practice.

There is a huge difference between those Christians (the vast majority) who simply "don't know" about the "Which Bible" issue, and those "Christians" who actively seek to disparage, defame, slander, and ridicule the Holy Bible! I try to patiently deal with those Christians who are ignorant of the issue and know little or nothing about it:
Quote:

2 Timothy 2:24 And the servant of the Lord must not strive; but be gentle unto all men, apt to teach, patient,
25 In meekness instructing those that oppose themselves; if God peradventure will give them repentance to the acknowledging of the truth;
26 And that they may recover themselves out of the snare of the devil, who are taken captive by him at his will.

However, I have no "empathy" and very little patience with those "Christians" who openly oppose the King James Bible and ridicule its defenders:
Quote:

2 Corinthians 2:17 For we are not as many, which corrupt the word of God: but as of sincerity, but as of God, in the sight of God speak we in Christ.
I do NOT CORRUPT the word of God - I seek to honor it. they do not even recognize the King James Bible as being the word of God - and so they DISPARAGE IT!
Quote:

2 Corinthians 4:1 Therefore seeing we have this ministry, as we have received mercy, we faint not;
2 But have renounced the hidden things of dishonesty, not walking in craftiness, nor handling the word of God deceitfully; but by manifestation of the truth commending ourselves to every man's conscience in the sight of God.

I am not "dishonest" or "crafty" with my words or in how I represent myself - THEY ARE!. I do not handle God's Holy words "deceitfully" - THEY DO!
Quote:

Romans 16:17 Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them.
18 For they that are such serve not our Lord Jesus Christ, but their own belly; and by good words and fair speeches deceive the hearts of the simple.

I do not go to "their Forum" and "cause divisions", BUT they are continually coming here seeking to DIVIDE! They are WITHOUT EXCUSE! :eek:

I refuse to "dialogue" with them because there is NO PROFIT to be gained, and NO EDIFICATION takes place in such a FRUITLESS endeavor. I repeat: trying to deal with Bible "correctors", Sophists, and Humanists is an EXERCISE IN FUTILITY!
Quote:

Proverbs 26:12 Seest thou a man wise in his own conceit? there is more hope of a fool than of him.
I believe that:

Whether it be DOCTRINE:
Quote:

Galatians 5:9 A little leaven leaveneth the whole lump.
or PEOPLE ("Christians")
Quote:

1 Corinthians 5:6 Your glorying is not good. Know ye not that a little leaven leaveneth the whole lump?
or an ATTITUDE
Quote:

Luke 12:1 In the mean time, when there were gathered together an innumerable multitude of people, insomuch that they trode one upon another, he began to say unto his disciples first of all, Beware ye of the leaven of the Pharisees, which is hypocrisy.
WHEN we encounter "leaven" in any one of these three forms we must "excise" it from our midst, or it will "fester" and "expand" until it LEAVENS "THE WHOLE LUMP"! {i.e. basically the sad "history" of every Christian church ever established - from Paul's day up to the mid 1900's}

There is no "room" for "leaven" in a church or any other Christian institution or group of believers (such as this Forum) - whether it be "leaven" in the form of "doctrine" [Galatians 5:9] or in the form of a "person" [1 Corinthians 5:6]. The Bible command is clear:

If a man that is called a brother is GUILTY of the following:
Quote:

1 Corinthians 5:11 But now I have written unto you not to keep company, if any man that is called a brother be a fornicator, or covetous, or an idolater, or a railer, or a drunkard, or an extortioner; with such an one no not to eat.

Those "Christians" who come here and "RAIL" on us (we didn't invite them!) or if they "RAIL" on us on another Forum - according to the Scriptures we are NOT to eat with them and in addition:
Quote:

1 Corinthians 5:12 For what have I to do to judge them also that are without? do not ye judge them that are within?
13 But them that are without God judgeth. Therefore put away from among yourselves that wicked person.

Now I know this is NOT a church, but it is a gathering of Christian "brethren", and the principles & precepts should still hold true: "if any man that is called a brother be . . . . . a railer, . . . . with such an one no not to eat."

In addition we should: "
put away from among yourselves that wicked person."

That is WHY I will have NOTHING to do with those people and cannot understand WHY some Christians will try to "dialogue" or "reason" with them.
Quote:

[Amos 3:3 Can two walk together, except they be agreed?]
At the risk of repeating myself: I DO NOT go and "JOIN" their Forum - WHY DO THEY COME HERE? Are they not CARNAL "Christians":
Quote:

[1 Corinthians 3:3 For ye are yet carnal: for whereas there is among you envying, and strife, and divisions, are ye not carnal, and walk as men?]
Quote:

Proverbs 20:3 It is an honour for a man to cease from strife: but every fool will be meddling.
This is WHY I do not spend a whole lot of time in "dialogue" with these men.

Quote:

Proverbs 22:10 Cast out the scorner, and contention shall go out; yea, strife and reproach shall cease.
This is WHY we should have nothing to do with these men:

The Biblical (Scriptural) commandment on HOW to deal with these men is clear. Whether it is personally distasteful or uncomfortable for me; whether I "think" there might be a better way; or whether our "culture" frowns on being direct and dealing "harshly" with people - if I am to live "by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God" [Matthew 4:4] then I must "AVOID THEM" at the least!

Romans 16:17
Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them.

tonybones2112 05-18-2009 03:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by slatts1611AV (Post 19931)
Hi everyone,
I was registered here last year sometime, but I had major pc problems, lost all my info password, etc, and couldn't log on. I opened a new account not to break rules, but simply because I couldn't figure out how to retrieve my old info. If a mod can help me recover all my old info, that would be great.I have been saved since 1991, and thru alot of 'stuff', the one thing I always knew was that God ws right, and I was wrong, EVERY TIME, and the Holy Bible IS the 1611 Authorized Version.

Anyway, in the past I have had dealings with robycop and the rest of the crew, I have had my email box spammed by the 'brethren', etc, etc. I do not know any Greek or Hebrew, and to be honest, do not feel the need to do so. I do have a pretty good working knowledge concerning manuscript evidence, and which readings are found in which manuscripts, and all of that. I have read most books on the subject as well. In the past I have handled myself pretty well with most of the folks who think that they can correct the KJV, or ANY version with the Greek. I have reasoned with them , dealing with the fact that there is no 'original greek' manuscripts on earth, etc, etc
Guess what? I don't debate anymore with them. I simply rebuke them. Know why? Because why in the world would I waste my time debating some practical atheist like robycop concerning something he has never seen? It would be like arguing with an atheist about God. I don't deal with people who quote Black is Beautiful out of context either. What is the point brothers, in dealing with a bunch of dirty Bible rejecting liars like that crew?
Honestly, let robycop, and the rest of the devils over there have fun in their greek sandbox. I KNOW at least, that I have a book that T KNOW IS the Scriptures.
NONE of those geniuses over there could say the same thing. Let them whine and spin and spit. All devil controlled Bible rejecting silly asses do the same thing
Let them go out in the graveyard and howl at the moon. They probably listen to ozzy osbourne anyway :D

You don't debate 'em Slatts, you give them Scripture. It's just my scholar vs your scholar. I don't have time to put into this forum that I'd like, I don't mess with them right now. I know roby quite well from yahoo a few years back. I call this period the Mid Decade Yahoo Wars and the only ones I have any contact with are Will Kinney and I'd like to get in touch with John Hinton. I was thrown out of the big Mid Acts Dispensationalist forum becasue I don;t believe in coddling Original Manuscript Frauds with their "versions", Stamites, and Unitarians. Most this forum are IFBs and I'm a Grace Dispensationalist, we all get along here.

Grace and peace

Tony

peopleoftheway 05-18-2009 03:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by slatts1611AV (Post 20024)
You know, about two days after I posted that I realized I had stepped over the line....I was wrong in going so far overboard, so I fully accept the rebuke by you and others

Ecclesiastes 7:5 It is better to hear the rebuke of the wise, than for a man to hear the song of fools.

Quit listening to the singing over there Brother and stablish yourself in some good solid Bible Believing here.

Pay attention to Bro George's post, we do have to submit to how the Bible teaches us to deal with these people and stick to it no matter what, after all it IS our FINAL authority for ALL matters of faith and practice

Proverbs 27:6 Faithful are the wounds of a friend; but the kisses of an enemy are deceitful.

We are friends here, rebuke may hurt sometimes, but it is always for the greater good and most importantly for the Glory of the Lord Jesus Christ and his Holy written word.

Bro. Parrish 05-18-2009 05:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by George (Post 20029)
Now, neither the Lord Jesus Christ nor Paul ever hesitated calling "a spade a spade", so it's not a matter of NOT "warning" or "admonishing" or "reproving" or "rebuking" - it's having the spiritual "knowledge", "discernment", "understanding", and especially "wisdom" to know HOW to go about doing those things; and WHEN to do it; and to WHOM you should do it.

That's right.
Great post George, tell it like it is brother... :D

Brother Tim 05-18-2009 06:19 PM

Slatt, as you can see, George considers me a softie. I wish that he could talk to a few of my former students (or my kids for that matter). He has rightly earned the "old curmudgeon" title.

I tend to pick my battles less broadly. I prefer using a scalpel, while others prefer a 50 cal or scatter gun.

We arevstill on the same side of the fence.

biblereader 05-19-2009 11:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Greektim (Post 19273)
Where did he recieve his ThD? I am very curious. Was it from Ruckman's school?

I haven't heard anyone mention Ruckman for years! Is he still alive?

biblereader 05-19-2009 11:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JOHN G (Post 19284)
Greetings GreekTim,
I assume you are the author, "Tim", of the website link below your name. In the profile of that name is seven sentences. Here is one:
"I am extremely against the KJV only view. "

Is this you? Correct me if I am wrong.

In Christ


DOH! Busted!:doh:

George 05-19-2009 12:15 PM

Re: " Sam Gipp's degree"
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Brother Tim (Post 20050)
"Slatt, as you can see, George considers me a softie. I wish that he could talk to a few of my former students (or my kids for that matter). He has rightly earned the "old curmudgeon" title.

I tend to pick my battles less broadly. I prefer using a scalpel, while others prefer a 50 cal or scatter gun.

We are still on the same side of the fence
."


Aloha Brother Tim,

Actually my choice of weapon happens to be: "The Sword of The Spirit". :)

Ephesians 6:10 Finally, my brethren, be strong in the Lord, and in the power of his might.
11 Put on the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to stand against the wiles of the devil.
12 For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.
13 Wherefore take unto you the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to withstand in the evil day, and having done all, to stand.
14 Stand therefore, having your loins girt about with truth, and having on the breastplate of righteousness;
15 And your feet shod with the preparation of the gospel of peace;
16 Above all, taking the shield of faith, wherewith ye shall be able to quench all the fiery darts of the wicked.
17 And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God:

We are in a WAR brother - NOT a "debating society" or a "coffee clatch"; and the only WEAPON that I use is God's words - It's the ONLY "OFFENSIVE" WEAPON available to a Bible believer (the rest of our "armour" is "Defensive").

My words, or anyone else's words, opinions, suppositions, and speculations are as useless as a pea shooter at the OK Coral. :rolleyes:

Brother Tim 05-19-2009 04:15 PM

George, regarding Ephesians 6, I see "prayer" as an offensive weapon as well. Touche' on the "Sword" comment, but you know what I meant. :)

biblereader 05-21-2009 05:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by George (Post 20117)
Aloha Brother Tim,

Actually my choice of weapon happens to be: "The Sword of The Spirit". :)

17 And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God:
[/FONT]
We are in a WAR brother - NOT a "debating society" or a "coffee clatch"; and the only WEAPON that I use is God's words - It's the ONLY "OFFENSIVE" WEAPON available to a Bible believer (the rest of our "armour" is "Defensive").

My words, or anyone else's words, opinions, suppositions, and speculations are as useless as a pea shooter at the OK Coral. :rolleyes:


I agree. I use the words of the Holy Bible, when talking to others, whether they are lost or saved. The word of God is quick and powerful, sharper than any two edged sword, yea, amen, and it DOES pierce through all the garbage, and hits right at the heart of the matter.


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