Giants in the Bible - Nephilim
 

Moving this thread from another forum, a collection of various articles and references I have gathered in the last year or so...
hope others enjoy, God bless...

I have been doing a study on giants in ancient history,
sometimes referred to as the Nephilim of the Bible (Numbers 13:32-33, Genesis 6:1-4), Sons of Anak, The Anakim, "Mound builders," Rephaim, The Adena, Ronnongwetowanca, or the Watchers. I am finding a lot of obscure references to old bones from all over the world---in Europe, Asia and North and South America, some of these refer to skeletons 10, 15, 25 feet and even bigger.

Of course some of these are going to be mere hoaxes (like the photoshopped giant human skeleton found in Saudi Arabia) and/or legends, but it is interesting that so many cultures have made mention of these giant men, the Nephilim, in ancient times, living all over the world.

One of the common traits seem to be "double rows of teeth" in some of the skulls, but I cannot seem to find any physical existing examples of those. Many of these references are from the 1800's or early 1900's, and several are from what is now the Ohio River Valley and New York. Anyone who has more information on the Nephilim, please let me know, here are a few links I have at least partially explored...


http://bibleprobe.com/nephilim.htm

http://www.nwcreation.net/nephilim.html

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/830123/posts

http://query.nytimes.com/gst/abstrac...609C94629FD7CF

http://solomonspalding.com/SRP/saga2/sagawt0a.htm

http://www.stevequayle.com/Giants/charts/charts.html\

http://www.geocities.com/age_of_gian..._builders.html

http://www.ldolphin.org/nephilim.html

http://paranormal.about.com/od/myste...a/aa060605.htm

http://www.greatdreams.com/reptlan/giants.htm

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nephilim

http://news.nationalgeographic.com/n...keleton_2.html

Another name for these giants;
Zamzummim
"In Hebrew, "Zamzummim" (used by the Ammonites) literally translates into "Buzz-Buzzers", or "the people whos speech sounds like buzzing." In Arabic the word zamzamah translates as a distant, unclear sound."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zamzummim

I posted this same topic on another Baptist forum, I was surprised that almost all of them tried to provide a naturalistic explanation for the giants, as though they were merely the odd victims of hormone problems or tribes of tall people, not one of these people seemed to think they were the offspring of fallen angels, even though the very name "Nephilim," means "FALLEN ONES."

I am interested in the antediluvian races, I find them to be fascinating and, like Bro. Ruckman, I think it is highly possible the KJV holds great clues to the fall of man and I think the Bible indicates they were more than merely tall humans. It seems that the secular Wikipedia offers more insight than some of the brethren...

"The Bible speaks of this era as being a time of great wickedness. There were Gibborim (giants) in the earth in those days as well as Nephilim; some translations identify the two as one and the same. The Gibborim were unusually powerful; Genesis calls them "heroes of old, men of renown;" (Enoshi Ha Shem). The antediluvian period ended when God sent the Flood to wipe out all life except Noah, his family, and the animals they took with them. Nevertheless, the Nephilim (literally meaning 'fallen ones', from the Hebrew root n-f-l 'to fall') reappear much later in the Biblical narrative, in Numbers 13:31-33. (However, since the Bible was not assembled in chronological order, it is possible that the related verses actually overlap time-wise.)"

Continuing...

I think it is at least possible the Nephilim corrupted everything and it's possible they were extremely violent!
"The earth also was corrupt before God, and the earth was filled with violence." Gen 6:11
"And God said unto Noah, The end of all flesh is come before me; for the earth is filled with violence through them; and, behold, I will destroy them with the earth." Gen 6:13

Many cultures around the world have at least some primitive record of these giants... I'm not talking about flying saucers here, I'm just saying I think it's very possible that these giants were a much bigger part of the antediluvian earth than many people realize! You don't want to believe it fine, but try and have an open mind. Some believe the Nephilim have left their handiwork all around the world in ancient ruins...

The fact is, there are cut stone pieces on mountains in Bolivia that weigh over 900 TONS, located at an elevation of over 12,000 feet. There is a giant wharf in Puma Punka with one cut stone at 440 TONS. Cutting and moving material this size and weight would be questionable even with today's technology, you can read about that here:
http://www.sacredsites.com/americas/...iahuanaco.html

The ruins of Baalbek in Lebanon contains the amazing 1000 TON Stone of the South, which weighs approximately as much as three Boeing 747 aircraft, along with the Trilithon---giant granite stones beautifully fitted together at a height of 20 feet above present ground level. These cut stones are fitted so tightly that you cannot fit a knife or even a needle between them, and it would be a serious challenge for even today's engineers to move something like that even a short distance, you can read about the Trilithon of Baalbek here:
http://www.world-mysteries.com/mpl_5b3.htm

Again, I am not a stupid person, all I am suggesting is there are some things in the ancient world (like the Nephilim) which we have only begun to understand and may never really know about until the Lord shows us later. My study continues...

"...The land, through which we have gone to search it, is a land that eateth up the inhabitants thereof; and all the people that we saw in it are men of a great stature. And there we saw the giants, the sons of Anak, which come of the giants: and we were in our own sight as grasshoppers, and so we were in their sight." Numbers 13:32-33

This might be an interesting book...

Biblical-giants book soars up charts
'The Nephilim' explains ancient pyramids, future events
© 2005 WorldNetDaily.com

A unique book that purports to explain the past existence of giant beings referred to in the Bible as the Nephilim has made a surprisingly strong showing on online best-sellers lists...
http://worldnetdaily.com/news/articl...TICLE_ID=42637

Here is an interesting article on the "Sons of God," also draws a distinction between the Nephilim and Giborem...
I thought it was funny this Jewish fellow actually believes the same way I do about Matthew 22:30... imagine that!

Sons Of God... Sethites Or Fallen Angels?
"The following article is only a portion of a Biblical study on Demonology: The Doctrine of Fallen Angels- Dr. A.G. Fruchtenbaum. Dr. Fruchtenbaum is a Messianic Jewish believer and founder of http://www.ariel.org in San Antonio Texas. He comes from a family line of Levite Priest (father and grandfather) and has knowledge of scripture that is just uncanny, nonetheless having become a believer in Christ at a young age, his father threw him out of the house for converting from Judaism to Christianity at the age of 17 or 18..."
http://www.evolutionfairytale.com/fo...er&f=23&t=1327

Here is an excellent article on THE SONS OF GOD and the Nephilim...
seems to be well thought-out and well presented...

The Sons of God and the Daughters of Men
(Genesis 6:1-8)
By: Bob Deffinbaugh , Th.M.

"I therefore understand the Nephilim to be a race of super-humans who are the product of this angelic invasion of the earth.
This view not only conforms to the biblical use of the expression ‘sons of God,’ it also best fits the context of the passage. The effects of the fall were seen in the godly offspring of Cain (chapter 4). While Cain and his descendants were ‘in Satan’s pocket,’ Satan knew from God’s words in Genesis 3:15 that through the seed of the woman God was going to bring forth a Messiah who would destroy him. We do not know that the entire line of Seth was God-fearing. In fact we would assume otherwise. Noah and his immediate family alone seem to be righteous at the time of the flood..."
http://www.bible.org/page.php?page_id=67

I thought this was kind of strange... the hammer is interesting... :confused:
http://www.biblebelievers.org.au/giants.htm

Book of Giants -- Reconstructed Texts
"A summary statement of the descent of the wicked angels, bringing both knowledge and havoc."
This is a strange reference to the fallen angels and their miscegenation with humans and animals.
I remember Dr. Ruckman mentioning this scenario before, weird stuff...
http://www.gnosis.org/library/dss/ds..._of_giants.htm

Here is a brief but funny article, this appears to be from the TIME archives, circa 1946 (?)
poor dumb evolutionists had no idea what they were looking at...

Giants of Old
"Many anthropologists believe that Man developed from a small, feeble ancestor. Gradually he grew bigger until he reached his present peak. But last week Dr. Ralph von Koenigswald, Dutch paleontologist, pressed a new theory. He thinks that Man grew gigantic a million years ago, then shrank to his present size.

Dr. von Koenigswald found in Java before the war a great bank of soft, eroding stone peppered with ancient fossils. He organized a gang of natives to pick up bones after every rain. At last he got a hatful of humanlike fragments.

The oldest were the biggest. From the lowest level came massive teeth and jaw bones which must have belonged to monstrous manlike creatures eight to nine feet tall and weighing 600 to 700 pounds. They were four times as big as modern man..."
http://www.time.com/time/magazine/ar...804029,00.html

So, we have been discussing these giants for a while...
but why does the Bible say there were giants IN THE EARTH? (Gen 6:4)

"And the LORD said unto Satan, Whence comest thou? Then Satan answered the LORD, and said, From going to and fro in the earth, and from walking up and down in it." Job 1:7

Does that seem a bit strange to anyone?
Searching various sites on the so-called "Hollow Earth Theory" revealed some interesting items. Of course, some of these sites get into the paranormal fringe areas, you know---the flying saucers and Bigfoot stuff, so please don't think I am trying to validate any or all of this material, but this old theory about the "Hollow Earth" is kind of interesting. I have linked a few of these below, explore them if you like. One thing I did not realize was the mention of this concept in other world religions, for example...

Buddhist Theory
"It is believed to be a race of supermen and superwomen who occasionally come to the surface to oversee the development of the human race. It is also believed that this subterranean world has millions of inhabitants and many cities, its capital being Shambala."

Hindu
"In India there is an ancient belief, still held by some, in a subterranean race of serpent people who dwell in the cities Patala and Bhogavati. According to the legend, they wage war on the kingdom of Agharta. "The Nagas," according to "The Deep Dwellers," "are described as a very advanced race or species, with a highly-developed technology. They also harbor a disdain for human beings, whom they are said to abduct, torture, interbreed with and even to eat."
http://www.crystalinks.com/hollowearth.html

Lots of interesting reading on this page, link at bottom...

ADMIRAL RICHARD E. BYRD
"The first public scientific evidence of Agartha's existence occurred in 1947 when Admiral Richard E. Byrd of the United States Navy flew to the North Pole. Instead of going over the pole - he actually entered the inner earth. In his diary, he tells of entering the hollow interior of the earth, along with others and traveling 17 miles over mountains, lakes, rivers, green vegetation, and animal life. He tells of seeing tremendous animals --resembling the mammoths of antiquity moving --through the brush. He eventually found cities and a thriving civilization. The external temperature was 74 degrees F..."

THE HOLLOW EARTH: A MADDENING THEORY THAT CAN'T BE DISPROVED
From OMNI Magazine (October 1983)...

United States Patent 1096102: The Hollow Earth Theory
"On November 25, 1912 Marshall B. Gardner of Aurora, Kane County, Illinois, USA, submitted his discovery application to the United States Patent Office. 18 months later, on May 12,1914, this federal agency granted Mr. Gardner United States patent 1096102, the second most important scientific document ever issued. Its scientific significance is exceeded only by the mechanical flight discovery of Orville and Wilbur Wright in 1903. For reasons which even Mr. Gardner could not have fully anticipated in the early 1900s, and which are now abundantly clear, his discovery soon became the most highly classified military secret of all time. In 1913 Gardner wrote his original book proving beyond any doubt that our Earth is a hollow sphere. So voluminous was the evidence which he continued to amass from studies of astronomy and Polar exploration, that he expanded his book to 450 pages in 1920...."
http://greyfalcon.us/Agartha.htm

I saw a new movie this weekend called
JOURNEY TO THE CENTER OF THE EARTH, starring Brendan Fraser.
It was an interesting twist on the H. G. Wells book by the same name written in 1864...

they found an entrance to another world inside the Earth, similar to the one Hollow Earthers claim that was discovered by Admiral Byrd---first in the North Pole and later in the South Pole, although of course this has never been conclusively proven or widely accepted. In the science fiction book, on a beach covered with bones, Axel discovers an oversized human skull. Axel and Lidenbrock venture some way into the prehistoric forest, where Professor Lidenbrock points out, in a shaky voice, a prehistoric human, more than twelve feet in height, leaning against a tree watching a herd of mastodons. This part was not in the new movie, however they did encounter dinosaurs in the new movie.

You can read more about Admiral Byrd and the so-called "Hollow Earth Theory" here, be advised, I am in no way endorsing the writings of Rodney M. Cluff or his website, but with regard to the material about Admiral Byrd as written by Dr. R. W. Bernard, to me some parts are kind of interesting as shown here:
http://www.ourhollowearth.com/Bernard/Chapter1.htm

I did find it interesting that there was a well-documented and massive military expedition into the Antarctic, organized by Admiral Byrd back in the 1940's called OPERATION HIGH JUMP, Wikipedia describes it as follows:

"Operation Highjump was the largest Antarctic expedition to date. Conspiracy theorists specializing in alleged Aryan or Nazi activities in Antarctica have extensively speculated about this mission. In 1946, US Navy Secretary James Forrestal assembled a huge amphibious naval force for an Antarctic Expedition expected to last six to eight months. Besides the flagship Mount Olympus and the aircraft carrier Philippine Sea, there were thirteen US Navy support ships, six helicopters, six flying boats, two seaplane tenders and fifteen other aircraft. The total number of personnel involved was over 4,000. The armada arrived in the Ross Sea on 31 December 1946, and made aerial explorations of an area half the size of the United States, recording ten new mountain ranges. The major area covered was the eastern coastline of Antarctica from 150 degrees east to the Greenwich meridian. The expedition was terminated abruptly at the end of February 1947, six months early, the entire remaining armada returning immediately to the United States. The early termination of the mission was never explained."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard_Evelyn_Byrd

BIGFOOT...

My kids asked me the other day if I thought BIGFOOT was real... :rolleyes:

I told them I did not believe in a "missing link" between man and ape, because we know man did not come from apes. However, I was quick to add, there are many things on the earth which man has little or no explanation for, and to be honest there are some species like the Coelacanth which have defied modern science, and others like the Megamouth Shark (Megachasma pelagios) that have completely eluded discovery until 1976. Komodo dragons were not documented by Europeans until 1910, and they were not really studied scientifically until the late 1960's.

So, with that in mind---could BIGFOOT really exist?

I don't know.
As Bible believers, we know that "Natural Man" is cursed, and desperate to prove his "ape ancestry," and there have been plenty of frauds over the years, 2008 being no exception. A recent "Bigfoot discovery" made headlines around the world, and had the media in a frenzy.
AIG reports...

"According to a CNN news report a few months ago, two amateur Bigfoot hunters stumbled upon the body of the creature in a wooded area of northern Georgia and also claimed that they saw several living ones in the same location—at least, according to one version of their story. Although there was supposed to be much more forthcoming, they only released “evidence” of purported DNA test results from the intestine of the alleged creature indicating human, possum, and “indeterminate” DNA. In fact, the most recent reports show that the jig is up and the fraud has been found out."
http://www.cnn.com/2008/US/08/14/big...ody/index.html

But all frauds aside, there are plenty of legends among the American Indians, and other places around the world, of giant bipedal creatures, living secretly in the remote areas of the world. Like UFO's, many people including law enforcement officials claim to see these things every year. Are they ALL lying? Are they ALL being duped by something fraudulent or faked? Where is the hard evidence?

If these creatures exist, are they merely a line of large apes similar to the supposedly extinct Gigantopithecus? Or Is there a more intelligent---or even spiritual---side to BIGFOOT? Is there still a race of large creatures that are living in caves or inside the earth? (Gen 6:4, Job 1:7)

Is it possible that these creatures are demonic or perhaps related to the Nephilum or the Antediluvian world? Are they able to come and go among us like the wind, like the Native American Indians suggest? I certainly don't know. But it's interesting.

AIG suggests, "if any unusual apish creature with claimed human-like features, whether called Bigfoot, Sasquatch, Gigantopithecus, etc. is ever found, the astute reader should consider several factors... more on that here:
http://www.answersingenesis.org/arti...h-one-big-hoax

Here is an interesting OLD ARTICLE,
this is from the New York Times published in June 1883.
Click on the blue button "view full article" to see the PDF of the original article, which describes hundreds of unusual skulls with double rows of teeth and strange shapes, very interesting...

AN ANCIENT FORT DISCOVERED.;
EARTH-WORKS CONTAINING MANY SKULLS FOUND IN DAKOTA.

CHICAGO, June 21.--A special to the Tribune from Redfield, Dakota, says: "Several parties at work on a farm four and a half miles south of Redfield have discovered an old fort, which occupied nearly two acres, and from which nearly 200 human skulls have been exhumed...
http://query.nytimes.com/gst/abstrac...609C94629FD7CF

Bro. Parrish,

I, too, checked out and studied Gen 6 a month ago- very very interesting study.

The soon immediate future scares me on what effects scientists could possibly establish by creating some kind of pseudo-eugenic, bionic, intellectual superman. Our combining of science and technology is making this feat very real(and probably behind closed doors). Sounds like the men of renown are already here, working behind the curtains.

Yes, I hear you...
that is an interesting thought, and thanks for your comments! :)

Wow, another very interesting thread.

I believe giants existed because the Bible says so. :)

This is where as Christians we have to be a little careful. If we go around talking about giants, the world is going to think we are very silly, superstituous people. Even some fellow Christians think that. But the truth is, there is much scientific evidence that very large people lived in the past, as shown in some of the articles and photos here. As Christians we never need fear true science, because true science will always agree with God's truth in the end. It is false, psuedo-science we have to fight against.

I have never quite understood why, but evolutionists do not like the idea of giant humans and usually try to discredit serious findings of evidence.

Who knows?, maybe someday they will find Goliath's remains, it ought to be pretty easy to identify him with that stone stuck in his forehead. :)

Me too brother! :thumb:

Very true, good point...

Yeah I'd like to see that in National Geographic... :lol:

Anyone catch this one?

http://www.upi.com/Odd_News/2009/01/...9201233431826/

:eek: :eek: :eek:

Peace and Love,
Stephen

12 fingers, 12 toes, that's amazing!
Might come in handy too,
you would have to have custom gloves tho... :D

Ruckman says that if a nations name ended in an "im or im's" they were decedents of the Giants.

I think it's generally true, if not competely. I remember running into these names quite often in my recent readings through the Scriptures. Here is a non comprehensive list I threw together to help those who are curious to see these names in Scripture for themselves. This list doesn't include all the names that end in *im, just those groups of *ims.

Cherubims (Ge 3:24; Ex 25:18-20,22; 26:1,31; 36:8,35; 37:7-9; Nu 7:89; 1Sa 4:4; 2Sa 6:2; 1Ki 6:23,25,27-29,32,35; 7:29,36; 8:6-7; 2Ki 19:15; 1Ch 13:6; 28:18; 2Ch 3:7,10-11,13-14; 5:7-8; Ps 80:1; 99:1; Isa 37:16; Eze 10:1-3,5-9,15-16,18-20; 11:22; 41:18,20,25; Heb 9:5)
Seraphims (Isa 6:2,6)
Rephaims (Ge 14:5; 15:20; 2Sa 5:18,22; 23:13; 1Ch 11:15; 14:9; Isa 17:5)
Zuzims (Ge 14:5)
Emims (Ge 14:5; De 2:10-11)
Anakims (De 1:28; 2:10-11,21; 9:2; Jos 11:21-22; 14:12,15)
Horims (De 2:12,22)
Zamzummims (De 2:20)
Avims (De 2:23; Jos 18:23 [this one I question a bit])
Caphtorims (Ge 10:14; De 2:23)
Nethinims (1Ch 9:2; Ezr 2:43,58,70; 7:7,24; 8:17,20; Ne 3:26,31; 7:46,60,73; 10:28; 11:3,21)
Lubims (2Ch 12:3; 16:8; Na 3:9)
Sukkiims (2Ch 12:3)
Mehunims (2Ch 26:7; Ezr 2:50)
Cherethims (Eze 25:16)
Gammadims (Eze 27:11)

Pretty interesting to consider where the *ims come from, and then see two types of angelic beings named with names that end in *im.

Peace and Love,
Stephen

And the Nephilim has the "im" too...
that is very interesting... :thumb:

That is interesting. I started Googling around and found this article by John Morris at ICR:

http://www.icr.org/article/540/

What caught my attention about this article was that Morris speculated that Satan's angels may have performed selective breeding to produce giants. Then he ties it to today's experiments in genetics and Christ's warning that the end days would be like Noah's day. There just might something to this.

I think so. I also think it's very strange that those who claim to have been abducted by aliens say that the aliens collect tissue samples and or human seed.

Man I can't believe I'm talking about this. I hope it's ok to talk about this here.

Peace and Love,
Stephen

Hahaha yeah brother, there are things going on in the universe that are a little "beyond the pale," but then again the Bible talks about some crazy stuff happening.

There is more going on than the average Christian thinks; from UFOs, extraterrestrials and things like that to political forces, satanic influence in government and others, there are forces at work beyond our wildest imaginations.

all of it is preparation for the one world anti-christ government and that personal incarnation of Satan himself.

if the conspiracy theory guys like David Icke, Alex Jones (a christian) would get saved or right with the Lord, they would see the truth is written in the pages of the KJV Bible

I agree fully withthe above link message of Dr Morris

Something caught my eye in that ICR article,

"Obviously we cannot speak with certainty, for the Bible gives little detail. At the very least, Satan's demons could have selected and indwelt certain men and women, and performed selective breeding experiments to produce over the generations a race of giants. (He could have done the same with animals too, and maybe that's where some of the unthinkable features we see in the fossil record come from."

What is he talking about in the fossil record?
Maybe this...

http://www.burlingtonnews.net/hornedrace.html

I've seen skulls like that before at Ooparts.


http://www.s8int.com/index.html


Fascinating site, there are over 80 pages of ancient art showing dinosaurs, it would be very difficult to deny that men lived with dinos in the recent past.

But click on the left "There Were Giants In the Earth in Those Days"


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v4...alouskull4.jpg

Someone mentioned UFOs, you will probably think I am the crazy after my post on Fortune Cookies, but I have also seen UFOs several times in my life, twice very close up.

I personally believe UFOs are real, but not what the public thinks they are. I think they are demons meant to deceive the unsaved.

I have a personal theory, that the Rapture may be similar to when Paul was on the road to Damascus. He saw and heard the Lord, the others with him did not. When Christians are taken out of the world at the Rapture, I think it might be similar. Many people will suddenly be missing. I think that Satan will convince the world that UFOs took the people away.

Want to read a truly fascinating article on the relationship between demons and UFOs read here:

http://www.boudillion.com/lam/lam.htm

I think this article makes lots of sense. I also think it quite the coincidence that the modern UFO age started just as Israel became a nation again.

I wonder if that is the skull of a satyr. Perhaps the biblical satyrs are something else, but I always thought they were half goat half men type things with horns.

Peace and Love,
Stephen

I checked the link, and I found it SO disturbing! Anyway, I do believe they were giants as I believe the Bible. Kent Hovind has a good theory as to why people grew up so much in times past. You guys should out his seminars :

http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...63631666&hl=en

As for the horned people (mentioned in the first link) and UFO's, I don't have a clue. I used to believe in UFO when I was lost, but now that I'm saved, I don't. The whole UFO deal could just be a distraction or the strong delusion that God sends on the last days.:confused:

I have a sermon from Bro. Ruckman somewhere on UFO's it's actually very good. According to that sermon he considers the flying roll of Zechariah 5 to be a U.F.O., we know there have been many reported sightings of cigar or cylinder shaped objects over the years, but who knows...

I don't know how anyone could deny the existence of U.F.O's, I have never seen one but these things have been seen by many law enforcement officers, top military and commercial pilots and tracked on radar for years. Sure a percentage are going to be hoaxes or natural phenomenon, but when you get out of the civilian realm, most of these guys don't play games when they are putting their jobs at risk. I think at least SOME of these guys have seen SOMETHING. Of course, U.F.O. simply means "unidentified" flying object, so that doesn't answer the question of WHAT they are seeing, and so there we are, in the same place we were with project Blue Book back in 1969. Out of over 12,000 Blue Book reports, 701 of them — about six percent — are still classified as "unknowns."

Well, there's the thing about UFOs my brother, they're all unidentified. I don't believe they are aliens from outer space living in far away galaxies who are visiting us. No, I believe they are either government top secret crafts, angelic activity (could be GOD's angels or the devil's), or the strong delusion that GOD promised to send on the last days. I use to believe in aliens when I was lost, but now that I'm saved, I don't see any reason to believe in them. However, I have to appreciate the irony of the situation. Before I believed in aliens because it made more sense to me (with all the sightings of witnesses), and thought of giants as fairy tales characters. Now I believe in giants because the Bible says so and also because the proof I seen, and see aliens as either a satanic hoax or the strong delusion. How ironic...:)

Yes Rolando, I suspect perhaps a bit of all three have been involved over the years... a secret, unseen world of activity around us.

Food for thought:
Hollywood has programmed us to equate "aliens" with the silly notion of little green men, but do we not believe in Extraterrestrials? If you define that word as "life originating outside of the Earth," then would not God, Jesus, angelic spirits all qualify as Extraterrestrials... sure they would, at least in a manner of speaking. I remember Bro. Ruckman saying (I'm paraphrasing here) God just needs to sort this sin problem out here on Earth before we start populating other planets. Can't have sin stinking up the whole universe. :)

We are going to populate other planets?:pound: What for if we going to a new Earth and a new Heaven?:amen:

Not sure, you'll have to ask Bro. Ruckman... :rolleyes:

Eternity is a long time...eventually the righteous nations that have access to the New Jerusalem (Rev. 21:24) are going to overpopulate this place...they'll need someplace to go, dontcha' think? :)

Ruckman says that because the heavens are said to be divided according to the number of the tribes of Israel and given to the Gentiles. Well imagine that 12 tribes 12 divisions. Astrology is nothing more than Satan's deception God is the one who divided it and pagan people are the ones who perverted it.

And it will be populated by men with no sin just the way God wouild want it.

How is that possible? According to Luke 20:33-35 we are no longer going to be given in marriage. Correct me if I'm wrong (with scriptures of course), but since we are not going to marry, I assume that we won't be reproducing either. If this true then the point of inhabiting other planets should not be overpopulation. Anyway, I'm yet to read the whole Bible so If I'm missing something, please do enlighten me.

Where in the Bible does it say this? Like I said earlier, I'm yet to read the whole Bible and would appreciate if you guys could tell me where to find this.

Rolando,

I think you misunderstand: in Eternity, there are still three groups.

Jews
Gentiles
The Church

The Church inhabits the New Jerusalem for eternity and do not reproduce.

The Jews have their eternal inheritance but are still completely human.

The Gentiles are divided into twelve nations, and the righteous nations are allowed to come into the New Jerusalem and partake of the Tree of Life. They are still human and will reproduce like normal.

Obviously, at this point the Gospel is the Everlasting Gospel (Rev. 14:6) as these humans will be able to actually SEE Jesus Christ in the New Jerusalem.

That is all new to me, I thought all saved have eternal life and so there is no need to reproduce. Also as Rolando said, we are not given in marriage as the Lord himself said.

Where are the verses to support the Jews being completely human, and the Gentiles being divided into twelve nations?

As for UFOs, I have seen them several times, two times very close (within 200-300 feet). I saw them in detail and do not believe them to be military aircraft. I was raised near airbases my entire young life, my father was an aircraft technician for the military. I have seen just about everything out there, and trust me, these craft were like nothing I have ever seen. I saw a craft in '73 when I was 19 years old at the beach in Florida where I lived. It was your traditional saucer shape (like two saucers laid together). It appeared to be a solid object and glowed a bright orange (this was at night). It was just a few hundred feet (at it's closest approach) from me and probably no more than 200 feet altitude, it made no noise whatsoever. When I first saw it, it was travelling north along the beach just above where the water meets the shore. It was going very slow, 30-40 MPH at most. I know this because there was a car driving up the beach, the UFO was directly above it. I could see the reflection of the UFO in the water. The car turned up an exit ramp and left the beach, the UFO continued straight toward me. I got a little alarmed, then I saw a man standing on the boardwalk smoking a cigarette. I ran up to him and said "Look at that!". He had been looking straight out at the ocean and had not noticed this craft coming up the beach. He said, "What is that??". I said, "I think that is one of those UFOs!"

Then the craft stopped and hovered in place for about one minute. This was long before the Harrier jet that can hover in place (besides, they are super-loud). As we watched, the craft appeared to change shape. It just sort of morphed and became a long rectangle. Then, very suddenly, the craft shot off at amazing speed, so fast it was a blur. It almost appeared like stretching a piece of taffy. It must have been going many thousands of MPH, faster than any aircraft I have ever seen. It turned into a little orange ball and travelled over the horizon. It left a long orange vapor trail that took several minutes to fade away. The man asked if it was a rocket, as Cape Kennedy was only about a hundred miles south. I told him I had seen rockets from Cape Kennedy many times (and I have) and they do not hover in place, and they do not move that quickly either. The man asked me if I was going to tell anybody, I said I didn't know who to tell.

I went home and told my father, but he was half-asleep, I don't think he heard me. Next day I told some co-workers who laughed at me. That embarrased me and made me a little angry. But, fortunately for me, several other people saw this UFO and reported it, there was a brief report on our local radio.

I don't care what anybody says, I am a careful observer, and I know what I saw. This was not some little light moving across the sky at a distance. This thing was close, and very easy to see in detail. It broke all the laws of nature, it produced no sonic-boom. If we had aircraft that could do that, it would kill the occupants to accelerate to tremendous speed from a stand-still. It was instantaneous.

Despite this, I do not believe in aliens from other planets whatsoever. The Bible says Eve is the mother of all living. I do believe these beings and craft are spiritual, and that is why they can defy our natural laws. I personally think they are evil, and I believe they are a delusion sent by Satan to fool unbelievers in the last days. They perform several deceptions, for one, they make people believe in evolution, or that life originated here from space people who colonized the Earth thousands of years ago. Either way, it causes people to disbelieve the creation account in Genesis. I also believe that UFOs might be how Satan explains how all the Christians suddenly disappear at the Rapture. Just watch TV and you will see UFOs beam people aboard. I think this is the very idea Satan wants people to believe. When all the Christians suddenly disappear, Satan will just say the UFOs took everyone away. I could be wrong on this, but that is my belief at present concerning UFOs.