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1611isperfect 06-13-2008 11:47 AM

There Is No Such Thing As "slain In The Spirit"
 

YOU STUPID TONGUE-TALKERS, THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS "SLAIN IN THE SPIRIT" !!!


http://bible-believers.phpbb3now.com...php?f=15&t=143

Brother Tim 06-13-2008 04:26 PM

I would appreciate it, "1611isperfect", if you could tone down the rhetoric. Your subject line will not cause weaker, unlearned brethren to be brought to knowledge. It only serves to cause greater offense.

1611isperfect 06-13-2008 05:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brother Tim (Post 5651)
I would appreciate it, "1611isperfect", if you could tone down the rhetoric. Your subject line will not cause weaker, unlearned brethren to be brought to knowledge. It only serves to cause greater offense.

"Stupid" is only the modern equivalent of the word, "fool". Just as Jesus used.

In fact, if you look up 'stupid' in the websters 1828 (which is what I did before I started using it), it specifically says "a foolish person".

If Jesus were around today, and he wandered into a church where things like this were going on he would definately say something, and it would probably include, "you people are stupid, and you can't even see what you're doing".
Or... the Elizabethian English version: "Ye fools, and blind".


Btw- I'm not just trying to be obtuse here. Have you even watched the videos yet?

Brother Tim 06-13-2008 05:53 PM

You should have then left your original wording,
Quote:

Here are a few people that are [deceived] into thinking this TRASH is actually REAL! They are deceived.
Being deceived is not the same as being a fool or stupid. It is truly sad that believers who otherwise acknowledge Jesus Christ as their LORD and Saviour can be deceived into this false activity, but they are NOT fools. Remember the stern warning that the LORD Jesus gave about calling another believer a fool. A fool is one who rejects the very existence of God. Elevate your speech.

George 06-13-2008 06:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1611isperfect (Post 5648)
YOU STUPID TONGUE-TALKERS, THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS "SLAIN IN THE SPIRIT" !!!

http://bible-believers.phpbb3now.com...php?f=15&t=143

Aloha brother,

I appreciate your "zeal" for the Lord, but on the other hand, in this case I believe it is misplaced.

WHO on this Forum are you addressing? Or WHO on this Forum are you trying to teach, inform or edify? Or WHO on this Forum are you trying to warn, admonish, reprove, or rebuke? Just exactly WHO did you address this "message" to?

If you will check out my posts you will find that I do not hesitate to stand up for the Holy words of God or for those men who have defended it these many years. I have not "shied-away" from taking on those people who have come to this Forum who, I believe, have attacked the Scriptures; or who, have unjustly maligned, falsely charged, or defamed brethren who have defended the Scriptures; or who, have unjustly attacked other people on the Forum; or who, have embraced clear & evident "heresy".

On the other hand, I do not just "flail out" in all directions and loosely get in to "name-calling" (i.e. "stupid") without being very "specific", such as: "Humanist", "Sophist", "Compromiser", "Carnal", "Backbiter", "Railer", "False Accuser", "Blasphemer", "Heretic", "Reprobate", "Wolves", etc., etc. - I'm sure you get the idea. (It is far more "effective" to be specific, than to just brand people as being "stupid").

1 Corinthians 9:26 I therefore so run, not as uncertainly; so fight I, not as one that beateth the air:

One last thing - I doubt very much that there are very many people on this Forum that put much stock in the "Charasmatic" nonsense you pointed out. In other words you are basically "preaching to the choir". So, what was the purpose of your post, if most (if not all) of us here on this Forum are already very much aware of what goes on in some Charasmatic circles?

Are we to condemn all Charasmatics (Pentacostals), because some of them participate in wild behavior - "snake handling", "fainting", screaming, babbling, etc. - that is clearly not Biblical? Are we to condemn them all because they have embraced false doctrine? Are we ever going to be able to persuade any of them of the false doctrine they have embraced if we call them "Stupid"? I trow not!

There is a time and place to "persuade" (teaching & convincing); there is a time and a place to "contend" (warning & admonishing); and there is a time and place to "condemn" (reproving & rebuking). I do not believe that this is the "time" or the "place" for your post - especially since it was not directed at anyone in particular. :confused:

look3467 06-14-2008 01:37 PM

Rom 10:2 For I bear them record that they have a zeal of God, but not according to knowledge.

Because some of us don't have a clearer understanding of things in the bible, we tend to be over zealous in our approach
to defending our beliefs, even though they could be not quite right.

And if we look at history, over overzealous attitudes have made victims pay some serious consequences.


Peace>>>AJ

Easy E 06-14-2008 02:50 PM

Quote:

we tend to be over zealous in our approach
to defending our beliefs, even though they could be not quite right.
Like you not believing that sinners go to Hell. And then continually posting in a forum about the BIBLE.

I need to make sure that I am not drinking coffee or milk while reading your posts sometimes, Look. I can always count on you for a good chuckle, though.

look3467 06-14-2008 03:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Easy E (Post 5669)
Like you not believing that sinners go to Hell. And then continually posting in a forum about the BIBLE.

I need to make sure that I am not drinking coffee or milk while reading your posts sometimes, Look. I can always count on you for a good chuckle, though.

Well, if but a chuckle, then your safe.

Because there is the interpretation of hell being a real place doesn't mean that there can not be an opposite interpretation of hell not being a real place.

Because one interprets the bible one way does not mean the bible is not open to other interpretations.

I bring a different view of the same bible and one whose foundation is Christ.

I was brought up in the Southern Baptist traditions along with their views.

So, I am not foreign to what you state.

But you are foreign to what I state because you haven't heard of my views except on here.

There is more to God then what we have been thought simply by looking into His word to find answers.

If we are open to understanding the scope of Gods works rather then understanding only what mankind thinks should be Gods works, then we can see through a glass darkly clearly.

Peace>>>AJ

Diligent 06-14-2008 07:54 PM

If this thread didn't already have some good replies in it, I would have deleted it.

1611isperfect, you need to dial it down a few notches.

Cody1611 06-14-2008 10:59 PM

I've been talking to this pentecostal guy on my forum and I have showed him verse after verse trying to explain to him that tongues are not for today. I'm going to show you some of his responses to what one of my members said. Please give your thoughts.

Quote:

1 Cor. 1:22 is taken completely out of context. Read the entire passage, and you won't see tongues listed anywhere. Instead, the passage is saying that the Word is not wordly wisdom.

1 Cor. 14:22 says nonbelievers, not Jews. To say it means Jews is private interpretation, because ITS NOT THERE!

And Exodus 4:8...

8: And it shall come to pass, if they will not believe thee, neither hearken to the voice of the first sign, that they will believe the voice of the latter sign.

refers to Exodus 7:6-13

6: And Moses and Aaron did as the Lord commanded them, so did they.
7: And Moses was fourscore years old, and Aaron fourscore and three years old, when they spake unto Pharoah.
8: And the Lord spake unto Moses and unto Aaron, saying,
9: When Pharoah shall speak unto you, saying, Shew a miracle for you: then thou shalt say unto Aaron, Take thy rod, and cast it before Pharoah, and it shall become a serpent.
10: And Moses and Aaron went in unto Pharoah, and they did so as the Lord had commanded: and Aaron cast down his rod before Pharoah, and before his servants, and it became a serpent.
11: Then Pharoah also called the wise men and the sorcerers: now the magicians of Egypt, they also did in like manner with their enchantments.
12: For they cast down every man his rod, and they became serpents; but Aaron's rod swallowed up their rods.
13: And he hardened Pharoah's heart, that he hearkened not unto them; as the Lord had said.

OK, NOW... do you see what Exodus 4:8 is referring to? You take verses out of context and expect me to think that your "rightly dividing the Word of God?"

Come on, give me some other verses to back your claim. Remember, study closely what this guy said in his argument, and the verses he used: He has a pretty solid defense.

I never knew that the Holy Spirit and His works were only a sign to the Jews. Why don't you use your brain and find me a scripture that says that tongues actually ceased after the Jews rejected Stephen's message? You can't.
I think it's pretty obvious to look back at the Old Testament and see that the Jews required a sign. What do you guys think?

look3467 06-15-2008 08:42 AM

It is my experience from all that I have lived that God always looked at my heart.

If my heart was not right with Him, it didn’t matter what I did, if wouldn’t be blessed.
I was blessed as a child being a Catholic because my heart was for Him.
I was blessed as a Baptist because my heart was for Him.
I was blessed as a non Denominational because my heart was for Him.
I was blessed in all my searching’s, meaning going out and beyond the box of my Christian upbringing, because my heart was for Him.
I am blessed today with peace and assurance and what I consider wisdom in understanding Him, because my heart is still for Him.

So, whatever a man puts his hand to do, if his heart is for God, God will bless him.

1Co 3:13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is.

That verse tells it exactly as it is for the believer and non believer alike.

Mankind’s soul was purchased and paid for by God in Jesus.
Now, our works are judged and tried by God’s fire, (Love) of what they are, wood, stubble, silver or gold and are rewarded accordingly yet while we are alive in the flesh.

If what I said is true, then why can we not love our neighbor regardless of what they believe?
Must we demand that they believe as we?

What if they believe as we because we demonstrated God’s love in our words and our actions regardless of what they previously believed?

We are rescuers’, of souls, from the grip (Gates of hell) of this world.

We are Ambassadors’ for Christ, leading by example and not criticizing or condemning what is not agreeable with our own beliefs.

So, think about it, be zealous in love of heart and not in the letter of the law, for the law, traditions and religious practices are but practices of our choosing and in which cause divisons.

Rom 4:15 Because the law worketh wrath: for where no law is, there is no transgression.

Because the law worketh divisions.

Gal 3:12 And the law is not of faith: but, The man that doeth them shall live in them.

Therefore if we divide because of our beliefs, then we are condemned to live by them.

Jam 2:12 So speak ye, and so do, as they that shall be judged by the law of liberty.

If we are judged by the law of liberty, meaning without the law, why should we judge others by the law?

These are just my opinions consisting of my life’s experiences of which wisdom is a product of both knowledge and understandings.

Peace>>>AJ




Luke 06-15-2008 02:35 PM

I just find it crude to speak like that.

Same with the "shut your mouth" and the "indy 500" videos.

If you want to use the word fool, use it.

Out of interest, the word "stupid" is used in the message Bible, as a replacement for fool.

Why don't we start using piss in everyday language? It's the modern equivelent of pisseth. I'm sure telling someone to "p*** off" would show the love of God as much as telling someone to "shut up" or that they are "stupid".

The thing is, you are not Jesus Christ. You are not justified in using his language, because you are a sinner, like everyone else. The fact you are saved should bring humility, not pride and arrogance.

Cody1611 06-15-2008 03:04 PM

Preach it, Luke.

Steven Avery 06-15-2008 05:09 PM

Hi Folks,

I will say that it is more than a bit of a turn-off to see unlikely threads with unnecessary acrimony titles on this forum.

As I remember, the first King James Bible book I read was from a Pentecostal, Daniel Segraves 'The Search for the Word of God, in Defense of the King James Bible'. The second was from the Baptist William Grady, 'Final Authority'. Each one was excellent in its own way, Segraves really touched on the paradigmic issues nicely (e.g. how unbelievers brought inapplicable textual principles from secular works like Chaucer and Shakespeare into the Bible textual field, for Bible reconstruction) while Grady put out a superb in-depth book covering tons of issues.

Now their doctrines on some issues may be miles apart (and Segraves today may be a little mushy in his Bible views, too accepting of any TR-based text) however I point that out at least to show that the King James Bible purity and perfection is sensed and realized in wide swaths of what is usually considered todays Christian world. Nobody has a monopoly on this truth.

A nice guideline is:

Colossians 4:5-6
Walk in wisdom toward them that are without,
redeeming the time.
Let your speech be alway with grace, seasoned with salt,
that ye may know how ye ought to answer every man.


Shalom,
Steven Avery

PS.
As an aside, there are many who are sympathetic doctrinally to 'speaking in tongues' who view the modern charismatic emphasis on 'slain in the spirit' as offbase. However this is a minor counterpoint mention, the key sharing is above.

Paladin54 06-15-2008 06:57 PM

1611isperfect,
May I direct you to a thread I started addressing a topic that may interest you and that will also answer your thread?

http://av1611.com/forums/showthread.php?t=298

Renee 06-15-2008 08:31 PM

Cody 1611,

This subject has be covered in an older thread, --Doctrine ---The gifts of the Holy Spirit for today? Perhaps if newer members (not saying you are new we joined about the same time) read the older post we would learn many things. I know I have been going back to when the forum was first started and I have gleaned some good lessons; but as in everything we must be careful for there are some things that may lead us down the wrong path.

Aloha
Renee

Cody1611 06-15-2008 10:11 PM

Thanks for your reply, sister Renee. I'll look for that thread.

God Bless

Luke 06-16-2008 03:34 AM

I finally got access to a computer that can view youtube, and I have to say that this is not only disturbing (I couldn't watch it, it is evil), but it's very very sad to see people who desire a relationship with God (at least, one would assume they do), but rely on experience and weird attractions rather than knowing God from his word.

These people need prayer, preaching, and the truth in love.

chette777 06-16-2008 07:06 PM

Is the gift of an iterpretable tongue the same as the sign to the Jew of Acts 2?

though 1Cor 14 does speak of an unknown tongue. of which previous to this statement of an unknown tongue it is clear never existed until the Corinthian church invented it. for all the other verses in ACTs spoke in a other tongues, and speak with tongues (context tells us it was Hebrew or Greek) not an unknown tongue singular of 1Cor. Chapter 14.

1 Cor 12 is a gift given to.... Profit withal. and one of the gifts was diverse tongues and another gift Interpretation of Tongues. not Unkown tongues (of Chapter 14). the gift of Acts 10 is not tongues but the HOLY GHOST see vs 45.

So gifts and signs? things that are different are not the same.

the thing to look at is. why would the Lord Via the Holy Ghost give GIFTS to the BORN AGAIN CHURCH in 1 Cor 12 and they not be for today? Why do many assume that the GIFT of TONGUES which according to Paul needs the GIFT of interpretation of Tongues to profit withal speaking of the Christian Body of Christ, is the sign for the Jews only?

And Paul instructs to COVET the best gifts not the BEST SIGNS.

Though I have yet to hear anyone speak in a diverse tongues and it be interpreted. I do NOT agree that the gift of 1COR 12 is the same as the signs of ACTS. And I myself do not have the gift of tongues nor would I allow it with out an interpretation and I would expect that both people having those gifts would have to be male's only (sorry ladies but it said given unto every man not everyone or woman)

Why are not these things not happening in the church. Because most Christians are not Filled witht he Holy Ghost, they are more easily filled with the flesh. being occupied (a meaning of filled)with the HOLY GHOST takes careful prayer and faith in the Lord to do in you His will not just for salvation, sinlessness and sanctification but also for the distribution of gifts to profit the body. Read Lewis Chafer's book, He that is Spiritual. if you want it I will email it to you.

The reason the sign and the gift are made to be the same is a man made doctrine designed with the best intentions to protect the weak from the fleshy movement that was taking place in Corinth when Paul addressed the whole issue. so rather than teach is correctly, the difference between sign and gift and how it opporates. it was easier to create a system to lump it all together and make it not for today.

the other thing about speaking in an Unkown Tongue is that it is disobedience to the word of God. and no one in disobedience can claim to be filled with the Holy Ghost and exercising a gift of the Holy Ghost.

Biblestudent 06-17-2008 01:12 AM

Brother Chette, here are my thoughts:

I think tongues are both a gift and a sign, and the purpose of it was to convince an unbelieving Jew (1 Cor. 14:22; 1:22).

Under the Kingdom program, it is a SIGN of the kingdom - to convince an unbelieving Jew of the kingdom at hand.

Under the Church age, it is a GIFT for a certain period of time (1 Cor. 13:8, "they shall cease") - to convince an unbelieving Jew of the transition into the Church Age and the postponement of the kingdom.

Tongues are also one of the SIGNS of the kingdom apostles (the Twelve) as well as of the church apostles (Paul, Barnabas, etc.). Not all are required to speak with tongues during the Church Age (1 Cor. 14), and as this age progresses, God is lifting these signs. After about the first century, God no longer calls apostles and prophets, but evangelists, pastors and teachers (Eph 4).

chette777 06-17-2008 04:42 PM

ok sounds good,

go to Doctrine, Holy Spiritgifts for today Post and look at my post of the differences of the tongues. you will notice that sometimes there were no unbeleivers of Christ present when tongues were spoken, and what was the purpose of the gift in 1Cor12 which is different than 1Cor 14 for unbeleivers.

look3467 06-17-2008 09:02 PM

Just a short note on the 777 Chette.
Ref:
Gen 41:32 And for that the dream was doubled unto Pharaoh twice; it is because the thing is established by God, and God will shortly bring it to pass.

God doubles things twice before He brings it to pass.
God the Father rested after creation, first 7, Jesus rested after His re-creation, and we rest after we find rest in Christ, for He is our Sabbath rest.

The same for 666. The first 6 is mankind created, marred, and dead, the second 6 (doubled)is Jesus recreating the first six to a quickening spirit, and the last 6 is you and I, the new man in Christ, the new creation.

This is all consistent with the whole works of God in the bible.

From start to finish.

Peace>>>AJ

Luke 06-18-2008 02:10 AM

I think you have lost it...


Are you saying the number 666 signifies the new creation of Jesus Christ? The born again believer?

What are you? Madam Blavatsky's lil lapdog?

look3467 06-18-2008 08:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Luke (Post 5751)
I think you have lost it...


Are you saying the number 666 signifies the new creation of Jesus Christ? The born again believer?

What are you? Madam Blavatsky's lil lapdog?

Not lost it, but understanding it.

You see Luke, there is more to the word of God than what we have been taught. But that is up to the individual to seek it out,that is, if there is a desire to.

Let me pose a question to you and give me your honest answer.

On the following verse, why did Jesus make that statement?

Joh 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

Peace>>>AJ







chette777 06-18-2008 06:31 PM

that was interesting AJ.

I can tell you believe that we do not have to work for salvation once we are in Christ. Rest is the thing while the Holy Ghost works in us and through us. we don't need to strive and we are the only ones giventhe Holy Ghost for that purpose.

we are told God will give them His Spirit in their hearts Speaking of Jews in the Millenial but it is for the purpose to keep all his comands, and ordenances. If I am Right you can find it in Hebrews.

look3467 06-18-2008 07:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chette777 (Post 5777)
that was interesting AJ.

I can tell you believe that we do not have to work for salvation once we are in Christ. Rest is the thing while the Holy Ghost works in us and through us. we don't need to strive and we are the only ones given the Holy Ghost for that purpose.

we are told God will give them His Spirit in their hearts Speaking of Jews in the Millennial but it is for the purpose to keep all his commands, and ordinances. If I am Right you can find it in Hebrews.


God the Father rested in His first creation of mankind, double that and you have another similar creation but this time a spiritual one. Having doubled it, God brings it to fruition in the sacrifice of Jesus and we find the our final rest in Jesus in our salvation.

7 doubled 77 and brought to pass = our rest.

Why was this dream doubled?
Gen 41:32 And for that the dream was doubled unto Pharaoh twice; it is because the thing is established by God, and God will shortly bring it to pass.

Bet you never thought of that before?

Here another clue verse:
Hos 12:10 I have also spoken by the prophets, and I have multiplied visions, and used similitude's, by the ministry of the prophets.


On those two verse lie the keys to great mysteries in the bible and given to those who would seek them out.

Peace>>>AJ

chette777 06-20-2008 07:58 PM

seems like look3467 in practicing numerology a demonic practice at best.

we need no numbers to tells us what the Bible clearly says. Look3467, you must like the Divinci (sp?) Code. maybe that is why you have 3467 in your name you found it means something for you.

Numerology in this day will lead to demons about you. if you are born again I will encourage you to stop that practice.

also I read the same info you posted about 666 in some church Universal and Triumphant material many years ago before both founders died. it is a doctrine of a devil to say the least New Age at best.

you ar not helping by spreading such blasphemous material on this site. You may find a better site somewhere else to post your new age doctrines

as far as the 777 in my name I just put it there because others have used chette on other sites so I use chette777 on CNN as well. It has no meaning to me or to others than just to Identify me from the other Chettes out there

we also already know that God inforces things by doubling. most of us already know that baby stuff.

look3467 06-20-2008 09:07 PM

Quote:

Seems like look3467 in practicing numerology a demonic practice at best.>>>chette777

Practicing? How about understanding the numbers our God uses repeatedly in the bible to give us a clue to His works?

Surely you have questioned in your mind why 12 apostles and not 14, or why 6 days and rests the 7th, or why the 7 seals, or why march around Jericho 7 times, 7 candle sticks, 7 vials. 7 eyes, 7 spirits of God, 7 churches, 7 years of plenty, 7 years of drought, etc……..

God has it in there by design and we are free to seek out the answers why.

Quote:

we need no numbers to tells us what the Bible clearly says. Look3467, you must like the Divinci (sp?) Code. maybe that is why you have 3467 in your name you found it means something for you.>>>Chette777


We need no numbers? What about forgiving our enemies 7x7 times? Why not just one time?
How about the second born, #2 person inheriting the kingdom of their fathers: Esau and Jacob: Ishmael and Isaac, the first Adam the second Adam.

I tell you, that if you ventured into finding out why God used these numbers you would be pleasantly amazed.

Quote:

Numerology in this day will lead to demons about you. if you are born again I will encourage you to stop that practice.>>>chette777


Lead to demons? Come on chette, God uses numbers multiplied many times.
Here is a clue for you: Hos 12:10 I have also spoken by the prophets, and I have multiplied visions, and used similitudes, by the ministry of the prophets.

Multiplied visions? God doubles things twice before He brings it to pass.
That’s 3 times!
Why did the cock crow 3 times?

And Yes, I am born again of the spirit of life in Jesus and I am not subject to the holds of this world because Jesus has set me free.

Quote:

also I read the same info you posted about 666 in some church Universal and Triumphant material many years ago before both founders died. it is a doctrine of a devil to say the least New Age at best.>>>chette


Any doctrine that would not give glory to God is not of God! Numbers do give God the glory, after all, the gematria of the name of Jesus is 888.

You do know that the first day of the following week is the eighth? That new week has no end?

you ar not helping by spreading such blasphemous material on this site. You may find a better site somewhere else to post your new age doctrines>>>chette


Chette, I realize how zealous you are about the word, but you do know that the Holy Spirit is our teacher and gives us understandings of His word?

Quote:

as far as the 777 in my name I just put it there because others have used chette on other sites so I use chette777 on CNN as well. It has no meaning to me or to others than just to identify me from the other Chettes out there>>>chette


Should you not use something attached to your name not knowing what they are?
You obviously had some interest in that set of numbers because you wanted to be identified with them in your Id.

My numbers on my ID are designed to mean something just as God designed His numbers to mean something.

On my ID, 3 represent 3 pictures of the same day, the day Jesus was led to the cross.
4 represents that same day divided into 4 quarters.
6 represents each quarter of that same day being 6 hours periods.
And 7, is the same day as a whole, a 24 hour day.

If that day is dissected, you will find how God recreated the 7-day creation in just one day.

Jesus came to change the world in heart only; therefore, we are a new creation.
The lost world came to an end at the cross, and the New Jerusalem was born in Christ’s resurrection.

He who is in Christ is not of this world, but is in the world, and the world holds no claims on us.
With Christ as my foundation, and on which I stand firmly, what have I have to fear, numbers, denominations, religious beliefs, what?

Fear is our enemy and keeps us from gaining understanding.

If you believe in Jesus, and understand you are saved by Him and not what you do, then you know you are safe and should feel and know that once reborn, you can not again become unborn.

If one remains inside a bottle, one is limited to what one sees in side only, but if one sees from the outside of the bottle, not only can one see what is in the bottle but all else outside as well.

Religion is good for the child as guidance, fellowship and strength, but if that child matures in the word, it will find liberty.

Liberty which does not bind, but allows love to be expressed freely.

Peace>>>AJ

chette777 06-21-2008 12:24 AM

AJ you are way off base in using God's word in the way you are with numbers. just because the Lord has 12 disciples is not a command to see why he only has twelve. you will notice Acts 2 there were 16 voices spoken and 16 men present at the time the sound of a rushing wind that divided itself into cloven tongues and rested on each one.

you don't have to know why God chose to have 7 days for the week, or why 28 days (four 7's) in a month (that is changed by men but based onteh cycle of the moon) but there is no hidden meaning in it. or 7 feasts 70 years, 70 or 72 disciples or why Satans name and death have five letters each. or why when one is smote under the fifth rib he will die. and if you know Christ risen onteh third day was nothing super spiritual it had to do with the custom of many eastern cultures that upon the fourth day a body is corrupt. Gods word said he would not let his Holy one see corruption. not hidden numbers needed to reveal that.

if God wanted us to waist time on figuring out the numbers he used he would give us a clear instructions on how to and which ones. 2Tim2:15 is the study of the word not the numbers. you will spend you life on that and miss a lot more than you think.

My freind I was already down that path of looking for the number meaning in the Bible when involed in the New Age cult of Church Universal and Triumphant. they were all into what you have just shared in your latest post. it is nothing new. But this I know these people believed in beings from other planets who have come here and are known as the Illuminate(Satan and his angels) and they are the ones who taught this whole number thing you are so freely thinking is of God.

I am born Again not reborn. and not loosing your salvation does not give you the right to dabble in Demonological teachings of Numbers. you will bring a blinding to your eyes to Gods truth not enlightenment. all what you said was said by the Illuminate (Satan and his angels) when they taught us that in the CUT cult. It would bring us freedom from fear, denominationlism and religion. I am telling you I have heard all your words directly from them. you may already be possessed and you are not trully saved as you think.

"from gaining understanding" that was the serpents (Satan) call to Eve, Genesis3: for God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil. you are saying the same thing by claining if we will not open up to numerology we are traped in a bottle of Ignorance. No my freind it is the Devil who has your eyes (heart) focused on doing something you have no need to do. for the scriptures are clear on all of God wonderous wisdoms and ways. nothing is hidden in numbers beleive me.

A man named Simon beleived on Jesus (was he saved?) but he was rebuked by Peter with these words I say to you, "Repent therefore of this thy wickedness, and pray God, if perhaps the thought of thine heart may be forgiven thee Acts 8:22. for you it is not about gaining power to lay hand so men can receive the Holy Ghost. But that you think you can gain more knowledge by taking Gods word and numbering and getting hidden data and secrets that others cannot.

As I said in the last post you felt we did not know about how God inforces his word by doubling. we know all about his concentrated (Multiplying, doubling, tripling) ways, but he also has substarctions, divisions and removals.

We did not learn these things by converting numbers but by the study of His word for it is clear nothing is hidden as you assume. that is a lie of the Devil.

We will be praying for you and may I give you warning if you continue to place post which teach New AGe teachings you may have to answer to the Web Master. this is a site to learn and share Bible not New Age teachings.

look3467 06-21-2008 12:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chette777 (Post 5836)
AJ you are way off base in using God word in the way you are in numbers. just because the Lord has 12 disciples is not a command to see why he only has twelve. you will notice Acts 2 there were 16 voices spoken and 16 men present at the time the sound of a rushing wind that divided itself into cloven tongues and rested on each one.

you don't have to know why God chose to have 7 days for the week, or why 28 days (four 7's) in a month (that is changed by men but based onteh cycle of the moon) but there is no hidden meaning in it.

if God wanted us to waist time on figuring out the numbers he used he would give us a clear instructions on how to and which ones. 2Tim2:15 is the study of the word not the numbers. you will spend you life on that and miss a lot more than you think.

My freind I was already down that [ath of looking for the number meanins in the Bible when involed in the New Age cult of Church Universal and Triumphant. they were all into what you have just shared in your latest post. it is nothing new. But this I kow these peopel believed in beings from other planets who have come here and are known as the Illuminate(Satan and his angels) and they are the ones who taught this whole number thing you are so freely thinking is of God.

Good Day AJ this will be my last word

REPENT!

Sorry you feel that way. But your right, you don't have to know anything you don't want to.

Peace>>>AJ

chette777 06-21-2008 03:51 PM

Aj please reread my last post you are have not completely seen all of it by your quote. I was still writing it when you quoted it. that answeres why I was having a hard time editing it you were quoting.

please bear with my posting I am in a remote area using a cell phone as a modem. we are having a typhoon and my computer goes offline hence I post and edit and repost took some time yeaterday.

but reread it for all the whole thing. god gave me more to sahre with you. And don't assume I don't have knowledge because I wont study your numbers in the Bible. My reason for not doing it is seen above in my long post to you.

I have greater knowledge of the KJV Bible than you think. and I could share more of that but it is not necessary.

however. you may have knowledge but you lack wisdom. they are different. Also knowledge comes from God when a man does as God commands, not what man thinks God wants like converting numbers in the Bible. Again give me a scripture address where God is commanding us to count numbers? the only one I found was in Revelation and that is to people in the Great Tribulation and that was to count a mans name not number or doublings or multiplications. or dvisions subtractions or removals.

I do know this every man I know who has gotten of the pure word into rabbit trails such as yourself in Numberology, have lost their minds, voices, families and lives.

Beware in what your dabbleing in for you know not the evil you are toying with.

chette777 06-21-2008 04:21 PM

Ps 12:6 The words of the LORD are pure words: as silver tried in a furnace of earth, purified seven times. when silver is purified seven times it is completely free of inpurities. No counting numbers to tell me that I could ask any Jewish Jewelery Maker and he can tell you that. and he will quote it from teh word of God.

PUre words AJ no hidden things that need to be brought out like impurities in silver or gold. God speaks to simple men of simple lives his pure word.

George 06-21-2008 04:57 PM

LOOK 3467,

Quote:

Sorry you feel that way. But your right, you don't have to know anything you don't want to.
A word of caution:

God never said to rightly divide the "numbers" in the Bible - He told us to rightly divide the word!

God didn't instruct us to hide the "numbers" in the Bible in our heart - He wants us to hide His words!

God never said that His "numbers" shall not pass away - He said "my words shall not pass away"!

The Lord Jesus Christ never said: If a man love me, he will keep my "numbers" - "If a man love me, he will keep my words"!

I could go on and cite numerous other examples, but the above verses should clearly demonstrate what God emphasizes when it comes to the Scriptures. However I will give one more example to prove my point:

Psalms 138:2 I will worship toward thy holy temple, and praise thy name for thy lovingkindness and for thy truth: for thou hast magnified thy word above all thy name.

Please notice - God did NOT "magnify" His "numbers" above His Holy Name - He "Magnified" His "word above all thy name". If God wanted us to spend all of our time in "numerology", why has He clearly put such emphasis on His Holy word and not on "numbers"? Hmmmm?

While "numerology" is interesting and it is clear to those of us who have studied, that God definitely has used certain numbers to fulfill His purposes, to get caught up in "numerology" will only "sidetrack" you from the study of God's word. Satan has a "device" to sidetrack anyone.

There are some people on this Forum who try to make God's word say something other than what it says by trying to convince us that the words really MEAN something other than what they SAY (by using "The Greek", "The Hebrew", Lexicons, Dictionaries, Christian scholars, Christian celebrities, etc.) - your over-emphasis of "numbers" in the Bible can only lead to "private interpretation" of the words of God and an "elitist attitude", that you know something that we don't know.

Much of what you have presented on this Forum is "cloaked" in a "mystical", "obscure", or "allegorical" manner. God wants His people (Christians) today to understand his words. He doesn't speak to us in Parables or "numerical" mysteries (cloaked in New Age lingo) in the church age.

The ultimate purpose of all Bible instruction today should be to: "Edify" NOT "Mystify" the brethren.

Proverbs 8:8 All the words of my mouth are in righteousness; there is nothing froward or perverse in them.
9 They are all plain to him that understandeth, and right to them that find knowledge.

A word to the wise should be sufficient.

chette777 06-21-2008 11:32 PM

Right on George.

I couldn't put it better myself

look3467 06-22-2008 10:01 AM

LOOK 3467,
Quote:
Sorry you feel that way. But your right, you don't have to know anything you don't want to.

A word of caution:

God never said to rightly divide the "numbers" in the Bible - He told us to rightly divide the word!


Hi, George

Don’t fear the numbers for they are not the focus of your salvation, Jesus is!

And Jesus is all one needs period.

If one wants to spread the Gospel of Good news, let him concentrate on that, but if one wants to seek Gods works, and then let him do that also.

I speak to those who desire a deeper understanding of Gods word of which will not find in the normal circles of Christianity.

Mar 4:11 And he said unto them, Unto you it is given to know the mystery of the kingdom of God: but unto them that are without, all these things are done in parables:

I wanted to know from God the mystery of this verse: Joh 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

Apart from Christianity’s view on that verse as I presume you all know it well, is there another explanation?

Here’s what my problem was with that verse, and I know Christians had no answer or than to say “God will have mercy upon whom He will have mercy on” as their final answer.

I sought it out from the Lord, but not before leading me through un-chartered territory in my quest.

The studies in numbers in the bible was one of them, studies in differing worlds religious beliefs and studies in the Jewish Sabbath.

He gave me the answer and in which I now have a clearer understanding and greater appreciation for His works.

You all make judge me as you will, but I will make no such judgment of you all, for I came from within your ranks, and the only thing that has changed is my views.

But Jesus is still my Savior and no one can touch that.

I am a born again believer, never to die again and am a king and priest in the Kingdom of my God.
Making a judgment call, friends, do ye suppose that my knowledge in numbers may dam my soul to hell?

If the answer is yes, let’s talk about it, if its no, then you know what I know.

Peace>>>AJ

look3467 06-22-2008 10:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chette777 (Post 5847)
Ps 12:6 The words of the LORD are pure words: as silver tried in a furnace of earth, purified seven times. when silver is purified seven times it is completely free of inpurities. No counting numbers to tell me that I could ask any Jewish Jewelery Maker and he can tell you that. and he will quote it from teh word of God.

PUre words AJ no hidden things that need to be brought out like impurities in silver or gold. God speaks to simple men of simple lives his pure word.

God doesn't multiply? You mean to tell me that in order for Jesus to save the souls of mankind, He could only save those after His sacrifice for sins?

What about all that went before Him, what was, is the condition of their souls?

Can you now begin to see the picture of the 7 times? & is the story of creation and in order for Jesus to save the world, as God promised, Ref:
Joh 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
Joh 17:23 I in them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me.


You see, God the creator saves His own creation for He loves His creation that He would give up His own Son as an offering for us.

In order to do that, God would have to Judge Jesus on all 7 counts, meaning every soul that ever lived, Jesus must pay for.

Is there any other creation but the 7-day creation? Then, Jesus must do it all in one 24hour day, be tried 7 times from the eve of the Friday to the eve of the Sabbath.

One day, is all it took. Hence this verse:
1Jo 1:1 That which was from the beginning, which we have heard, which we have seen with our eyes, which we have looked upon, and our hands have handled, of the Word of life;

Jesus is the beginning of a new creation of which there is no end.

Hence the following verse:
Act 4:12 Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.

That makes Jesus our God, as our Father and as we are, a new creation in Him.

Peace>>>AJ

chette777 06-22-2008 10:21 PM

Man are you confused AJ.

you still didn't give us a Bible scripture of God comanding us to studies in numbers in the bible?

no one said God doesn't multiply we told you we already know that BABY STUFF.

uncharted territory (demonic territory) world religions (perversions of Satan and his devils) you are admitting to us you are dabbeling in demonic knowledge.

you ae puffed up thinking you have some superior knowledge. I know clearly by Scripture that Jesus died for every Human being who ever lived past present and future. and none of us needed to study numbers to figure that out. And not everyone will be saved even though Jesus died for them.

I am the new creation of whcih there is no end and so is every true born again beleiver. you have gained nothing by studying numbers.

it is not important Jesus had to do it all in a 24 hour period. he actually took 30 years or so to do it.

but we know from the Bible that from the time of his arrest to the time of his death roughly only 16 hours had past(most likely it is only 14 hours). his actually cruxifiction to his death was only 6 hours. and from his trial to his cruxifiction was 6 hours.

if you know anyhting about cock crows. there is a period of time at night they do not crow. 3 crows has nothing hidden in it was a sign to Peter he may not have recognized it as a fullfillement of Jesus words if it had only been just one crow and it was possibly during that time when no cocks crow. once in a while a rough cock may crow once during that time but the other cocks wont follow as they do at other times of crowing. so to have one crow three times during that period would have stood out.

Nothing you have shared is new it is already taught clearly in Gods Word.

you are looking for a kingdom mystery that has already been revealed clearly in scriptures.

as far as God creations the heavens and earth will not be restored as it was. it wil be destroyed by fire and recreated in purity. it is not saved as it is. just as your earthly body will be recreated totally into the image of Christ not totally saved as it is.

I think you would be better off on another site. you keep doing what the site is not set up for. you are sowing seeds of doubt in the purity of Gods words by saying numberology is necessary to gain instight to mysteries and deeper knowledge of God.

God has clearly given us all that he would want us to know about him. all else will be revealed when we are in our pure state. not through numbers,.

and lastly, none of us fear numbers. however we do fear those beings that oppose God and who use numerology to ensnare saved and lost alike. the Devil is deceiving you when you are in disobedience to Gods word. and you are in disobedience as we can tell by your own words above

Diligent 06-22-2008 10:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chette777 (Post 5872)
you are looking for a kingdom mystery that has already been revealed clearly in scriptures.

Bingo.

Mysticism and Universalism are Satanic, pure and simple. I appreciate the time everyone has taken to answer AJ's posts -- they stand as a clear record against these falsehoods. But at some point it has to stop, and it will now.


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