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Jassy 06-02-2009 04:44 PM

Love & Race
 
I have a question regarding 2 different races marrying.

I know a married couple where one is black and one is white - and they love each other and, most of all, they love God. The Lord is FIRST in their marriage.

Another Christian friend of mine says that is totally UNbiblical - that God DIVIDED the races and never wanted intermarriage.

In these days of the internet, with people meeting online, it's much more likely that this may happen. Is it wrong?

Can anyone address this topic and tell me what the truth is?

Jassy

Diligent 06-02-2009 04:51 PM

http://av1611.com/forums/showthread.php?t=349

Jassy 06-02-2009 05:20 PM

Thanks brother Brandon,

I didn't think of looking for it under the topic of "intermarriage" - DUH to me! LOL That thread was very helpful and answers my question.

Jassy

greenbear 06-02-2009 05:21 PM

Hi, Jassy.

Race is not the correct term. The human race is made up of 70 nations which are descendants of Noah's sons (Gen 10). All nations are a part of the human race. I think the concept of humanity being comprised of different races comes from Helene Blavatsky (Theosophical Society)/ Darwin (Theory of Evolution). I believe this idea has it's roots in occultism.

Gal 3:28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.

Nationality isn't an issue, at least in the church age. :)

H. Blavatsky, The Secret Doctrine, the Synthesis of Science, Religion and Philosophy,

In the second volume of The Secret Doctrine, dedicated to anthroprogenesis, Blavatsky presents a theory of the gradual evolution of physical humanity over a timespan of millions of years.

The steps in this evolution are called rootraces, seven in all. Current humanity mainly consists of the fifth such rootrace. Earlier rootraces exhibited completely different characteristics: physical bodies first appearing in the second rootrace and sexual characteristics in the third.

The designation aryans appears as a subgroup of the fifth rootrace, which comprises the vast majority of present humanity[citation needed].

"Some detractors have emphasized passages and footnotes that claim some peoples to be less fully human or spiritual than the "Aryans"."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Secret_Doctrine

Jassy 06-02-2009 10:32 PM

Thanks sister Jen (greenbear):

I appreciate the correction. I didn't mean to use the wrong terminology - just wasn't sure what the correct terminology was. I'm glad to be corrected and I will think of it biblically now.

God has no barriers in regards to appearances. I've always loved 1 Samuel 16:7 because it shows how the LORD looks at people:
"But the LORD said unto Samuel, Look not on his countenance, or on the height of his stature; because I have refused him: for the LORD seeth not as man seeth; for man looketh on the outward appearance, but the LORD looketh on the heart."
I know that the LORD doesn't look down on people with disabilities either. One interesting sidebar... the government has now added "sexual orientation" to their list of things that people can't be discriminated against for. However, the Bible is clear that that abomination doesn't belong with those others.

Jassy

tonybones2112 06-02-2009 11:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jassy (Post 21450)
Thanks sister Jen (greenbear):

I appreciate the correction. I didn't mean to use the wrong terminology - just wasn't sure what the correct terminology was. I'm glad to be corrected and I will think of it biblically now.

God has no barriers in regards to appearances. I've always loved 1 Samuel 16:7 because it shows how the LORD looks at people:
"But the LORD said unto Samuel, Look not on his countenance, or on the height of his stature; because I have refused him: for the LORD seeth not as man seeth; for man looketh on the outward appearance, but the LORD looketh on the heart."
I know that the LORD doesn't look down on people with disabilities either. One interesting sidebar... the government has now added "sexual orientation" to their list of things that people can't be discriminated against for. However, the Bible is clear that that abomination doesn't belong with those others.

Jassy

The most bitter racists in all history were the OT Jews. Arise Peter, kill and eat. Hey Lord, I will touch NO unclean thing. The Jews, to themselves, were clean, the whole world to them was unclean. A Gentile woman came to Christ, Lord of all, and begged for her daughter to be released from the torment of the demon. Jesus said it is not meet to give the children's(Jews) bread to dogs. Those are Jesus Christ's words, not Adolf Hitler's or Farrikan's.

"But now" there is no difference in Jew and Gentile, all are equally damned in unbelief and equally saved in Christ. Hatred of blacks is found in some commentator's wresting of Genesis 9 to their own destruction. In Time Past Jesus Christ gave instruction to the 12 to go ye not unto the ways of the Gentiles. Through Paul Jesus Christ now says there is no difference. The "three races of man" are not Negro, Caucasian, and Oriental, but:

1Co 10:32 Give none offence, neither to the Jews, nor to the Gentiles, nor to the church of God:

Grace and peace friends

Tony

kns215 06-03-2009 10:32 AM

When I was backslidden (no Bible reading, no prayer, etc), I had a "Christian" (backslidden one) boyfriend who is from outside of my nation. My parents disagreed, of course, and so did my siblings. I did admit that it was sin to disobey my parents but did not admit how it is scripturally wrong to marry someone outside of my nation. I, too, thought that it was OK to marry someone outside of my nation as we are not Israelites. And after couple years of on-going argument between my family and me, my older sister sent me what she called "final warning" (praise God for allowing her wisdom and courage to tell me the truth!) to this issue.

Here is what she wrote to me (it was about 4 pages long but "personal" information has been taken out ;)):

Quote:

Scripturally:

- God created all races and nations (Is 42:5; 44:24; 45:11,12).
- God divided them and segregated them on purpose (Acts 17:26; Deut 32:8) - God set boundaries and separated nations so that man can find God and get saved. Races/nations are not the same in their genes and chromosomes, only in their blood (Acts 17:26).
- God’s way has always been that of separation/segregation and not integration which is man’s way and the way of the world today.

- The following are some Bible examples of segregation:
  • Distinction from old garment and new garment (Mark 2) – you don’t put a new piece of cloth on an old garment
  • Distinction between the seeds planted (tares separated from the good seed in Mtt 13)

Although there is no difference/regard to race in the body of Christ (we are all saved) – the reference is that of a spiritual application. But marriage is physical.

In Genesis 26: 34,35 And Esau was forty years old when he took to wife Judith the daughter of Beeri the Hittite, and Bashemath the daughter of Elon the Hittite: Which were a grief of mind unto Isaac and to Rebekah.

Gen 28:6 When Esau saw that Isaac had blessed Jacob, and sent him away to Padanaram, to take him a wife from thence; and that as he blessed him he gave him a charge, saying, Thou shalt not take a wife of the daughers of Canaan;
7 And that Jacob obeyed his father and his mother, and was gone to Padanaram;
8 And Esau seeing that the daughters of Canaan pleased not Isaac his father;

Ephesians 6:1 Children, obey your parents in the Lord: for this is right.
2 Honour thy father and mother; which is the first commandment with promise;


Practically:

- Interracial marriages are also not practically good.

- The following are some of the many problems/struggles to be cautious of as two different cultures will be joined in marriage and it should make one pause to make sure of what is being done, especially if one is not married yet:
  • Different cultural background (including language, customs, etc...)
  • Usually, the woman will have to follow the man/please the man with regard to his cultural background and there’ll have to be some compromises
  • (God told women(wives) to obey their husband, not husband obeying wife. God did not make women to rule the house but men.)
  • The prejudices the children will have to face
  • Even people who come from very similar backgrounds will have many difficulties. Paul said that those who marry "shall have trouble in the flesh" (1 Cor. 7:28). But the greater the beginning differences, the greater the struggles to work as one

- That is why for example, we have a Korean Bible Baptist Church because the ways, language, customs of Korean people are different than that of other saved cultural groups

- The majority of people who’ve known people in an intercultural marriage can attest to the problems and disillusionment of happiness
I, of course, don't believe that those already married couples have to divorce and find themselves a new spouse within their nations. However, if one is not married yet, I think one has to ask self if marrying someone outside of his/her nation is really God's will.

No matter how long one has been living in foreign country, the fact that God divided nations is true and therefore "cultural differences" cannot be ignored.
So, for me, I'd rather stay unmarried and wait for God to send someone for me according to His will, rather than marry someone outside my nation and deal with that "cultural differences", etc.

Cody1611 06-03-2009 11:15 AM

Acts 17:26 "And hath made of one blood all nations of men for to dwell on all the face of the earth, and hath determined the times before appointed, and the BOUNDS of their habitation;"

I believe that we should marry in our own race, but I don't look down on anyone that marries outside their race. I read a lot of verses in this thread talking about the Jew, Gentile, etc, but to me that is talking about Salvation, not marriage.

Numbers 12:1 "And Miriam and Aaron spake against Moses because of the Ethiopian woman whom he had married: for he had married an Ethiopian woman."

I don't believe Miriam was wrong because of the fact the woman was black, but she was wrong because she spoke against Moses.

I've been told that you can't prove the Ethiopian woman was black, but I think scripture interprets scripture...

Jeremiah 13:23 "Can the Ethiopian change his skin, or the leopard his spots? then may ye also do good, that are accustomed to do evil."

God seems to divide things in the Bible alot.

Leviticus 19:19 "Ye shall keep my statutes. Thou shalt not let thy cattle gender with a diverse kind: thou shalt not sow thy field with mingled seed: neither shall a garment mingled of linen and woollen come upon thee."


This is my view, so please don't get mad at me for it. I believe the most important part is that your partner is saved and follows the same doctrine as you. If someone is already married to a different race I don't believe they should get a divorce at all. I am not racist, nor am I in the KKK lol.

tonybones2112 06-03-2009 11:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kns215 (Post 21473)
When I was backslidden (no Bible reading, no prayer, etc), I had a "Christian" (backslidden one) boyfriend who is from outside of my nation. My parents disagreed, of course, and so did my siblings. I did admit that it was sin to disobey my parents but did not admit how it is scripturally wrong to marry someone outside of my nation. I, too, thought that it was OK to marry someone outside of my nation as we are not Israelites. And after couple years of on-going argument between my family and me, my older sister sent me what she called "final warning" (praise God for allowing her wisdom and courage to tell me the truth!) to this issue.

Here is what she wrote to me (it was about 4 pages long but "personal" information has been taken out ;)):



I, of course, don't believe that those already married couples have to divorce and find themselves a new spouse within their nations. However, if one is not married yet, I think one has to ask self if marrying someone outside of his/her nation is really God's will.

No matter how long one has been living in foreign country, the fact that God divided nations is true and therefore "cultural differences" cannot be ignored.
So, for me, I'd rather stay unmarried and wait for God to send someone for me according to His will, rather than marry someone outside my nation and deal with that "cultural differences", etc.

Sister, this is what every Ku Klux Klansman in America believes and practices.

Grace and peace

Tony

Brother Tim 06-03-2009 11:47 AM

A reminder:
Boaz married "outside his nation". He is held up as a type of Christ. He also had a very important decendent.

greenbear 06-03-2009 12:12 PM

Paul has no problem with it for the church so neither do I. Everything else is just personal preference which thankfully we are still allowed to exercise. Outside of the church they have bigger problems than whether to marry outside of their 'nationality". It's none of my business who marries who. :)

kns215 06-03-2009 12:52 PM

:jaw:
Well, being an Asian (Oriental, to be specific), I certainly can't belong to KKK! I might get "persecuted"!!!:eek:

Anyhow, I know a missionary couple (the husband is white and the wife is Filipino) who's in Philippine, serving the Lord greatly and bearing much fruit. And my church has been supporting the family for about 10 years. I personally don't have anything against any Christian couple who married outside of their nation as I, like Cody1611, believe that the most important thing in marriage is FAITH.

And I know Ruth is a woman with great faith, and I do believe that it was God's will to have Boaz to marry Ruth. (And have Jesus Christ born from his seed.) However, it doesn't seem that the sons of Naomi married women of Moab (Orpah and Ruth) according to God's will. Also, it was Ruth's decision to cleave unto Noami and followed her to the land of Judah. "..thy people shall be my people, and thy God my God" (Ruth 16:16) So once one is completely dedicated to God and leave everything behind, then sure, perhaps God will use him/her to do God's work.

I also don't believe those who married outside of their race have to get out of church or anything, but we do have to look carefully if it is really God's will to have them marry especially times like today. Because today, in a lot of cases, "race mixing" became "norm" and something to be proud of. For instance, here in Toronto (Canada), "Torontonians" are supposed to be "proud" of Toronto's "diversity" and "multiculturalism".

So... I wouldn't necessarily call interracial marriage "Biblical".
"For God is not the author of confusion, but of peace, as in all churches of the saints." (1 Corinthians 14:33)

Diligent 06-03-2009 01:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kns215 (Post 21486)
So... I wouldn't necessarily call interracial marriage "Biblical".

That's the wrong question. The question is, is it unbiblical? Since our apostle is Paul, and Paul specifically said there is no difference between the Jew and the Gentile for us now, what basis is there to discourage people from marring people with different levels of melanin in their skin? A bunch of lines of reasoning directly contradicted by Scripture (Boaz, Moses, etc)?

It is an untenable position to hold! There were no "white Americans" in Acts 17:26 -- what does it have to do with who someone marries? -- since there was no "american nation" to speak of, where do we go to marry? What do you suggest someone who is the son of "mixed races" go for a spouse?

This is all confusion -- races are not nations. Applying the rules of separation for the nation of Israel under the law to someone today based on what color their skin is is confusion in the highest order.

greenbear 06-03-2009 01:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Diligent (Post 21487)
That's the wrong question. The question is, is it unbiblical? Since our apostle is Paul, and Paul specifically said there is no difference between the Jew and the Gentile for us now, what basis is there to discourage people from marring people with different levels of melanin in their skin? A bunch of lines of reasoning directly contradicted by Scripture (Boaz, Moses, etc)?

It is an untenable position to hold! There were no "white Americans" in Acts 17:26 -- what does it have to do with who someone marries? -- since there was no "american nation" to speak of, where do we go to marry? What do you suggest someone who is the son of "mixed races" go for a spouse?

This is all confusion -- races are not nations. Applying the rules of separation for the nation of Israel under the law to someone today based on what color their skin is is confusion in the highest order.

Brother Brandon,

When you say "races are not nations" are you saying that you see different "races" as opposed to different "nations" within humanity? Or are you saying that "nations are not races", meaning the concept of different races within humanity is wrong?

Sister Jennifer

tonybones2112 06-03-2009 01:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Diligent (Post 21487)
That's the wrong question. The question is, is it unbiblical? Since our apostle is Paul, and Paul specifically said there is no difference between the Jew and the Gentile for us now, what basis is there to discourage people from marring people with different levels of melanin in their skin? A bunch of lines of reasoning directly contradicted by Scripture (Boaz, Moses, etc)?

It is an untenable position to hold! There were no "white Americans" in Acts 17:26 -- what does it have to do with who someone marries? -- since there was no "american nation" to speak of, where do we go to marry? What do you suggest someone who is the son of "mixed races" go for a spouse?

This is all confusion -- races are not nations. Applying the rules of separation for the nation of Israel under the law to someone today based on what color their skin is is confusion in the highest order.

Brother Brandon, my father's family were Highland Scot descended from Charles and Mary Stuart, and on into the Bourbon kings of France, who were Gauls. The Gauls were ultimately traced as having their foundation in the Scythians. I'm a blood-mad pillaging barbarian on Dad's side.

My mother's family were Irish, my maternal grandfather was 1/4 Cherokee Indian, my maternal grandmother was 1/4 Shawnee Indian. Geneologically therefore, I am a mess.

Question(I hope you see the sarcasm): Who am I qualified to marry, and what are the "bounds" of my habitation?

1Sa 16:7 But the LORD said unto Samuel, Look not on his countenance, or on the height of his stature; because I have refused him: for the LORD seeth not as man seeth; for man looketh on the outward appearance, but the LORD looketh on the heart.
Joh 7:24 Judge not according to the appearance, but judge righteous judgment.
2Co 10:7 Do ye look on things after the outward appearance? If any man trust to himself that he is Christís, let him of himself think this again, that, as he is Christís, even so are we Christís.

Brother, I thank we 'ur jist 'bout ready tah refight the Civil War agin h'yar in the forum.

Grace and peace

Boneswall Jackson

Diligent 06-03-2009 01:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by greenbear (Post 21490)
Brother Brandon,

When you say "races are not nations" are you saying that you see different "races" as opposed to different "nations" within humanity? Or are you saying that "nations are not races", meaning the concept of different races within humanity is wrong?

Sister Jennifer

"Race" is an evolutionary/Darwinian concept that I reject. In order to communicate with other people I will still use the term "race" as it is commonly used, but when it comes down to practical matters, I throw it out along with psychobabble and other false sciences.

The reason I do this is because the Bible speaks of nations, not races. And even within the Jewish people there is a gamut of skin colors from light to dark.

The problem here, expressed by some posters on this forum and taught by people like Ruckman, is that they are confusing the false-science concept of "race" with nations. They point to verses that say nothing of the color of someone's skin, and use that as the proof for saying someone with darker skin than me shouldn't be my spouse -- even though we are both Americans and of the same nation! But they do not try to argue that a Britain white shouldn't marry an American white, even though the verses they point to are all about boundaries and nations, not color of skin.

My poistion is simply that Paul never said we have to concern ourselves with such matters. The only people in the Bible who did were Israelites under the Law. And to take it one step further, Paul said we are all one in Christ.

The idea that we should ignore Galations 3:8 when it comes to qualifying a spouse is abhorrent to me.

Having said all of that, I will also say that there are real "issues" with culture that need to be seriously considered when people marry. Cultural differences can certainly be a big strain on a marriage, but it is foolish to assume that all Blacks, or all Whites, or all Filipinos are in monocultures. But there is nothing forbidding an American male marrying a woman from a different culture -- in fact, given American culture I would highly recommend it!

tonybones2112 06-03-2009 01:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kns215 (Post 21486)
:jaw:
Well, being an Asian (Oriental, to be specific), I certainly can't belong to KKK! I might get "persecuted"!!!:eek:

Anyhow, I know a missionary couple (the husband is white and the wife is Filipino) who's in Philippine, serving the Lord greatly and bearing much fruit. And my church has been supporting the family for about 10 years. I personally don't have anything against any Christian couple who married outside of their nation as I, like Cody1611, believe that the most important thing in marriage is FAITH.

And I know Ruth is a woman with great faith, and I do believe that it was God's will to have Boaz to marry Ruth. (And have Jesus Christ born from his seed.) However, it doesn't seem that the sons of Naomi married women of Moab (Orpah and Ruth) according to God's will. Also, it was Ruth's decision to cleave unto Noami and followed her to the land of Judah. "..thy people shall be my people, and thy God my God" (Ruth 16:16) So once one is completely dedicated to God and leave everything behind, then sure, perhaps God will use him/her to do God's work.

I also don't believe those who married outside of their race have to get out of church or anything, but we do have to look carefully if it is really God's will to have them marry especially times like today. Because today, in a lot of cases, "race mixing" became "norm" and something to be proud of. For instance, here in Toronto (Canada), "Torontonians" are supposed to be "proud" of Toronto's "diversity" and "multiculturalism".

So... I wouldn't necessarily call interracial marriage "Biblical".
"For God is not the author of confusion, but of peace, as in all churches of the saints." (1 Corinthians 14:33)

Sister, you can't be "not unnecessarily" pregnant, you either are or you aren't. Marriage freely between races is either "Biblical" or it isn't. Well, since I can't find one single word of Scripture indicating it's "wrong", I'll marry who I want to, associate with who I want to and most important, preach to who I want to.

I don't understand your out-of-context use of a Scripture passage from I Corinthians that deals with the misuse of the Jewish signs of an apostle and having nothing to do with "marriage" and associations between different "races". The Scriptures give you the three "races": Jew, Gentile, church of God. The Scriptures give marriage or sexual relations with blood family as being "confusion", I can't find any at all that marriage "outside yo race" is confusion. I can tell you this: In the flesh and after the flesh, Negroes, Orientals, and Caucasians are all equally as racist one towards another.

Song Of Sol. 1:5 I am black, but comely, O ye daughters of Jerusalem, as the tents of Kedar, as the curtains of Solomon.
Song Of Sol. 1:6 Look not upon me, because I am black, because the sun hath looked upon me: my motherís children were angry with me; they made me the keeper of the vineyards; but mine own vineyard have I not kept.

Ah sho 'nuff don' know how these varses comed out lahk they diyad, they must be a MISTRANSLATION!

Grace and peace sister:jaw:

Boneswall Jackson

Jassy 06-03-2009 02:00 PM

According to my recently deceased father, he told me that I am 3/4 German, 1/8 Danish and 1/8 English. This is because, according to my Dad: my mother is fully German, and my father is half German, 1/4 Danish and 1/4 English. I'm not sure where he got those statistics from - but that is what I was told.

So, if one goes by Old Testament boundaries, nationally - I am almost fully German. Perhaps some who are considering national boundaries think that I ought to move to Germany and find a Christian to marry there? But with the Danish and English in the mix - I'm no longer of a pure nationality. Hmmm quite a colundrum! :confused:

I agree with the posting about following Paul's teachings - since he received them from the resurrected Lord and he was taught that the Church was now to be in GRACE and no longer in LAW. If we go by Old Testament LAW, as doctrine, that is wrong. Paul's doctrine is basically that we don't look at such things anymore. The most important is that the 2 wishing to marry are FIRST grounded in Paul's Church-age doctrine. :)

I do agree that it's not a good idea for young people to marry against their family's wishes for them - especially if they are also believers. And, indeed, there are cultural differences to consider in such a marriage. However, if they are grounded as believers FIRST - the husband is the leader and the wife knows that her husband is under the LORD, and she has nothing to fear from his leadership. Besides, Paul commanded the husband to LOVE his wife - please notice that NOWHERE has Paul commanded the wife to LOVE her husband. I find that very interesting. I think that softens his hardness, and will cause him to act towards his wife in LOVE, considering her first.

Anyway, there was another thread about that - so I'm not going to get mixed up in that, as I know there are sticky issues that people believe very strongly about. But I agree with the people that posted that we, as BELIEVERS, now follow the doctrine of GRACE that Paul taught.

Jassy

kns215 06-03-2009 02:12 PM

So, now I am confused.
Is it just personal "preference"? Or is it settled with a final answer that it is RIGHT to marry outside your nation.

And since Caucasians are already mixed (i.e. Irish with German, etc), and so are Asians and Negroes (within their "colour of skin"), there shouldn't be any line drawn between those three "races" either?

But what about all those "differences" between each cultures?

So basically, no matter what nation, race, or culture you are from, just follow the Bible.. and there you go, no problem will occur whatsoever?

I could be very "misinformed" in this issue, and I am definitely open for the final answer based on the Scripture.


Added:
Oh, and would this issue be a doctrinal issue?

Another addition:
So, say if parents don't want their kids to marry anyone outside of their nation, race, or culture, are they, therefore, being unreasonable and unbiblical? (Say the reason is because communication issues, not faith issue)

Thank you for taking time to respond!

biblereader 06-03-2009 02:17 PM

There's a couple of specific verses in the Bible, that deal with who not to marry.
Never marry a saved person to an unsaved person, but, if one gets saved after the marriage, then we're supposed to stay married to the same person, even if they remain lost.
(look for unequally yoked)
Different ethnicities, different customs,none have any bearing on getting married.
The only thing is for a believer to marry another believer. That's it, as far as I know.
Also, in the Old Testament, God was angered when the Hebrews married OUTSIDE of their religion.
Christians marry Christians, no matter how cute the other one looks and acts, to marry on purpose, a lost person, a non_Christian, is sin.

Diligent 06-03-2009 02:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kns215 (Post 21510)
So basically, no matter what nation, race, or culture you are from, just follow the Bible.. and there you go, no problem will occur whatsoever?

:confused:

Quote:

I could be very "misinformed" in this issue, and I am definitely open for the final answer based on the Scripture.
Galatians 3:28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.
Colossians 3:11 Where there is neither Greek nor Jew, circumcision nor uncircumcision, Barbarian, Scythian, bond nor free: but Christ is all, and in all.
The point being that "nationality" or "race" is not a factor at all in Christ. Why make it a factor in marriage?

There are all sorts of things that make people good matches for each other; things about a man that will make him a good husband and things about a woman that will make her a good wife. But bringing race or nationality into it and saying it's either "wrong or right" because of an outward thing like that is the wrong thing to do.

Cody1611 06-03-2009 02:27 PM

Galatians 3:28 "There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus."

The context here is not about marriage at all. It is talking about us being one in Christ, no matter if we're Jew, Greek, man, woman, etc.

kns215 06-03-2009 02:33 PM

I am sorry for not being clear, bro Brendon.
I meant that "Is it guaranteed that those major/minor problems that are usually caused by differences in race, nation, or culture will not occur, as long as the house has the Bible as final authority?"

But I got the answer and thank you for explaining it further.

Edit: Sorry for another question. Would this issue be doctrinal issue or just general issue in Christian "lifestyle"?

Diligent 06-03-2009 02:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cody1611 (Post 21515)
Galatians 3:28 "There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus."

The context here is not about marriage at all. It is talking about us being one in Christ, no matter if we're Jew, Greek, man, woman, etc.

And the point is, that the Old Testament Laws about the Jews not going outside of their nation to marry are irrelevant to we in Christ. You can make a good case that a Christian should not marry a non-Christian (though you would be hard pressed to prove it is forbidden). What you can not do is take commandments to the Jews about staying in their own nation twist them to say that an American man with white skin can not marry an American woman with brown skin.

Where do you find Paul say anything about making skin color an issue of marriage? He never does. Ruckman is a poor substitute for Paul on this topic. Long-held bigotries do not a sound doctrine make. The Bible does not even mention "race mixing" once that I can think of, and here you are, telling people they have to pass up a spouse just because they look different. Why is it so important to you or anyone else what color someone's spouse is? You don't get it from Scripture.

tonybones2112 06-03-2009 02:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cody1611 (Post 21515)
Galatians 3:28 "There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus."

The context here is not about marriage at all. It is talking about us being one in Christ, no matter if we're Jew, Greek, man, woman, etc.

Cody, where is the Scripture that says skin color, a fold of skin over the eyelid, facial features, nationality, is a marker for judging who you can marry, associate with, let in your church, etc.?

Grace and peace

Tony

Diligent 06-03-2009 02:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kns215 (Post 21518)
I am sorry for not being clear, bro Brendon.
I meant that "Is it guaranteed that those major/minor problems that are usually caused by differences in race, nation, or culture will not occur, as long as the house has the Bible as final authority?"

What problems are those? I have a hunch that the problems you are thinking of are cultural, not "racial."

I can not think of anything that makes a black man incompatible with a white woman in a marriage before God. They can be one flesh. They can submit themselves to Christ. The woman can submit herself to her husband, and the husband can love his wife. What's their skin color got to do with it?

Even cultural issues are not "deal breakers." As I implied before, I think a Christian American man will have an easier time finding a wife willing to submit herself to him in a different culture. American culture teaches the lie that men and woman are no different in their roles. Despite other problems in other cultures, there are still cultures left where the difference between a man and a woman is understood and respected. This, to me, would be a far bigger issue than how dark her skin is.

Quote:

Edit: Sorry for another question. Would this issue be doctrinal issue or just general issue in Christian "lifestyle"?
There is no "doctrine" of "race mixing" in the Bible. People who want to make color a disqualification in marriage are inventing a doctrine that doesn't exist.

Cody1611 06-03-2009 02:46 PM

Acts 17:26 "And hath made of one blood all nations of men for to dwell on all the face of the earth, and hath determined the times before appointed, and the bounds of their habitation;"

This scripture right here is in the NT. I just think God made different races for a reason and I don't think we should mix races. I'm not dogmatic about this and I don't believe this because Dr. Ruckman teaches it. Once again, if you married someone outside your race. I don't look down on you at all, nor do I think God is against you. This is just my view on the subject.

George 06-03-2009 02:57 PM

Re: "Love & Race"
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Jassy (Post 21435)
I have a question regarding 2 different races marrying.

I know a married couple where one is black and one is white - and they love each other and, most of all, they love God. The Lord is FIRST in their marriage.

Another Christian friend of mine says that is totally UNbiblical - that God DIVIDED the races and never wanted intermarriage.

In these days of the internet, with people meeting online, it's much more likely that this may happen. Is it wrong?

Can anyone address this topic and tell me what the truth is?

Jassy


Aloha sister Jassy,

Most of the "ideas" of not marrying people of another "color", "race", or "culture" come from either mixing up God's requirements for the Israelites - not to marry the Pagan idol-worshiping women of the land of Canaan {requirements meant for the Nation of Israel, i.e. Jews/Hebrews - NOT Christians, who are all brothers and sisters in Christ, regardless of their race, culture, or color of their skin.}, or some "Christian" pastors and teachers teaching discrimination against certain people because of their own (pastors/teachers) "cultural" upbringing.

This is just one more issue meant to DIVIDE Christian brethren from each other. Please check out this Thread on "Interracial marriage" on the A.V. 1611 Bible Forums in addition to the "Thread" that Brandon listed:

http://av1611.com/forums/showthread....1530#post11530

There was an acrimonious exchange on this Thread between myself and a young woman (who was a new believer) who had accepted the teachings of brother Peter Ruckman on this issue and who then took those teachings to the extreme (as many of brother Ruckman's followers sometimes do).

Lets examine the issue:

Although Jacob married his "kin" - his choice for a wife (RACHEL) was an idol-worshipper ("purity" of color, race, & culture didn't seem to matter) and please NOTICE: God chose the Priest's (Levi) and the King's (Judah) from the offspring of Jacob & LEAH (Jacob's SECOND WIFE - and NOT the wife of his choosing!).

That's the Bible record, do you think that we Christian men should have "two wives" at once (just in case things don't work out with the first? :rolleyes:). Do you see how someone can twist and wrest the Scriptures to their own destruction?

Joseph married Asenath outside of his "race" & "culture" (with no condemnation from God).

Moses married Zipporah outside of his "race" & "culture" (with no condemnation from God).

Salmon (Boaz's father) married Rachab (an harlot!) outside of his "race" & "culture" (with no condemnation from God).

Boaz married Ruth outside of his "race" & "culture" - (a Moabitess, who had a Book in the Bible named after her - One of only two Books in the Bible named after a woman - imagine that!).

David married Bathsheba (within his "race" & "culture") - for whom he committed adultery and murder (and yet God still gave the kingdom to Solomon - their offspring).

The Prophet Hosea was commanded by the Lord to marry an adulteress (an harlot) - would that mean that Christian men should do the same? You see the trouble people get in when they don't "discern" between the "Jew", the "Gentile", and the "church"?

THE CHURCH OF GOD:

Galatians 3:26 For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.
27 For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.
29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.


Colossians 3:1 If ye then be risen with Christ, seek those things which are above, where Christ sitteth on the right hand of God.
2 Set your affection on things above, not on things on the earth.
3 For ye are dead, and your life is hid with Christ in God.
4 When Christ, who is our life, shall appear, then shall ye also appear with him in glory.
5 Mortify therefore your members which are upon the earth; fornication, uncleanness, inordinate affection, evil concupiscence, and covetousness, which is idolatry:
6 For which things' sake the wrath of God cometh on the children of disobedience:
7 In the which ye also walked some time, when ye lived in them.
8 But now ye also put off all these; anger, wrath, malice, blasphemy, filthy communication out of your mouth.
9 Lie not one to another, seeing that ye have put off the old man with his deeds;
10 And have put on the new man, which is renewed in knowledge after the image of him that created him:
11 Where there is neither Greek nor Jew, circumcision nor uncircumcision, Barbarian, Scythian, bond nor free: but Christ is all, and in all.


Do you think that God cares that much about the color of a person's skin, or their "race" (whatever that is), or their "culture", as much as He cares about their heart, and their soul? I trow not! :confused:

This "teaching" about "races" and "cultures" is NOT sound Biblical doctrine for this age that we live in. It was sound doctrine for the Jews/Hebrews/Israelites when they came into the land of Canaan after they conquered it.

Please read my Posts in the Thread I gave you the link to.

"Mixed" - cultural and "race" marriages are not EASY, there are a lot of "problems" and "pitfalls", some that are common to all marriages, and some that are specific to a "mixed" marriage. But all of those problems and pitfalls stem from cultural and racial prejudices and biases - NOT from God's "disapproval" of of the joining together of two "different" people from two "different" cultural and "racial" backgrounds.

I speak on this subject with some authority, since I have been married to a Filipina woman (of another "race"; another "color"; and another culture, and in addition who was 17 years of age when we married, and was a Catholic to boot!) for over 48 years now, and God has blessed our union with seven children; 17 grandchildren; and three great-grandchildren.

If it's "TRUE LOVE" based in God's word it will "work out" [Romans 8:28]. If it's not - all of the "SAFEGUARD'S" (the correct "color", "race", and "culture") in the world won't matter!

Diligent 06-03-2009 03:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cody1611 (Post 21522)
Acts 17:26 "And hath made of one blood all nations of men for to dwell on all the face of the earth, and hath determined the times before appointed, and the bounds of their habitation;"

This scripture right here is in the NT. I just think God made different races for a reason and I don't think we should mix races. I'm not dogmatic about this and I don't believe this because Dr. Ruckman teaches it. Once again, if you married someone outside your race. I don't look down on you at all, nor do I think God is against you. This is just my view on the subject.

If you are going to take this verse and apply it the way you are, do you support sending White Americans into Black African countries to be missionaries? Aren't they breaking the "bounds of their habitation?"

And what do you tell someone who is "mixed?" Where is their "habitation?"

And what does this have to do with race? You say race. The verse you quote didn't say race. You say it's in the NT. But it's not there. The word "race" in the Bible is always about running. Where do you get your concept of race? Do you get it from the Bible or did you get it from Darwin?

When you look at this verse and say it disqualifies someone for marriage, why do you look at skin color instead of a geopolitical map? Can a German marry a Britain? Can native South African marry someone born in Zimbabwe? My guess is you're thinking about the color of their skin and not the boundaries of their nations. And yet you run to this verse to prove that people who look different shouldn't get married.

This verse doesn't even teach that it is wrong for someone to migrate, and here you are, saying it teaches it is wrong to go "outside of your race" for a spouse. You're pointing to a verse that doesn't say diddly about race, and not only that, it doesn't even have a commandment in all its syllables, but somehow, you find a commandment about marriage in it! And when Paul himself says that these nations mean nothing in Christ, you shrug it off and go to Darwin for a better definition of humankind than the one the Bible gives us.

Rant over.

Bro. Parrish 06-03-2009 03:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Diligent (Post 21525)
?"
And what do you tell someone who is "mixed?" Where is their "habitation?"

Now that's a good question.
I think they are still trying to figure out where Obama came from. :)

Brother Tim 06-03-2009 03:16 PM

Yeah, and how about Floridians associating with Georgians! Yuck! Go Gators!

kns215 06-03-2009 03:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by George (Post 21524)
Aloha sister Jassy,

Most of the "ideas" of not marrying people of another "color", "race", or "culture" come from either mixing up God's requirements for the Israelites - not to marry the Pagan idol-worshiping women of the land of Canaan {requirements meant for the Nation of Israel, i.e. Jews/Hebrews - NOT Christians, who are all brothers and sisters in Christ, regardless of their race, culture, or color of their skin.}, or some "Christian" pastors and teachers teaching discrimination against certain people because of their own (pastors/teachers) "cultural" upbringing.

This is just one more issue meant to DIVIDE Christian brethren from each other. Please check out this Thread on "Interracial marriage" on the A.V. 1611 Bible Forums in addition to the "Thread" that Brandon listed:

http://av1611.com/forums/showthread....1530#post11530

There was an acrimonious exchange on this Thread between myself and a young woman (who was a new believer) who had accepted the teachings of brother Peter Ruckman on this issue and who then took those teachings to the extreme (as many of brother Ruckman's followers sometimes do).

Lets examine the issue:

Although Jacob married his "kin" - his choice for a wife (RACHEL) was an idol-worshipper ("purity" of color, race, & culture didn't seem to matter) and please NOTICE: God chose the Priest's (Levi) and the King's (Judah) from the offspring of Jacob & LEAH (Jacob's SECOND WIFE - and NOT the wife of his choosing!).

That's the Bible record, do you think that we Christian men should have "two wives" at once (just in case things don't work out with the first? :rolleyes:). Do you see how someone can twist and wrest the Scriptures to their own destruction?

Joseph married Asenath outside of his "race" & "culture" (with no condemnation from God).

Moses married Zipporah outside of his "race" & "culture" (with no condemnation from God).

Salmon (Boaz's father) married Rachab (an harlot!) outside of his "race" & "culture" (with no condemnation from God).

Boaz married Ruth outside of his "race" & "culture" - (a Moabitess, who had a Book in the Bible named after her - One of only two Books in the Bible named after a woman - imagine that!).

David married Bathsheba (within his "race" & "culture") - for whom he committed adultery and murder (and yet God still gave the kingdom to Solomon - their offspring).

The Prophet Hosea was commanded by the Lord to marry an adulteress (an harlot) - would that mean that Christian men should do the same? You see the trouble people get in when they don't "discern" between the "Jew", the "Gentile", and the "church"?

THE CHURCH OF GOD:

Galatians 3:26 For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.
27 For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.
29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.


Colossians 3:1 If ye then be risen with Christ, seek those things which are above, where Christ sitteth on the right hand of God.
2 Set your affection on things above, not on things on the earth.
3 For ye are dead, and your life is hid with Christ in God.
4 When Christ, who is our life, shall appear, then shall ye also appear with him in glory.
5 Mortify therefore your members which are upon the earth; fornication, uncleanness, inordinate affection, evil concupiscence, and covetousness, which is idolatry:
6 For which things' sake the wrath of God cometh on the children of disobedience:
7 In the which ye also walked some time, when ye lived in them.
8 But now ye also put off all these; anger, wrath, malice, blasphemy, filthy communication out of your mouth.
9 Lie not one to another, seeing that ye have put off the old man with his deeds;
10 And have put on the new man, which is renewed in knowledge after the image of him that created him:
11 Where there is neither Greek nor Jew, circumcision nor uncircumcision, Barbarian, Scythian, bond nor free: but Christ is all, and in all.


Do you think that God cares that much about the color of a person's skin, or their "race" (whatever that is), or their "culture", as much as He cares about their heart, and their soul? I trow not! :confused:

This "teaching" about "races" and "cultures" is NOT sound Biblical doctrine for this age that we live in. It was sound doctrine for the Jews/Hebrews/Israelites when they came into the land of Canaan after they conquered it.

Please read my Posts in the Thread I gave you the link to.

"Mixed" - cultural and "race" marriages are not EASY, there are a lot of "problems" and "pitfalls", some that are common to all marriages, and some that are specific to a "mixed" marriage. But all of those problems and pitfalls stem from cultural and racial prejudices and biases - NOT from God's "disapproval" of of the joining together of two "different" people from two "different" cultural and "racial" backgrounds.

I speak on this subject with some authority, since I have been married to a Filipina woman (of another "race"; another "color"; and another culture, and in addition who was 17 years of age when we married, and was a Catholic to boot!) for over 48 years now, and God has blessed our union with seven children; 17 grandchildren; and three great-grandchildren.

If it's "TRUE LOVE" based in God's word it will "work out" [Romans 8:28]. If it's not - all of the "SAFEGUARD'S" (the correct "color", "race", and "culture") in the world won't matter!

Read the link of the other tread, and thank you, now I am clear!

I guess with English as my 2nd language, it'll not be easy to have a spouse who doesn't speak my language for me. And that perhaps is why I strongly disagreed to the idea of interracial marriage. (because I made a judgement based on my situation)

Anyhow, thank you everyone for taking time to answer.

Thank God for clearing up another question I have!

JaeByrd 06-03-2009 04:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kns215 (Post 21530)
I guess with English as my 2nd language, it'll not be easy to have a spouse who doesn't speak my language for me. And that perhaps is why I strongly disagreed to the idea of interracial marriage. (because I made a judgement based on my situation)

You underlined "for me". I know of several families where they speak the language of his birthplace, the language or her birth place, and American English all in the same house and each learned for the other. They have no more and no less problems than the folks who marry from the same HIGHSCHOOL! And that is about as Culturally the same as you can get growing up in the same town/area/lifestyle/financial bracket with shared formative years memories.

The majority of the marital issues I see stem not from race or cultural differences, but from stepping out of our roles as Biblically laid out: Husband as head of the house loving his wife/wife being in submission and reverencing her husband. And that happens in ANY marriage, not just the racially/culturally different ones.

greenbear 06-03-2009 04:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kns215 (Post 21510)
So, now I am confused.
Is it just personal "preference"? Or is it settled with a final answer that it is RIGHT to marry outside your nation.

And since Caucasians are already mixed (i.e. Irish with German, etc), and so are Asians and Negroes (within their "colour of skin"), there shouldn't be any line drawn between those three "races" either?

But what about all those "differences" between each cultures?

So basically, no matter what nation, race, or culture you are from, just follow the Bible.. and there you go, no problem will occur whatsoever?

I could be very "misinformed" in this issue, and I am definitely open for the final answer based on the Scripture.


Added:
Oh, and would this issue be a doctrinal issue?

Another addition:
So, say if parents don't want their kids to marry anyone outside of their nation, race, or culture, are they, therefore, being unreasonable and unbiblical? (Say the reason is because communication issues, not faith issue)

Thank you for taking time to respond!

.................................................. ....................
Here are my answers to your questions, kns215. It's how I see things, anyway.

kns215: Is it just personal "preference"? Or is it settled with a final answer that it is RIGHT to marry outside your nation.

It is personal preference because the scriptures, generally, and Paul, the Apostle to the Gentiles, specifically, do not address the issue. Therefore, if you, having a personal preference, which you have every right to, wish to use the scriptures to justify your personal opinion then you are wrong.

kns215: And since Caucasians are already mixed (i.e. Irish with German, etc), and so are Asians and Negroes (within their "colour of skin"), there shouldn't be any line drawn between those three "races" either?

I'm not sure I understand your question. Please forgive me if I misunderstand you: How many different races are you proposing to divide people up into? We might all have to become Mormons so we have the resources to research our family tree so we can have some hope of finding a genetically suitable mate. It becomes absurd when you think it through.

kns215: But what about all those "differences" between each cultures?

What about them? This is the personal preference/ personal choice thing we were discussing. Scripture has nothing to say about it. These are decisions that we can only make for ourselves and our children, perhaps, but certainly can't decide these matters for other people that we don't even know?

kns215: So basically, no matter what nation, race, or culture you are from, just follow the Bible.. and there you go, no problem will occur whatsoever?

The only scriptural consideration is if one is a christian Paul warns against becoming unequally yoked with an unbeliever. Race is not a consideration in any way, shape, or form. Of course, there are cultural and social considerations that each individual has to weigh for themselves.

kns215: I could be very "misinformed" in this issue, and I am definitely open for the final answer based on the Scripture.

No problem, kns215. We all have to have our minds renewed by God's Word. The lies of the world are not easy to get free from. I appreciate your honesty and willingness to search for the truth about this matter.

kns215: Oh, and would this issue be a doctrinal issue?

Interacial marriage is not a doctrinal issue.

kns215: So, say if parents don't want their kids to marry anyone outside of their nation, race, or culture, are they, therefore, being unreasonable and unbiblical? (Say the reason is because communication issues, not faith issue)

Whether such a position would be unreasonable is simply a matter of opinion. The position wouldn't be unbiblical unless the parents were trying to use scripture to back up their personal opinions in the sense that they were adding to the Word of God, trying to make the Bible say something it doesn't say.

I might add that Paul does say the saved out of all races are one in Christ Jesus during the gentile church age.

Gal 3:28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.

Paul also emphasizes that all nations are to receive blessing by faith through Abraham (the Jews). No one gentile nation is preferred over another.

Gal 3:8 And the scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the heathen through faith, preached before the gospel unto Abraham, saying, In thee shall all nations be blessed.

I hope this might help in some way.:)

Your sister,

Jennifer

Jassy 06-03-2009 06:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by biblereader (Post 21511)
There's a couple of specific verses in the Bible, that deal with who not to marry.
Never marry a saved person to an unsaved person, but, if one gets saved after the marriage, then we're supposed to stay married to the same person, even if they remain lost.
(look for unequally yoked)
Different ethnicities, different customs,none have any bearing on getting married.
The only thing is for a believer to marry another believer. That's it, as far as I know.
Also, in the Old Testament, God was angered when the Hebrews married OUTSIDE of their religion.
Christians marry Christians, no matter how cute the other one looks and acts, to marry on purpose, a lost person, a non_Christian, is sin.

Thank you for your post, sister. I agree that 2 Corinthians 6:14 tells believers NOT to be unequally yoked with UNbelievers. True!

Jassy 06-03-2009 06:45 PM

Very helpful, brother George, and I read all of the threads that brother Brandon had posted regarding this topic. Also very helpful!

custer 06-03-2009 09:23 PM

Maybe this is too simplistic, but...

How can "race" be a "Darwinian concept," when Noah Webster's 1828 dictionary defines race as
"1. The lineage of a family, or continued series of descendants from a parent who is called the stock. A race is the series of descendants indefinitely. Thus all mankind are called the race of Adam; the Israelites are the race of Abraham and Jacob." ???
According to www.aboutdarwin.com, a website "dedicated to the life and times of Charles Darwin," in 1828 when Webster had already formulated the above definition, Darwin was in school and "did not take his studies very seriously, spending much of his free time collecting beetles, reading Shakespeare, and having dinner parties with his friends." He didn't start publishing scientific diaries until 1836 and the Origin of the Species wasn't until 1859. I'm just saying that the idea of a "race" being a line of people couldn't have originated with him.
Interestingly, the Bible terminology is the "generations of [so-and-so,]" and one of Webster's definitions of a "generation" is a "race."
It seems like this discussion got off course by confusing race with nationality. It is only in a NEW dictionary that "race" has been expanded to include the word "nation." And still, when you are asked on an application to give your race, they're not asking where you're from!

Pam
www.custerfamilyfarm.com

biblereader 06-04-2009 05:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tonybones2112 (Post 21520)
Cody, where is the Scripture that says skin color, a fold of skin over the eyelid, facial features, nationality, is a marker for judging who you can marry, associate with, let in your church, etc.?

Grace and peace

Tony

Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers: for what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness? And what communion hath light with darkness?" (KJV)
Nothing there about skin color. U R right, Tony.

Diligent 06-04-2009 08:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by custer (Post 21563)
Maybe this is too simplistic, but...

How can "race" be a "Darwinian concept," when Noah Webster's 1828 dictionary defines race as
"1. The lineage of a family, or continued series of descendants from a parent who is called the stock. A race is the series of descendants indefinitely. Thus all mankind are called the race of Adam; the Israelites are the race of Abraham and Jacob." ???
According to www.aboutdarwin.com, a website "dedicated to the life and times of Charles Darwin," in 1828 when Webster had already formulated the above definition, Darwin was in school and "did not take his studies very seriously, spending much of his free time collecting beetles, reading Shakespeare, and having dinner parties with his friends." He didn't start publishing scientific diaries until 1836 and the Origin of the Species wasn't until 1859. I'm just saying that the idea of a "race" being a line of people couldn't have originated with him.
Interestingly, the Bible terminology is the "generations of [so-and-so,]" and one of Webster's definitions of a "generation" is a "race."
It seems like this discussion got off course by confusing race with nationality. It is only in a NEW dictionary that "race" has been expanded to include the word "nation." And still, when you are asked on an application to give your race, they're not asking where you're from!

The problem is, people do not generally use the word race to refer to things like the "race of Adam" as in that definition. And again, the word is not used in the Bible the way we are using it; not once. In fact I do believe we are all "the race of Adam." But that obviously doesn't settle the issue for folks who want to find something about "race mixing" in the Bible. Using the Webster definition you provide, we are all one race anyway.

The concept of race, as it is used commonly, is Darwinian. The idea certainly pre-dates Darwin. That is a side issue. Call it whatever you like; it's not a Biblical concept.

If we were using the word "race" to refer to the various "ites" of the Bible, it still wouldn't change the fact that the Bible shows all sorts of "ite mixing" without condemnation from God. Again, only Isreal under the Law was ever concerned with such things --- and even then it was about specific nations, like the cursed Canaan nation. While there are spiritual applications for we in Christ, there are no commandments for us to follow regarding "mixing" of skin colors.

Renee 06-04-2009 10:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jassy (Post 21556)
Thank you for your post, sister. I agree that 2 Corinthians 6:14 tells believers NOT to be unequally yoked with UNbelievers. True!

2 Corinthians deals with the ministery.

2 Corinthians 6:14 Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers: for what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness? and what communion hath light with darkness?

I see nothing in Chapter 7 of first Chorinthians (where it deals with men and women) that has any forbiding of someone marrying an unbeliever. There is no mention of nationality, culture, or color of skin. Our problem is we always put words in The Lords mouth. (Like Eve did from the very beginning).

1 Corinthians 7:14 For the unbelieving husband is sanctified by the wife, and the unbelieving wife is sanctified by the husband: else were your children unclean; but now are they holy.

Do you see any condemnation in the verse above?

When we read the Bible with faith and belief in our heart and pray for understanding, The Word comes alive. Knowledge puffet up, we should leave our brains in the top drawer!

Aloha,
Renee


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