Worship God with the dance?
 

Hello, everyone! I'm new here. Can anyone help explain to me these verses?

Ps 149:3
Let them praise his name in the dance: let them sing praises unto him with the timbrel and harp.
Ps 150:4
Praise him with the timbrel and dance: praise him with stringed instruments and organs.
Ec 3:4
A time to weep, and a time to laugh; a time to mourn, and a time to dance;

I pastor a KJB Baptist church in the Philippines, and we have no "such custom". Churches around us here even adopted the idea to have a ballet dance ("interpretative" dance) as an "invocation". What do ye say?

We are too far removed from the days of the Psalmist to KNOW what they did.

We do KNOW this...

John 4:24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.

No doubt, though, people would prefer to dance

I have read that the word used in reference to David dancing before the Lord means basically leaping excitedly - not like what we would call dancing today. Plus, it was just him - not the whole congregation dancing at once.

There are several places in Israel's history where they celebrated their victories with dance - but I would not necessarily call those times of worship, but rather of public celebration - and again it was not the whole congregation of Israel dancing at one time or together. In Exodus 15, we see Miriam and some of the women dancing.

Exodus 15:20 And Miriam the prophetess, the sister of Aaron, took a timbrel in her hand; and all the women went out after her with timbrels and with dances.

I do not believe Ecclesiastes is referring to any kind of dance used in worship - but like what happened above, some kind of vistory/celebration dance. From what I recall of Israel's history, the men and women worshipped separately, and would have also danced separately - not like some public dance where the men and women are together and have their hands on one another, moving suggestively. If a husband and wife want to do that privately in their home or bedroom, that is up to them - but it has no place in the public life of the church or of a Christian.

Dancing is controversial. I've seen "appropriate" dancing before. It was movements of joy and done without sensuality of anykind. Dancing isn't a command just like tamborines (timbrals) aren't. If they were, then every person in every church better use one and get moving. So, I associate these verses with the followinf NT verses:
1 Corinthians 10:31 Whether therefore ye eat, or drink, or whatsoever ye do, do all to the glory of God.
and--
1 Corinthians 6:20 For ye are bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body, and in your spirit, which are God's.

Yes, it is controversial indeed! I remember when I was a child that dancing in worship is "Charismatic" or "Pentecostal", and Baptists who imitated the practice were termed "Bapticostal". Today, the so-called "Praise and Worship" movement is very unpopular. Since, again, we have "no such custom" in our church, some young people are asking if it is wrong. What do you say about this?

Praise and worship music is typically soft rock - and I bet any child dancing to it, is moving to the rhythm, not dancing in worship.

We do not find David moving to the music - we find him leaping for joy.

Oops, sorry... what I meant was "very popular".

2 Samuel 6:20 Then David returned to bless his household. And Michal the daughter of Saul came out to meet David, and said, How glorious was the king of Israel to day, who uncovered himself to day in the eyes of the handmaids of his servants, as one of the vain fellows shamelessly uncovereth himself!

David told Michal that he danced before the Lord. Those in churches today say they are dancing before the Lord.

David admitted to a vile dance,

2Sa*6:22
And I will yet be more vile than thus, and will be base in mine own sight: and of the maidservants which thou hast spoken of, of them shall I be had in honour.

"of them shall I be had in honour", seems to me he was showing off for them.

When I attended a Pentecostal church many years ago, we sang a song "Dance Like David Danced". We danced and it was fun. I don't like to pass judgment but I do wonder if today's dancing in the churches is before the Lord, or is it fun?

Grace...........http://www.praize.com/members/Commun...0231985595.gif

King David wasn't showing off. What Michal got upset about and what David referred to was his associating with and identifying with the common folk. They appreciated him - had him in more honour - because of this - but in her pride she despised him more because of this.

I hope the dance wasn't too inappropriate. ;) Grace

Is that a Smiley-Dance?

Yep, I don't wear grass skirts. ;)

Now about David. Do you think David's dance was holy toward the Lord? I do realise that these people were not sophisticated and cultured in the sense that we are. They were raw and as he said "base". So maybe he didn't mind dancing for all to see but Michal was not happy about him showing all he owned to the maidens. Neither would I be if it was my husband.

I believe that his dance more than being holy was a dance of passion and excitement about the great feat of the ark coming home. He was emotional in a fleshly way. I'm not so sure that is always bad. God gave us emotions and granted we must have self control but when we clap (if we do) over a song, are we sure that it is a holy clap or is it an emotional excited clap. Same as dancing.

..............http://www.praize.com/members/Commun...0226989231.gif......Grace

What does this mean? David was not naked - if he was naked in public, he would be sinning - regardless of whether he was danving or not. In the passage, Michal makes a slander towards him that was unjustified.

2 Samuel 6:20-22 Then David returned to bless his household. And Michal the daughter of Saul came out to meet David, and said, How glorious was the king of Israel to day, who uncovered himself to day in the eyes of the handmaids of his servants, as one of the vain fellows shamelessly uncovereth himself! And David said unto Michal, It was before the LORD, which chose me before thy father, and before all his house, to appoint me ruler over the people of the LORD, over Israel: therefore will I play before the LORD. And I will yet be more vile than thus, and will be base in mine own sight: and of the maidservants which thou hast spoken of, of them shall I be had in honour.

1 Chronicles 15:27-29 And David was clothed with a robe of fine linen, and all the Levites that bare the ark, and the singers, and Chenaniah the master of the song with the singers: David also had upon him an ephod of linen. Thus all Israel brought up the ark of the covenant of the LORD with shouting, and with sound of the cornet, and with trumpets, and with cymbals, making a noise with psalteries and harps. And it came to pass, as the ark of the covenant of the LORD came to the city of David, that Michal the daughter of Saul looking out at a window saw king David dancing and playing: and she despised him in her heart.

David had removed his kingly apparel - so Michal despised him for not holding himself above the people. He was not naked or uncovered - just not covered with what she figured he should be covered with.

Psa 150:1 Praise ye the LORD. Praise God in his sanctuary: praise him in the firmament of his power.
Psa 150:2 Praise him for his mighty acts: praise him according to his excellent greatness.
Psa 150:3 Praise him with the sound of the trumpet: praise him with the psaltery and harp.
Psa 150:4 Praise him with the timbrel and dance: praise him with stringed instruments and organs.
Psa 150:5 Praise him upon the loud cymbals: praise him upon the high sounding cymbals.
Psa 150:6 Let every thing that hath breath praise the LORD. Praise ye the LORD.

I believe this praise is for the whole church. Some Christians will go to a football game and shout and blow horns and have marching bands to honor a bunch of sweaty jocks that they worship and idolize.

As for me I only care that my Lord God Almighty and my Savior Jesus Christ get more praise than these Jocks or anybody else. I will dance, play instruments and praise Him for He is who He is. None other is worthy of praise and worship. I will honor Him by not being ashamed to raise my hands, fall on my face and pray, dance, shout praises to His name, Sing until I lose my voice praising my God.

Matthew Henry said:Psa 150:1-6 -
We are here, with the greatest earnestness imaginable, excited to praise God; if, as some suppose, this psalm was primarily intended for the Levites, to stir them up to do their office in the house of the Lord, as singers and players on instruments, yet we must take it as speaking to us, who are made to our God spiritual priests. And the repeated inculcating of the call thus intimates that it is a great and necessary duty, a duty which we should be much employed and much enlarged in, but which we are naturally backward to and cold in, and therefore need to be brought to, and held to, by precept upon precept, and line upon line. Observe here,
I. Whence this tribute of praise arises, and out of what part of his dominion it especially issues. It comes, 1. From his sanctuary; praise him there. Let his priests, let his people, that attend there, attend him with their praises. Where should he be praised, but there where he does, in a special manner, both manifest his glory and communicate his grace? Praise God upon the account of his sanctuary, and the privileges which we enjoy by having that among us, Eze_37:26. Praise God in his holy ones (so some read it); we must take notice of the image of God as it appears on those that are sanctified, and love them for the sake of that image; and when we praise them we must praise God in them. 2. From the firmament of his power. Praise him because of his power and glory which appear in the firmament, its vastness, its brightness, and its splendid furniture; and because of the powerful influences it has upon this earth. Let those that have their dwelling in the firmament of his power, even the holy angels, lead in this good work. Some, by the sanctuary, as well as by the firmament of his power, understand the highest heavens, the residence of his glory; that is indeed his sanctuary, his holy temple, and there he is praised continually, in a far better manner than we can praise him. And it is a comfort to us, when we find we do it so poorly, that it is so well done there.
II. Upon what account this tribute of praise is due, upon many accounts, particularly, 1. The works of his power (Psa_150:2): Praise him for his mighty acts; for his mightinesses (so the word is), for all the instances of his might, the power of his providence, the power of his grace, what he has done in the creation, government, and redemption of the world, for the children of men in general, for his own church and children in particular. 2. The glory and majesty of his being: Praise him according to his excellent greatness, according to the multitude of his magnificence (so Dr. Hammond reads it); not that our praises can bear any proportion to God's greatness, for it is infinite, but, since he is greater than we can express or conceive, we must raise our conceptions and expressions to the highest degree we can attain to. Be not afraid of saying too much in the praises of God, as we often do in praising even great and good men. Deus non patitur hyperbolum - We cannot speak hyperbolically of God; all the danger is of saying too little and therefore, when we have done our utmost, we must own that though we have praised him in consideration of, yet not in proportion to, his excellent greatness.
III. In what manner this tribute must be paid, with all the kinds of musical instruments that were then used in the temple-service, Psa_150:3-5. It is well that we are not concerned to enquire what sort of instruments these were; it is enough that they were well known then. Our concern is to know, 1. That hereby is intimated how full the psalmist's heart was of the praises of God and how desirous he was that this good work might go on. 2. That in serving God we should spare no cost nor pains. 3. That the best music in God's ears is devout and pious affections, non musica chordula, sed cor - not a melodious string, but a melodious heart. Praise God with a strong faith; praise him with holy love and delight; praise him with an entire confidence in Christ; praise him with a believing triumph over the powers of darkness; praise him with an earnest desire towards him and a full satisfaction in him; praise him by a universal respect to all his commands; praise him by a cheerful submission to all his disposals; praise him by rejoicing in his love and solacing yourselves in his great goodness; praise him by promoting the interests of the kingdom of his grace; praise him by a lively hope and expectation of the kingdom of his glory. 4. That, various instruments being used in praising God, it should yet be done with an exact and perfect harmony; they must not hinder, but help one another. The New Testament concert, instead of this, is with one mind and one mouth to glorify God, Rom_15:6.
IV. Who must pay this tribute (Psa_150:6): Let every thing that has breath praise the Lord. He began with a call to those that had a place in his sanctuary and were employed in the temple-service; but he concludes with a call to all the children of men, in prospect of the time when the Gentiles should be taken into the church, and in every place, as acceptably as at Jerusalem, this incense should be offered, Mal_1:11. Some think that in every thing that has breath here we must include the inferior creatures (as Gen_7:22), all in whose nostrils was the breath of life. They praise God according to their capacity. The singing of birds is a sort of praising God. The brutes do in effect say to man, “We would praise God if we could; do you do it for us.” John in vision heard a song of praise from every creature which is in heaven, and on the earth, and under the earth, Rev_5:13. Others think that only the children of men are meant; for into them God has in a more peculiar manner breathed the breath of life, and they have become living souls, Gen_2:7. Now that the gospel is ordered to be preached to every creature, to every human creature, it is required that every human creature praise the Lord. What have we our breath, our spirit, for, but to spend it in praising God; and how can we spend it better? Prayers are called our breathings, Lam_3:56. Let every one that breathes towards God in prayer, finding the benefit of that, breathe forth his praises too. Having breath, let the praises of God perfume our breath; let us be in this work as in our element; let it be to us as the air we breathe in, which we could not live without. Having our breath in our nostrils, let us consider that it is still going forth, and will shortly go and not return. Since therefore we must shortly breathe our last, while we have breath let us praise the Lord, and then we shall breathe our last with comfort, and, when death runs us out of breath, we shall remove to a better state to breathe God's praises in a freer better air.
The first three of the five books of psalms (according to the Hebrew division) concluded with Amen and Amen, the fourth with Amen, Hallelujah, but the last, and in it the whole book, concludes with only Hallelujah, because the last six psalms are wholly taken up in praising God and there is not a word of complaint or petition in them. The nearer good Christians come to their end the fuller they should be of the praises of God. Some think that this last psalm is designed to represent to us the work of glorified saints in heaven, who are there continually praising God, and that the musical instruments here said to be used are no more to be understood literally than the gold, and pearls, and precious stones, which are said to adorn the New Jerusalem, Rev_21:18, Rev_21:19. But, as those intimate that the glories of heaven are the most excellent glories, so these intimate that the praises the saints offer there are the most excellent praises. Prayers will there be swallowed up in everlasting praises; there will be no intermission in praising God, and yet no weariness - hallelujahs for ever repeated, and yet still new songs. Let us often take a pleasure in thinking what glorified saints are doing in heaven, what those are doing whom we have been acquainted with on earth, but who have gone before us thither; and let it not only make us long to be among them, but quicken us to do this part of the will of God on earth as those do it that are in heaven. And let us spend as much of our time as may be in this good work because in it we hope to spend a joyful eternity. Hallelujah is the word there (Rev_19:1, Rev_19:3); let us echo to it now, as those that hope to join in it shortly. Hallelujah, praise you the Lord.

Jerry, I won't argue with you about David's dance. When I read "uncovered" that is how I saw it.

I thought of this verse, Genesis 9:21 And he drank of the wine, and was drunken; and he was uncovered within his tent.

The uncovering seems to infer shame. Now if it was that he removed his kingly robes it was a fleshly, shameful thing to do because that is the how the account is written.

We are discussing worshipping God with dance. I have no doubt that David was worshipping God. My point is that many who are dancing in churches today are worshipping God too.

Grace, http://www.praize.com/members/Commun...0226921975.gif

Lively Stone...Goodonya bro'

..........http://www.praize.com/members/Commun...0242364723.gif........Grace

In David's case, he was not uncovered. Michal slandered him - he did not shame himself before God. That is why Michal was cursed by God - if David had sinned (and public nakedness is sin), then God would have chastised David, not Michal. That is why it is good to arrive at a conclusion that takes into account all related or parallel passages. 1 Chronicles gives some info that 2 Samuel does not.

1 Chronicles 15:29 And it came to pass, as the ark of the covenant of the LORD came to the city of David, that Michal the daughter of Saul looking out at a window saw king David dancing and playing: and she despised him in her heart.

2 Samuel 6:23 Therefore Michal the daughter of Saul had no child unto the day of her death.

dancing
 

I see Davids dance as an example of a man leaping and bounding with joy, much like you see on the old newsreels of men leaping and bounding down the street celebrating the of the end of WW2.

No way do I see David tippy tapping down the street in an effeminate, choreographed Fred Astaire routine.

Praise and worship dancing today is carried out with a swaying, sensual motion in rythum with rock style music. Those participating may be doing so with good intentions, but they should ask themselves..." what difference is there to my style of worship to that carried out by people attending an Elton John concert"?

As for using dance as an "invocation"...an invocation to what?, God tells Moses in Numbers 20:8 "...and SPEAK ye unto the rock before their eyes;and it shall give forth his water,..." The rock is a picture of Christ and his living water (John chapter 4) and tells us that we only need to speak to him...no need to invoke him with a Michael Jackson impersonation.

God Bless

As a pastor, I tell my congregation a few things about "dancing".
1. Don't be "shakin' your torso forever more-so
2. If you be dancing in public and not in private, you are basically putting on a show
3. Dancing from the hips is a call of the wild.
4. The Bible shows dancing as an act of worship. Are you trying to seduce the Lord or worship satan by your hip-swaying?

1 Corinthians 10:31 Whether therefore ye eat, or drink, or whatsoever ye do, do all to the glory of God.

Psalms 149:3 Let them praise his name in the dance: let them sing praises unto him with the timbrel and harp.

Psalms 150:4 Praise him with the timbrel and dance: praise him with stringed instruments and organs.

One thing the Problem is when people use poetry to create a doctrine. Poetry is emotional. the preist never danced in the temple. There is a big movement here where I am serving in the Philippines. And I would have to say it is of teh flesh. the girating of hips and placing the hands behind the head and bouncing themselves in and out just doesn't seem God honoring yet they call themselves "gansters for God" When I got a chnce to meet a couple of these kids they were no spiritual minded two of them carried demonic spirits and couldn't even look me in the eye when we shook hands. I could see it all over them they weren't saved they were just a member of a dance troop claiming it was for God. Quites Emergent Church though as it blended worldly with supposed spiritual. there pastor is an entertainer, song writer seems to be more interested in getting support form Foriegn Churches (money aint that what it all comes down too).

Davids dance was done in his flesh the best an OT saint could do was keep laws and do things. We are not told the spirit filled him. He never danced in the temple his dance was in the road way. to dance like david danced is not Biblical

I like the way you said that. I too believe David's dance was a dance of the flesh. However, he was passionate and excited before the Lord.

Thank you for some of your comments on Emergent Church in the Phillipines.I didn't know it was active there.

Grace,.......:)

Grace,

you know what is so amazing down here in Palawan Philippines I have seen stuff that some Christians only read about in mythology class, or some old missionaries journals, I have seen where they came up with those little baby heads with wings flying around the RC Churches. This place is a demonic stronghold. I was street witnessing one day and had a demonic possessed woman come up and hit me with a punch that would have laid out a WWF wrestler and I stood there as if it was a fly landing on my cheek. because the Holy Spirit was the one who was moving and not me.

the floating heads in the darkest night we would command to leave in Jesus name never even speaking a word from our mortal lips but in the Spirit from our hearts and they would flee. Giant black shadows and Satyr's run away as we approach tribal villages just for a few hour visit to encourage the brethren.

and it would only be natural for us to see all the counterfit spiritual manifestations and every form of Unity for the sake of unity. they say we need to drop our denominationalism (though I am not a denomination) and just come together to serve the Lord. If we did that with our currency we would have no value. People forget the value there is in the multiplicity of the church. but to just through sound doctrine out the window for the sake of worshipping together. I think I will not thank you.

the sad thing is many of those out there that may read this form will never even know what we in the missionfield go through trying to bring the Gospel to one lost soul without enough support to even pay for our monthly needs for me and my family. and when I do get to the States by Gods grace many churches wont support us because they want to support only Orphanages. there are five of them down here and the missionaries that run them haven't led one person to Jesus the Whole 11 years I have been here. they live like kings and Queens with all their servants washing their clothes and drive around in their nice fully paid fully insured SUV's and MiniVans. while others like my self walk for 7 mile in hope some one has deposited some money in our account so we can buy some food to eat and get some soap so we can take a bath. some poor guy finally gave me a motor bike. you beleive that a poor Vietnese guy give an American a motorbike so I can get around better. I cried that day.

but I will tell you we have never gone hungry, we have had unsaved people knock on our door at 930 at night just to give us 2lbs of dried sardines and 10lbs of rice. of which after I take it into my house and pray for them. I go to my room and cry at the lack of faith I have in trusting the Lord to supply my every need.

I have seen 17 our of 25 young people get saved in one night at a home Bible Study. and because they live so far away from us and are just a poor as we are. we recommend them to a Bible Beleiving Chrit preaching church that is near their house becasue we can't get them to our church 4 mile away.

Well that sounded sad but just this week we got a multicab and if the Lord keeps supplying we wil get it all fixed up and be picking them up from now on. as many of them end up struggleing so hard and droping out of church because they are trying not to do things rather than just focusing on the Spirit in them and Christ eminating from them. their hearts are neglected as the preacher at the Bible preaching church focus on thier outward appearance and not their inward beauty in Christ by God Holy Spirit which indwells them.

so the Next time whne the Jerry's and Liveli stones want to knock what we have to say let them come down here where I am at And I will take them to some of the poorest peopel in the worldfor God has blessed the poor to be rich in Faith. I will put them in the one of th most demonic places they have ever visited and then lets see how well they hang and how well their faith holds out when they see al their money gone and praying for their next meal, praying for lost souls is the food you will eat at some meals. but hten right as they are ready to go to bed hungry. the LORD will MOve and they too will be filled with Joy of their Salvation that their God has given them all the riches in Christ Jesus Right now at their finger tips if they will just allign themselve with him and stop focuing on themselves and their understanding.

1/3 of the OT is poetry - do you just disregard 1/4 of your Bible when it comes to doctrine. There is plenty of doctrine in Job, Psalms, Proverbs, Ecclesiastes, Song of Solomon, and the poetical portions of the prophetical books.

The Bible teaches that the Spirit of the Lord came upon David and never left him - so yeah, he was filled with the Spirit (or the equivalent of it in the OT).

Hm, his dancing was not Biblical? It was in the Bible - it is not shown in a negative light - so yeah, it was Biblical.

yeah UPON HIM not INDWELLED HIM! read the english as Ruckman says.

theat is OT spirit upon but today we are filled to over flowing life. you will find inth eOT many instances of a man being filled with the spririt but only for God's Puerposes then it was removed.

being filled gives us an advantage in Grace we can be filled daily by the Holy Sirit, and have His power to live the humanly impossible christian life through the Spirit. God inno other dispensation has provided for every believer the pure power of God for their life and character.

Read my post on Spirit filled to the max in the emergent post maye you might learn something Jerry. oh but you seem to be so full of yourself knowledge there isno room for th eHoly Ghost to teach you.

Cynicism is never list in the fruit of the Spirit. oh yeah and when we say Biblical we me that it was authorized by God. not heathen dancing or wilderness dancing.

one thing I have learned that if the doctrine does not agree with the NT teaching of the Apostle to the Gentile it is not doctrine for today. and that is the problem everybody and most do mix up doctrines from different dispensations and say they are all for today. well remember if you keep one law you must do them all. if you break one you break them all

But I praise my God and Lord Jesus Christ for putting to death the Law on the cross. so if youwant to use OT doctrines to run your life go ahead. as for me and my house we shall serve the Lord in newness of Spirit and not in oldness of the letter.

2 Timothy 3:16-17 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.

I agree. Thanks for your testimony of faith. I shudder to think of the Emergent Church mixed up in all of that. It's "another gospel" and how will they differentiate without you to show them the way.

http://www.praize.com/members/Commun...0226991022.gif

Grace

yeah it is profitable it doesn't say it is ALL DOCTRINE.

that mixing of Doctrine is among even the most conservative churches today.

the fullness of Grace toward the beleiver in faith free from law and works. for the unsaved it is Believe on Christ, for the saved (of which there are two types of Christians taught in the NT CArnal and Spiritual) it is yield yourselves unto God and your members unto righteousness. Be filled, be led, be taugth of the HOLY SPIRIT.

many get caught in their own teachings they forget and seek the scriptures. they hope in them they find salvation but they speak of Jesus Christ and all that he has provided complete and whole for our dispensation.

The Bible does not teach we do not need to obey any laws in Scripture - nor that we do not have to do any works. What it does teach is that the OT Law shows us that we are sinners in need of Saviour, and that there are no works we can do to merit salvation. However, as believers we are still required to obey the 10 commandments and the precepts in God's Word - if an OT command does not directly apply, there is still a principle or precept from it that does. There are many verses that teach believers (those who are saved) are to do good works in service to the Lord.

The Holy Spirit teaches through His Word, not apart from it.

Hi, I'm a bit quiet and didn't involve so much in the discussion...I want to learn from what all you have to say on this issue - Biblically. I found an article by a Pentecostal preacher, which seems interesting:

Praise Dance, Worship Dance — Is It for the Church?
By Pastor Jim Feeney, Ph.D.

What some Christians call “praise and worship dance” is practiced in a number churches today. Those that encourage Christian praise dancing usually are Pentecostal or charismatic churches.

I personally have a number of friends in Christian ministry who encourage worship dance as a New Testament truth. Some even create a specific “praise dance ministry” in their churches. These are good men, and I genuinely respect the sincerity of their beliefs on this subject. However, in the light of the Scriptures, I do not share their conclusion that dancing in church is a biblical worship form for New Testament believers.

In the balance of this study, I would like to share from Scripture why I do not believe that God has established praise dancing as a worship form in the New Testament...

Here is the link to his full article:
http://www.jimfeeney.org/dancingasworship.html

Hello Chete777,
The testimony you shared was challenging. Where do you live in Palawan? It was in Cuyo, Palawan that I preached without a microphone in open-air, which caused me to have a vocal cord polyp - unfortunately. I might be visiting there in the main island in October.

hey Bible student

I am in Puerto Princesa City. we did open air in the new market utill all our equipment failed. now we are getting ready to go back. so many people have been asking us to return.

your welcome to stay with us if you need a place to throw your bag. LOL

your friend Chette

Jerry

law is law ten commandments or nine if you like. they are all law. I live under the law of Liberty. and the Holy Spirit and my KJV BIble teach me quite a bit. like Gen 1:1 is past tense when up comes verse 2 and it is present active. In the English that is.

have fun

Jerry,

don't put words in my mouth OK. we are without law and works that would give us Gods Favor. but the christian is saved for good works that God has prepared for them to walk in and we are to maintain good works but non of that is meant to keep us in a right relationship with God or gain his favor. my good works are not to repay him for what he has done but for a reward promised me when I get to heaven. thenI will lay all those crowns at my Saviour Jesus Feet for he made it all possible for me.

I have all of Gods favor at any moment his over flowing blessing continually as long as I am rightly related with him not just in Christ but confessed up of my sinfulness.

and even if I sin God still is blessing me to the max you know why. because His son died on the cross for me and you to give us all his favor (grace) and blessings. he never cuts me off. it is I who cut my self off by sin and pride.

yes the Princibles of the OT law are in the NT they are restated and they are impossible for you to do unless filled and led, and guided and taught by the Holy Ghost.

blessing bro.

Somebody sent to me a link to a video of a Christian singer with back up dancers showing their belly buttons. Is this what modern Christians say "using their talents for the Lord"? I also read in one article of "belly dancing" in church (!).

Hm, maybe they need to actually read their Bibles. Mine says that to uncover/expose the loins (the belly area) is nakedness.

Worrying word....
 

I know I'm a latecomer to this thread, but what I found slightly concerning was the following quote:

"Churches around us here even adopted the idea to have a ballet dance ("interpretative" dance) as an "invocation". What do ye say?"

The word 'invocation' has no Biblical basis though it is well linked with the occult/spiritist practices and paganism (satanism). What/who are these churches trying to invoke?

As a former occultist, I find this trend (along with 'visions'/'contemplative prayer'/so-called 'christian yoga') quite disturbing.

However, we shouldn't be surprised, the Bible does warn us of such things.

Anyway, just an aside!

Doesn't the word invocation mean something like calling a spirit forth, making it appear? We call on God's name, but we don't make Him appear - by dancing or rituals. He is omnipresent.