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atlas 03-11-2008 12:21 AM

Dr. Peter S. Ruckman's Bible Believer's Bulletin free for download!!!!!!
 
Guys,

Dr. Peter S. Ruckman's Bible Believer's Bulletin free for download. You can read and learn all of his Bible Believer's Bulletin starting back from 2004. Now many of you will know what he says, not just what others say he says. Go download them and enjoy them.

http://www.kjv1611.org/BBB/Bulletin%...oad%20Page.htm

If you'll go get the Bible Believer's Bulletin and read it you will learn many things you do not know. I hope this will help many of you learn more about God's word. There are 51 Bible Believer's Bulletin for download to date. if you want you can download and save them all. if you'll read all 51 of these. I know you'll learn far more about the KJV and the people that hate the Bible. You'll also learn many other good things about the Bible. I think it was kind for Dr. Ruckman to make these available for free.

:D


Atlas

Brother Tim 03-11-2008 11:15 AM

Atlas said:
Quote:

If you'll go get the Bible Believer's Bulletin and read it you will learn many things you do not know.
He was right! I began a the first issue and was reading about Hampton Court. The article continued to the Feb 2004 issue, so I went there. As I was reading, I noticed a word that caught my attention. The word was "Pollack". In the Feb 2004 bulletin, and I assume others I suppose Dr. Ruckman wants to lighten up and tells a few jokes. Below is a copy of some in Feb 2004:
Quote:

One Pollack wasted a
week trying to write “Happy
Birthday” on a cake: he
couldn’t get it into the typewriter.
They are having a hard
time with the space program
in Poland; the astronauts
keep falling off the kites.
A Pollack, out Christmas
caroling, was singing “Leon,
Leon, Leon, Leon!” when his
buddy said to him, “Turn you
book over, stupid. That’s
NOEL!”
And this is evidence of a charactered, worthy representation of Christian humor? This is one of the many reasons that Dr. Ruckman is disliked and discredited by other King James Defenders. He has such poor taste in what is humor that it makes me ashamed. No wonder those who doubt the KJB to be the Pure Word of God have such an easy time pointing out our faults. What he shows by his belittling humor screams so loud, I can't concentrate on what might be truth elsewhere.

atlas 03-11-2008 01:06 PM

Brother Tim,

Well I am glad you found something bad to post. It only took you two issues to find something. It is not all that bad. maybe you should keep reading and try again that is very week. Is one Pollack joke the worst you can find? You like many others do not like Ruckman and are just trying to find something bad.

Now the question is did you find anything of value are you just looking for " bad things " to point out to others?

This is funny man, find something worse then post it.


Atlas

jerry 03-11-2008 01:21 PM

The thing is: he published that joke in a book he wrote. It is not just something stated in a moment of weakness or carnality - he chose what to print in his books. And he is accountable for every word he prints.

Brother Tim 03-11-2008 01:23 PM

Atlas, I and no other decent person find humor in ridiculing people just because they are from a particular country or ethic background. The sad fact is that it DIDN'T take very long to find things that ought not to be coming out of the mouth of a man of God. If you find it funny, then that speaks to your character and maybe that is why you cannot see the shame in it.

Proverbs 10:23 It is as sport to a fool to do mischief: but a man of understanding hath wisdom.

sport: derision, laughter(-ed to scorn, -ing), mocked

Brother Tim 03-11-2008 01:33 PM

I must hasten to explain that I do not disagree with many things that Dr. Ruckman has brought out in the debate over the text. It just is beyond me to put a lot of weight on a man who cannot control his tongue. We are all flesh, and we all have thoughts that are impure or improper. The Spirit-controlled man learns how to hold his tongue from expressing those thoughts.

I have been told, relating to Dr. Ruckman's teachings, that I should just "eat the meat and spit out the bones." That would be great if the bones didn't keep getting caught in my throat!

P.S. I counted three, not one joke against Polanders.

atlas 03-11-2008 01:40 PM

Brother Tim,

Quote:

I and no other decent person find humor in ridiculing people just because they are from a particular country or ethic background.
When I said this is funny, I said so because at the time you had only made 4 post. All of them anti Ruckman. Now you have 5 post all anti Ruckman. That is what is so funny. You make anti Ruckman post then are trying to act objective. That was and is my point. Is that the only reason why you are here is to make anti Ruckman post? Do you not have anything of value to add other than attack him and call my being decent into question? Insults will not get you far in life my friend. I hope you learn that soon, maybe you will and maybe you will not. Thanks for all of the good post.

I see you tried to make a new attack while I was posting, therefore my numbers above are off a little. It is 7 anti Ruckman post to date and calling two people " no other decent person. " I'm going to keep my eye on you.

:-)


Atlas

Brother Tim 03-11-2008 01:46 PM

Atlas, do you find his jokes about "Pollacks" funny or tasteless? Should they be placed in a publication that is available for all of his true enemies to use against him? I am not anti-Ruckman, I am anti-foulmouth.

Also, if you are keeping score, my first posts were anti-"study" Bible, not about being against Peter Ruckman.

atlas 03-11-2008 01:53 PM

Brother Tim,

I am anti people saying I am not a decent person. I am also anti people that only make anti Ruckman post and will no acknowledge it.

Notice how you insulted me, however I never insulted you. Funny isn't it? Maybe you need to clean up your own mouth before you try to do so with others.

Quote:

I am not anti-Ruckman
Well why have all of your post but one been anti Ruckman so far?


Atlas

Brother Tim 03-11-2008 01:56 PM

I ask you again, do you consider his jokes humorous?

atlas 03-11-2008 02:02 PM

Brother Tim,

I already have told you what I thought was funny.

Quote:

When I said this is funny, I said so because at the time you had only made 4 post. All of them anti Ruckman.
You just did not like my reply.

Atlas

Brother Tim 03-11-2008 02:07 PM

One last post before I go to work:
I assume that your choice not to directly answer my two questions tells me this:
1. You are a decent person, and therefore cannot condone his tasteless jokes.
2. You are such a strong supporter of him that you cannot bring yourself to publicly criticize him, even when he is clearly wrong.

I accept this, in will not further offend you by discussing Dr. Ruckman.

atlas 03-11-2008 02:23 PM

Brother Tim,

Quote:

You are such a strong supporter of him that you cannot bring yourself to publicly criticize him, even when he is clearly wrong.
I disagree with him on a number of issues, I will not however say he is not a decent man as you have done.


Quote:

I assume that your choice not to directly answer my two questions tells me this:
I did tell you what I thought was funny. You questioned what I thought was funny and I told you. Unless you acknowledge that answer we can not move to you next question.

I have not been offended. I have just had a good laugh not at the joke but at you, that is all. I still am laughing by the way. I was wondering if you could find something valid to bring up. I know you can't and that is what is so funny. You went to read the BBB to try and dig up some kind of dirt. The dirt you found was so lame and you are making a big deal about it. That is what is so funny.

Quote:

I accept this, in will not further offend you by discussing Dr. Ruckman.

If you ever find anything you want to discuss about Ruckman bring it on. Just make sure it is not so lame next time. get something worth talking about. This has been the whole point of my post. The English make fun of the French all of the time. When I was in NYC it was the same about Canada or NJ. In Texas it is the folks from OK. We all make fun of each other all of the time. It is not a big deal. You think it is and that is what is so funny. I guess in FL they do not Have GA or AL jokes. IN NC it is always the WV folks that get it.

Have a good day at work. When you come back go find something to nail Ruckman on. Then we can and will talk about it.

:D

Atlas

George 03-12-2008 12:57 PM

Re: Peter S. Ruckman – Crackpot or Crusader?
 
It seems that there are a couple of brothers here that have an extreme personal dislike for brother Ruckman. This animosity towards a fellow Christian, a brother in Christ, must be based on something.

I wonder whether he has insulted them or their wives or their children personally or has he perhaps insulted someone that they admire?

I will have more to say on this matter later.

jerry 03-12-2008 01:42 PM

I am not against Ruckman as a person, but against his teachings - which I am commanded to critique in light of God's Word.

Brother Tim 03-12-2008 03:59 PM

Bother George, I would distinguish between animosity and rebuke. I hold no personal dislike for any other believer, but I am responsible before God to speak against actions by brethren that hinder the effect of the Gospel.

1 Timothy 5:20 Them that sin rebuke before all, that others also may fear.

George 03-12-2008 08:49 PM

Re: Peter S. Ruckman – Crackpot or Crusader?
 
Aloha brothers Tim (and Jerry),

I owe you and brother Jerry an apology (sincerely). The word "animosity" is too strong a word to use to describe your dislike of brother Ruckman, and so I apologize - for I don't believe that you hate him.

I try real hard to make clear distinctions between words: for instance - when it comes to an "elders' or "pastors" Duties, Responsibilities, and Authority - the Bible clearly demonstrates what these are:

SCRIPTURAL DUTIES & RESPONSIBILITIES OF: {an elder-pastor}

PERSONAL (Inward)

1. PRAYER [Addressed - to God]

2. STUDY [Scriptures – from God]

CONGREGATIONAL (Outward)

3. PREACHING [FEEDING - The Word of God]

4. TEACHING [FEEDING - Convincing, Exhorting - Sound Doctrine & the Whole Council of God]

SCRIPTURAL AUTHORITY & LIMITS OF: {an elder-pastor}

5. WARNING [Against: Leaven (False Doctrine), Philosophy, Vain Deceit, the Traditions of Men, Science-Falsely-so-called, and the Rudiments of the World, etc.]

6. ADMONISHING [Advise, Caution, or Notify of a Fault]

7. REPROVING [To Refute, Disprove, or Convince of a Fault or to Make It Manifest]

8. REBUKING [To reprehend for faults; to chide, chasten, check, restrain or silence]

Headings 5-8 above describe the absolute LIMITS OF PASTORAL AUTHORITY. All matters of Discipline within a church are to be administered by the whole body (the congregation-1Corinthians 5:1-13) – NOT an individual elder-pastor, or a board of deacons, or any other extra-scriptural council or committee.

In the early church there was no clergy–laity set up as in almost all modern day churches. There was no one individual “pastor” over the church, or in the larger churches – a “senior pastor”; “assistant pastors”; “youth pastor”; “Choir Director”; or so-called “Christian Counsellors” - dispensing pagan philosophy within the church, or today’s’ modern equivalent - Humanism, Psychiatry, & Psychology.

The leaders in the early church were called elders and were always plural in number and they shared whatever power and authority they had – equally. No division existed between the congregation and elders-pastors. [They (elders-pastors and the congregation) all were brethren – with no distinctions!]

An elder (pastor) is not to exercise dominion over the brethren or over their faith! [2Corinthians 1:24]

Notice the difference between warning, admonishing, reproving, and rebuking. In 50 years of being a Christian I personally have hardly ever "rebuked" a brother in Christ. I will try all of the others first - and often times will not issue a rebuke even if the others fail.

Yours for Him and for His Holy word,
George

atlas 03-13-2008 12:51 AM

Brother Tim,

Quote:

but I am responsible before God to speak against actions by brethren that hinder the effect of the Gospel.
How is Dr. Ruckman " hindering the effect of the Gospel? "

Is it his 800 member church?
It is his Bible College that has put thousands in the field working for God?
Have his books ( seven foot shelf ) hindered the Gospel?

I know the Bibles says.

Quote:

1 Tim. 5:1

1 Rebuke not an elder, but intreat him as a father; and the younger men as brethren;
You also seemed to pull that one verse out of context. The elders are the one that should rebuke. This is talking about the local church. So the next time you go to your local church and someone gets out of line. You need to stand up in front of everyone and rebuke them in front of everyone. That way others will fear.

Quote:

1Tim. 5:17 - 20

17 Let the elders that rule well be counted worthy of double honour, especially they who labour in the word and doctrine.
18 For the scripture saith, Thou shalt not muzzle the ox that treadeth out the corn. And, The labourer is worthy of his reward.
19 Against an elder receive not an accusation, but before two or three witnesses.
20 Them that sin rebuke before all, that others also may fear.
I think Dr. Ruckman fits well into verse number 17.


Quote:

17 Let the elders that rule well be counted worthy of double honour, especially they who labour in the word and doctrine.
We know by his works ( 7 foot shelf ) that he has laboured in the word and doctrine.

Quote:

25 Likewise also the good works of some are manifest beforehand; and they that are otherwise cannot be hid.



Atlas

Brother Tim 03-13-2008 10:35 AM

Brother George,
First, I accept your apology, although no offense was taken by your words. I just wanted to clarify my position. Additionally I do not dislike Dr. Ruckman, I dislike the words that he has used and the jokes that he has printed.

Thank you for the detailed listing of the very similar words. Using your definitions, the following might qualify, and I seek your further help:

Admonish: (Advise, Caution, or Notify of a Fault) While I am certain that others have done this, perhaps I should communicate with him about the way that he sometimes refers to fellow believers, and the jokes printed in his newsletter that are in poor taste. Am I justified in doing this, in your opinion?

Reprove: (To Refute, Disprove, or Convince of a Fault or to Make It Manifest) It would appear that this word could be used for what I have done with previous posts. This may be a better word to use than rebuke, however ...

Rebuke: (To reprehend for faults; to chide, chasten, check, restrain or silence) While restraining or silencing him isn't expected, I do feel the need to speak out (reprehend or chide?) concerning his faults, because they have affected others like myself who accept the KJB as the Final Authority, and are then shackled with being called "Ruckmanites" and are linked to these same faults.

I do agree that the local church is the place where correction must take place, as long as that behavior is limited to affecting the local church. Just as Paul spoke out against Peter in public, yea, even writing it in a letter (post?), we should be able to express concern for the actions of others when they cross the line.

Dr. Ruckman could be compared to David. Though David was "a man after God's own heart", his enemies could always point to his failures and mock him. Dr. Ruckman has been a warrior in a very rough battle. Because of this, his flaws are amplified, and the fallout has brought harm to all of the rest of us who stand for the same things.

Finally, I am an elder-pastor and as such I feel qualified to speak as I have. I apologize for the offense that some may take at my words, but they are written with fear and trembling before God, not out of anger toward Dr. Ruckman or anyone else.

May God's grace be with you,

geologist 03-30-2008 10:07 AM

For the record, I think that people who object to Dr. Ruckman's sense of humor, and decry his "foul" language, are a bunch of pious, thin skinned nannys. Dr. Ruckman was an infantry officer, played in bars with jazz bands, was raised Catholic and was a real hell raiser before he was saved in a radio station studio where he was working as a DJ. He has a much better grasp on REAL human behavior, and the depravity of unsaved mankind, than most of you reading and posting here. I too came from a similar background and understand why the man talks like he does. I respect him for that. I know where he has been. Most of you havn't seen the uglier side of life, or you would understand where he is coming from.

Having said that, I don't agree with everything the man says. And to be honest, I too think he goes a little over the top sometimes. But, you know what? He calls a spade a spade. He gets people's attention and he's not afraid to speak his mind and tell it like it is. And I personally would rather hear a real man telling it like it is, than some sissy voiced, half effemenant, politically correct preacher spouting cliches and singing cumba ya.

The Lord has called each of us to be fishers of men. You don't snage sharks and baracuddas with frilly little pretty hand tied trout flies. You toss out some bloody meat if you want to get the bad fish. Each of us has a calling and the Lord calls all types to His service. Who are you to critize what the Lord has raised up in Peter Ruckman? He will stand or fall to the Master. And if you don't like this kind of plain speaking, then stick your head in a bucket three times and pull it out twice.

Here endeth the sermon.

jerry 03-30-2008 10:20 AM

Speaking in a crude manner is still sin, and the Bible commands us to guard our speach and not be corrupt in it, so it does not matter what his background is.

jerry 03-30-2008 10:24 AM

This is what God says about our speech - going against His commands is sin, plain and simple.

Colossians 4:6 Let your speech be alway with grace, seasoned with salt, that ye may know how ye ought to answer every man.

Salt is a preservative that prevents corruption.

Titus 2:7-8 In all things shewing thyself a pattern of good works: in doctrine shewing uncorruptness, gravity, sincerity, Sound speech, that cannot be condemned; that he that is of the contrary part may be ashamed, having no evil thing to say of you.

Brother Tim 03-30-2008 01:15 PM

Quote:

Geologist said, "And if you don't like this kind of plain speaking, then stick your head in a bucket three times and pull it out twice."
Geologist, may your own words judge you.

pbiwolski 04-02-2008 01:27 PM

Gentlemen, have you overlooked that Dr. Ruckman ends all of his "abusive" remarks with the "and I say that with charity, of course!?!"

jerry 04-02-2008 02:05 PM

Um, how does that make his abusive remarks charitable - just because he said they were?

Pastor Mikie 04-02-2008 03:28 PM

I can't say "amen" to everything Dr. Ruckman says. However, I do use his material as a resource.

George 04-02-2008 03:29 PM

Re: Brother Ruckman
 
To: "The Geologist"

Aloha brother,

For the record: There are only a few people on this Forum who "strongly" object to brother Ruckman. (brother Jerry & Brother Tim foremost)

When I joined in 3/08/08 I made the following observations:

{AV1611 Bible Forums > General Chit-Chat - Page #7}
Quote:

Peter S. Ruckman - Crackpot or Crusader?
Aloha all,

I'm new to this forum and have browsed around it reading most of the posts.

I personally think that this is one of the best forms I have seen {Full disclosure} although since "Diligent" is my son-in-law (married to our youngest daughter "Jaebird"), I may be slightly prejudiced.

However, I have noticed that there is one thing that this King James Bible Forum has in common with some others that I have seen - and that is a tendency on the part of some members (Bible believers to be sure) to dissociate or distance themselves from, or even criticize and tear down brother Peter Ruckman.

I also have noticed that many, if not most, of the negative comments that I read were based on "hearsay". So - before I make my comments I have 3 (three) questions to ask of any and all of those who have commented.

#1. Have you ever read any of the many books, commentaries, booklets, pamphlets, etc. that brother Ruckman has written? (And if so - how many? You don't have to list the names just the number -I'll trust you to be honest and truthful).

#2. Have you ever heard any of Peter Ruckman's numerous preaching and teaching tapes? (If so - how many? You don't have to list the names just the number -I'll trust you to be honest and truthful).

#3. Have you ever actually met brother Ruckman or been at any of his meetings where he has either preached or taught the word of God? (If so - where and when? I'll trust you to be honest and truthful).

The reason I put these questions to you is quite simple. I don't trust hearsay! After being saved for 50 years and having attended various churches and dealing with "all kinds" of Christians, sad to say, I don't trust Christians to judge matters the way that our Lord commanded us to Judge. (Matthew 7:1-2; John 7:24).

After a suitable amount of time I will truthfully answer all 3 questions myself and then make my comments.
Here are the answers I received from those who have objected to brother Ruckman (Underlines are mine):

Quote:

Jerry Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Kelowna, BC
Posts: 450

"I read at least two commentaries by him: Job and James -and as many articles as I could find online in 97-98, when I was first doing research on Bible versions. At first I liked his boldness, and willingness to expose those who didn't stand for the truth - but after a while I realized I was getting an aggressive attitude like he had - and the Lord got me to analyze it. His writings are filled with unjustified insults to his brethren, not making a distinction between an absolute heretic/apostate and someone who just dots their i's a little differently, slanders on David Cloud's position on the King James Bible (I have been reading Cloud for 10 years now, and he has never once corrected the KJV or called it into question - in fact, his research and studies reinforce it over and over again), and over time I have come across various articles that were fanciful additions to Scripture, as well as teaching the KJV is reinspired, corrects the underlying mansucripts (rather than being an accurate reflection of them), being a hyperdispensationalist. I have decided to not read his material any more - there are many other sound defenders of the KJV who don't wing it or get in the flesh in their defense of the KJV."
If you go through the General "chit chat" Section of the Forum under the heading "Dr. Ruckman" (15 Pages!) you will see several several other "negative" comments Jerry made about brother Ruckman - (before I joined up). {There is some confusion in the "thread" because someone introduced another "subject" (a no-no) into the "thread".}

"Brother Tim" had some "negative" comments about him in another thread ("Bible Studies"). He never did say how much he knew about him except that he objected to brother Ruckman's crude language.

On 3/11/08 (Page 10) I returned with a lengthy personal testimony about my relationship and knowledge of brother Ruckman and after a few comments by some of the brethren (most of which were "favorable" to brother Ruckman) there has been no criticism of him until now.

I find it very "instructive" that the same two people didn't hesitate to (once again) jump on brother Ruckman and freely criticize him. I thought we were done with that, but I guess as long as you are "nice" and "sweet" about it, that you can "bad mouth" a brother whenever you want to!

I don't know exactly why Brother Tim has a problem with brother Ruckman, but I do have a strong suspicion as to why brother Jerry has a "bone of contention" with him.

Brother Jerry is a big "fan" of brother David Cloud (He has referred to brother Cloud on this Forum and has "linked" to brother Cloud's site on occasion). I have visited brother Jerry's web page several times and it is real clear that he has a real high regard for brother David Cloud.

As you may or may not know there is a "feud" going on between brother Cloud and brother Ruckman. I have tried to look into it and although I am not absolutely sure. it appears that in the middle 1980's brother Cloud wrote (from Nepal)to brother Ruckman and criticized him for his "attitude" and it must have "offended" brother Ruckman, because he came back at him "like you know what". At this point I am not going to judge who's at fault, I just wish we Christians would stop "eating our young".

If you read my rather long post about brother Ruckman you'll know exactly where I stand on the man (by all appearances - close to where you stand). But I am going to make a promise to the "brethren" on this Forum: You may rest assured every time I see someone "criticize" brother Ruckman they are going to hear from me.

There are a lot of threads on this Forum that are worthwhile - we don't need "fried Ruckman" for lunch every once in a while! :mad:

Yours for the Lord Jesus Christ and for His Holy word,

George

p.s. Check out Stvvv1611's posts - he's "hot as a pistol" :D

jerry 04-02-2008 03:39 PM

Judge my posts, George, but it is wrong for you to judge my motives. I am not against Ruckman because I appreciate Cloud's material. I recommend Cloud's resources because I am like-minded in beliefs - just as I am assuming various people recommend Ruckman because they are like-minded to what he believes. I stand against Ruckman because there are various serious problems with him and his material that I have found. I have not found those same problems with Cloud.

However, sin is sin - if someone has a foul mouth - or foul typewriting fingers - then it is wrong, regardless of who the brother is. Also, wacky or heretical doctrine is wrong regardless of who supports it. THAT'S why I am against Ruckman, not because Cloud is against him. The material on Cloud's site has just reinforced my opinion of Ruckman, which I had already formed before I ever heard of or or read Cloud.

Jeff 04-02-2008 04:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by George (Post 2811)
I find it very "instructive" that the same two people didn't hesitate to (once again) jump on brother Ruckman and freely criticize him. I thought we were done with that, but I guess as long as you are "nice" and "sweet" about it, that you can "bad mouth" a brother whenever you want to!

George, what I get out of your words is that it's alright to criticize those who don't agree with you, such as Jerry and Brother Tim. However it is not alright to criticize those that you are a big fan of, such as Dr. Ruckman.

Is a man's character determined soley on what their views are and not how they conduct themselves?

Do you not see a double standard here?

browilder61 04-02-2008 04:30 PM

Geologist,

Is this Gaines Johnson by any chance? This is Steve Wilder, I emailed you from ako before I deployed back in Nov last year. Are you still in Kuwait? Right now I'm still with 4th ID at CP Liberty. Glad you joined the forum, I hope some on this forum visited your Christian Geology site. Later

George 04-02-2008 05:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jeff (Post 2817)
George, what I get out of your words is that it's alright to criticize those who don't agree with you, such as Jerry and Brother Tim. However it is not alright to criticize those that you are a big fan of, such as Dr. Ruckman.

Is a man's character determined soley on what their views are and not how they conduct themselves?

Do you not see a double standard here?

Did you read my words? "what I get out of your words". It's not "what you "get out of my words" - It's - what did I say? I never once said (or intimated) "that it's alright to criticize those who don't agree with you" No, not once! Please don't put words in my mouth.

I am saying let's stop criticizing brother Ruckman period! Have you seen me criticize brother Cloud or any other famous "Christian personality"? Why keep "beating up" on brother Ruckman if you have never met the man; or heard him preach or teach; or listened to his preaching & teaching tapes; or only read a couple of books by him? Hmmm?

There are other "fish to fry" out there. "Is a man's character determined soley on what their views are and not how they conduct themselves?" Good question! And i will answer it thusly: Is a man's character determined soley on what he says (or is reported to have said), or on his fruit? Matthew 7:20 Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them. We are not to judge by words, but by fruit - Is their anyone here that knows brother Ruckman well enough to be a "fruit inspector", if not then, let's drop the sniping of him - that's all.
Romans 14:4 Who art thou that judgest another man's servant? to his own master he standeth or falleth. Yea, he shall be holden up: for God is able to make him stand.

Check my posts out - you haven't seen me laud brother Ruckman; or "recommend him or his books or his tapes to anyone. I haven't "linked" to his site in all of my posts. I don't recommend any "Commentators" or "Commentaries" when it comes to Bible study.

I would be holding a double standard if I justified any wrongdoing that brother Ruckman does or has done. I never have and I never will!

Why do people judge other people when they know little or nothing about them?
John 7:24 Judge not according to the appearance, but judge righteous judgment.
Why judge at all, if you don't have to?

George 04-02-2008 05:29 PM

Brother Jerry,

I said "I have a strong suspicion" (If I had judged you or your motives I would have said: "Jerry has a "bone of contention", because he is a big "fan" of brother Cloud.") A "strong suspicion" is not "judging", but it is interesting that my statement seems to have hit a "sore spot" with you. My question for you is quite simple: Why do you have to continually "dump" on brother Ruckman at every opportunity?

You will notice that I have about 44 posts on this Forum and I haven't once dumped on brother Cloud - not once! Why dump on brother Ruckman over and over again? We all know how you "feel" about him - get over it, let's move on.

I'll tell you what: I'll promise not to "dump" on brother Cloud if you will promise not to "dump" on brother Ruckman - OK?

Another point: Look through all of my posts - I have never recommended Peter Ruckman's books, articles, materials, etc. - no, not once! I have never "linked" to his web page - no, not once!

I'm very careful who I recommend, and when I do recommend, it more likely has to do with recommending someone for a specific purpose - not Bible study. Examples: {Warnings on leaven in the churches & Psychiatry & Psychology; etc. (Dave Hunt - Berean Call) - even though I don't always agree with him; Psychiatry & Psychology - (Martin & Deidre Bobgan) - even though I don't always agree with them; and others on say: Evolution (Harry Rimmer, Henry Morris, etc.); ECM & "Seeker" churches (Roger Oakland); etc.; etc.}

NOTICE: I don't recommend "commentators" (men)or "commentaries" (or their books) when it comes to Bible study. If you want use them - fine. I used them from 1968-1988. It's not that I know everything, it's just that I have gotten to the point where when I have a "problem" with a "passage", I notice that all of the "Commentators" do too.

If someone uses a "commentator" or a "commentary" I always caution them to be "careful" of leaven and personal opinion. I don't condemn people if they choose to use these men or their books - "Christian Liberty you know. ;)

One other thing and I'll finish with my post: You have a tendency to "generalize" in making your accusations - "there are various serious problems with him and his material that I have found." (But you don't name any.) I could make that same accusation against anyone!; "However, sin is sin - if someone has a foul mouth - or foul typewriting fingers - then it is wrong" ( Be specific.); and again - "Also, wacky or heretical doctrine is wrong regardless of who supports it." (I agree but - what "wacky" or "heretical" doctrines? it's easy to throw out "general" accusations (anyone can do that!) - it's not so easy if you are "specific". If you have only read 2 of his books and he has written about 100 - can't you be more specific?)

I find it strange that there are a few people on this Forum that just can't leave well enough alone. I will never defend brother Ruckman for any wrong doing or any "foul" language that he may use, however, I know the man and he isn't what you make him out to be (and you don't know him).

Jeff 04-02-2008 06:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by George (Post 2822)
Did you read my words? "what I get out of your words". It's not "what you "get out of my words" - It's - what did I say? I never once said (or intimated) "that it's alright to criticize those who don't agree with you" No, not once! Please don't put words in my mouth.

Yes I read your words, and your words betray you. That was my point. Much speaking doesn't change things. On your say so we're not supposed to give our views on Dr. Ruckman if they're not positive.

Using your arguments I can't form a view on Jeremiah Wright, or say anything against him. So much for free and open discussions if you have your say.

Renee 04-02-2008 06:34 PM

[QUOTE=Jeff;2829]Yes I read your words, and your words betray you. That was my point. Much speaking doesn't change things. On your say so we're not supposed to give our views on Dr. Ruckman if they're not positive.

Jeff explain. How doeas George's words betray him? I do not understand.

ziggy2sound4u 04-02-2008 06:34 PM

George,
I call upon you to read the Word of God (AV1611).
There are SPECIFIC commands by God on Christian conduct and appearances.

“Be not deceived; evil communications corrupt good manners.” (I Cor. 15:33)

“Abstain from all appearance of evil.” (I Thess. 5:22)

"If any man among you seem to be religious, and bridleth not his own tongue, but deceiveth his own heart, this man's religion is vain." (James 1:26)

When Dr. Ruckman uses such crude and vulgar language against his enemies (some of whom are brothers and sisters), he is going against the Word of God.

I humbly and prayerfully submit this.

browilder61 04-02-2008 06:51 PM

These people that "slander" Dr. Ruckman are just as bad as they say he is. No one who believes that the King James Bible, any edition, is the scripture given by inspiration of God, will not make Dr. Ruckman an issue, because Dr. Ruckman is not the key to believing that God perfectly preserved His words. Those that cannot seperate Ruckman from this issue have an incurable disease called "Ruckmanitis", and instead of studying and approaching the Bible with a humble mind, and a believing heart, study it with their mind already made up. Back in 2000 when I was stationed in San Antonio, I got a chance to personally meet Dr. Ruckman at a church there. He was quite gentlemenly, and short. About a month previous to that, my pastor at the time who also didn't like Dr. Ruckman, blasted him from the pulpit at the spur of the moment. He was doing a mini-series on Bible versions. He made the comment " I don't believe the King James flew down from heaven, and if you 'follow Peter Ruckman', this is what he believes, and he twists the scriptures to make them fit what he believes". No "twisted scriptures" given. The pastor was quite indignant and red above the collar when he blasted that statement over the pulpit. I'd say about 90% of the congregation at the time, didn't even know who Ruckman was. Now how fair do you think that is? Why even mention Ruckman's name when teaching a series on Bible versions in the first place, and put a negative thought in peoples head towards someone who they never met or heard of? After the service, I asked what was up with the Ruckman thing, and he said "well, he was married 3 times, and slanders good men, and -and, that's just not right". So, I wrote Dr. Ruckman about these charges, he wrote back and said in short, "You're pastor is a liar, I never have, or will, recommend divorce to anyone, even when there is scriptural grounds, as far as what people have heard about my personal life, give them this book, if they think that was something, wait til they get a load of this, some people just shoot off their mouths and think about it later". He sent me a copy of his autobiography The Full Cup, a 12.00 book free of charge. When the Holy Spirit showed me that the KJB is the perfect, infallible words of God, I never heard of Dr. Ruckman, like nearly 95% percent of every congregation he's preached at. I had a book at the time that used him in the bibliography, but I just glanced over it like the other names listed. "Like minded in beliefs"? Over and over you will read Dr. Ruckman admonishing to not believe a word he's saying until you look up all of the references and cross reference for yourself. Expecting you to be "like-minded" with him is the last thing he expects anyone to do. Who cares what Jeff or anyone like-minded thinks about Dr. Ruckman, go on and have your opinion, its a free country. I can care less if you want to label a man or woman that stands on the Book, a "Ruckmanite". Anyone who has taken the abuse he has over the years and still hasn't faltered, and has a great burden for souls, so many believers faith in the KJB 1611 being restored, and personally takes time out for people, deserves big "ups" as far as I'm concerned. You don't have to agree with him on everything or anything, and he's certainly not above criticism. Why don't you write him concerning his "wacky" and "heretical" doctrines? What are you offering in replace of them?

ziggy2sound4u 04-02-2008 07:00 PM

"These people that "slander" Dr. Ruckman are just as bad as they say he is."
Who sayeth that anyone slanders Dr. Ruckman.
His use of foul and abusive language at both heretics and fellow believers is well known.
That is fact, not slander.

Gord 04-02-2008 07:02 PM

I have followed this and other posts on Dr. Ruckman, and even read his monthly publication, what puzzles me most of all is where does his humour or anything in this post talking about our opinions of him, glorify God, or lift up our Lord and saviour?????????
What really comes to my mind first is a quote from the Lord, "Mt 23:15 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites!".
Sorry, but as a new Christian this is what I take away from what I read hear.

ziggy2sound4u 04-02-2008 07:15 PM

Brother Gord,

"These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, AND SEARCHED THE SCRIPTURES DAILY, WHETHER THOSE THINGS WERE SO".(Acts 17:11)

Search your Bible(KJV).

If Dr. Ruckman is breaking God's commandments, it is up to fellow believers to warn of such, saving others from a corrupting influence (“Your glorying is not good. Know ye not that a little leaven leaveneth the whole lump?" I Cor. 5:6)

Obeying God's Word is glorifying God!

"If ye love me, keep my commandments." (John 14:15)

Jeff 04-02-2008 07:26 PM

[QUOTE=Renee;2831]
Quote:

Originally Posted by Jeff (Post 2829)
Yes I read your words, and your words betray you. That was my point. Much speaking doesn't change things. On your say so we're not supposed to give our views on Dr. Ruckman if they're not positive.

Jeff explain. How doeas George's words betray him? I do not understand.

I'll ask you the same question George asked me, as impertinent as it may be; did you read his words? He is clearly quick to jump on those who dare to even question Dr. Ruckman. George feels free to criticize those who disagree with him, but no one else should have the same right. Why do you think he didn't attack Pbiwolski for this quote that sarted this new round:
Quote:

Gentlemen, have you overlooked that Dr. Ruckman ends all of his "abusive" remarks with the "and I say that with charity, of course!?!"
Jerry's response to this was justified, yet Jerry is the one accused of bringing this subject back up.


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