AV1611 Bible Forum Archive

AV1611 Bible Forum Archive (https://av1611.com/forums/index.php)
-   Doctrine (https://av1611.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=4)
-   -   Are you a Dispensationalist? (https://av1611.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1218)

Greektim 05-04-2009 04:10 PM

Are you a Dispensationalist?
 
Just trying to get the lay of the land...

So where do you fall into hermeneutical and theological systems?

Samuel 05-04-2009 04:37 PM

I can't say I am committed fully to either despensation, or covenant theologies. :)

Bro. Parrish 05-04-2009 04:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Greektim (Post 19154)
Just trying to get the lay of the land...

So where do you fall into hermeneutical and theological systems?

Right now I'm using Apple's OS 10.5.3 a.k.a. "Leopard." :)

Luke 05-04-2009 04:50 PM

Yes

...


End of thread I guess :P



I like how Chafer differentiates between Covenant theology and Dispensationalism

"As traced by Covenant theologians, the death of Christ is given a place of large significance but His resurrection is accounted as little more than something for His own personal convenience, His necessary return from the sphere of death back to the place which He occupied before. In other words, as viewed by Covenant theologians, there is practically no doctrinal significance to Christ's resurrection [and me identified with Him!] "
I would go on to add that while Covenant theologists make a big deal of being In Christ "before the foundation of the world", they neglect the fact that we are In Christ right now, and that the law has no power over a believer.

Chafer also wrote

"Covenantism, which has molded the major theological concepts for many generations, recognizes no distinction as to ages, therefore can allow for no distinctions between law and grace. This dominating attitude of Covenantism must account for the utter neglect of life-truth in all their works of theology.

No more representative theological dictum from the Covenant viewpoint has been formed than the Westminster Confession of Faith, which valuable and important document recognizes life-truth only to the point of imposing the Ten Commandments on Christians as their sole obligation, this in spite of the teachings of the Pauline Church Epistles which assert that the law was never given to Gentiles or Christians, and that the latter has been saved and delivered from it--actually dead to it (Gal. 2:19) "

tonybones2112 05-05-2009 12:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Greektim (Post 19154)
Just trying to get the lay of the land...

So where do you fall into hermeneutical and theological systems?

For practical theology, exigesis, and practice I am a Pauline Dispensationalist based on Ephesians 3:

Times Past: Genesis- Acts 28
But Now: Romans-Philemon
Ages To Come: Hebrews-Revelation

Within the But Now Age I rightly divide Paul into

Early Paul - "To the Jew first..." Acts 9- Acts 28
Mid Paul - But Now, "...neither Jew nor Gentile..." Acts Chapter 29
Late Paul - Ages To Come, wise masterbuilder who was the custodian who administered the transition from Gospel Of The Kingdom Of Heaven(Restored Isreal) which is the gospel committed to Peter, James, John, and the rest of the Twelve, into the Grace Age of today and on into the Tribulation, as Paul authored Hebrews, the first book of Tribulation doctrine, and was the most qualified to write it as a human oracle.

I don't follow Bullinger in the teaching that the Body began at Acts 28 and only Galatians, Ephesians, Philippians, and Colossians are applicable, but believe and teach that the Body began at Calvary, that we were grafted into the Body that was made manifest at Acts 2 that was scattered at Acts 7 and that water baptism, tongues, signs, wonders, miracles, healings, AKA "the signs of an apostle" ceased at the end of Acts 28.

I feel the dispensational teachings of Larken and Scofield are a very general guide and accept up to a point the teachings of Cornelius Stam of the Berean Bible Society yet I stop at his Calvinism, his reliance on multiple Bible versions and denial of the inspiration of vernacular translations, and his seeming crusade to uproot Baptist churches rather than applying doctrine, reproof, correction to the misapplied practice of OT Jewish water baptism.

The dispensational teachings and positions of Baker, Darby, and the Plymouth Brethren are unknown to me.

Grace and peace brother

Tony

Diligent 05-05-2009 09:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tonybones2112 (Post 19204)
The dispensational teachings and positions of Baker, Darby, and the Plymouth Brethren are unknown to me.

Just an FYI, if you are interested, your copy of SwordSearcher includes material that would fall under that heading by Darby, Morrish, and Mackintosh.

tonybones2112 05-05-2009 05:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Diligent (Post 19216)
Just an FYI, if you are interested, your copy of SwordSearcher includes material that would fall under that heading by Darby, Morrish, and Mackintosh.

Thank you for the heads up Brandon, I got my Darbys mixed up, and will delve into the books a little closer, right now it's all been the text of the KJV, I checked the maps out, this program rocks brother:)

Grace and peace

tony

tandy1650 05-14-2009 11:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tonybones2112 (Post 19204)
For practical theology, exigesis, and practice I am a Pauline Dispensationalist based on Ephesians 3:

Times Past: Genesis- Acts 28
But Now: Romans-Philemon
Ages To Come: Hebrews-Revelation

Within the But Now Age I rightly divide Paul into

Early Paul - "To the Jew first..." Acts 9- Acts 28
Mid Paul - But Now, "...neither Jew nor Gentile..." Acts Chapter 29
Late Paul - Ages To Come, wise masterbuilder who was the custodian who administered the transition from Gospel Of The Kingdom Of Heaven(Restored Isreal) which is the gospel committed to Peter, James, John, and the rest of the Twelve, into the Grace Age of today and on into the Tribulation, as Paul authored Hebrews, the first book of Tribulation doctrine, and was the most qualified to write it as a human oracle.

I don't follow Bullinger in the teaching that the Body began at Acts 28 and only Galatians, Ephesians, Philippians, and Colossians are applicable, but believe and teach that the Body began at Calvary, that we were grafted into the Body that was made manifest at Acts 2 that was scattered at Acts 7 and that water baptism, tongues, signs, wonders, miracles, healings, AKA "the signs of an apostle" ceased at the end of Acts 28.

I feel the dispensational teachings of Larken and Scofield are a very general guide and accept up to a point the teachings of Cornelius Stam of the Berean Bible Society yet I stop at his Calvinism, his reliance on multiple Bible versions and denial of the inspiration of vernacular translations, and his seeming crusade to uproot Baptist churches rather than applying doctrine, reproof, correction to the misapplied practice of OT Jewish water baptism.

The dispensational teachings and positions of Baker, Darby, and the Plymouth Brethren are unknown to me.

Grace and peace brother

Tony

Brother are you saying you reject the General Epistles as authoritative for the Church?

Luke 05-14-2009 02:42 PM

authoritative, no.. doctrinal, yes, devotional, no, spiritual, no.

tonybones2112 05-14-2009 05:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tandy1650 (Post 19794)
Brother are you saying you reject the General Epistles as authoritative for the Church?

Brother, I don;t "reject" anything. I will fight for the canonicity of Hebrews and I Peter as fervently as I will defend I Timothy 3:16 in the KJV.

These two books are just not written to me, they are God's program for the future, just as Leviticus was for Times Past.

Hebrews through Revelation is tribulation doctrine. All Scripture is profitable for doctrine, such as the OT understanding of Christ's High Priesthood with relation to Israel and John the Baptist found in Hebrews that we will soon be discussing in the water baptism thread and the doctrines of Christ's ministry to Israel and Deity as found in the Four Gospels are examples, but my instructions are through Paul in Romans through Philemon. Peter, James, and John are NOT my apostles. What God is doing today is found in Paul's works and the contrasts can be better understood by getting out of Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John and getting into Galatians, Ephesians, Philippians, and Colossians:

Galatians 2:1 Then fourteen years after I went up again to Jerusalem with Barnabas, and took Titus with me also.
2 And I went up by revelation, and communicated unto them that gospel which I preach among the Gentiles, but privately to them which were of reputation, lest by any means I should run, or had run, in vain.
3 But neither Titus, who was with me, being a Greek, was compelled to be circumcised:
4 And that because of false brethren unawares brought in, who came in privily to spy out our liberty which we have in Christ Jesus, that they might bring us into bondage:
5 To whom we gave place by subjection, no, not for an hour; that the truth of the gospel might continue with you.
6 But of these who seemed to be somewhat, (whatsoever they were, it maketh no matter to me: God accepteth no manís person:) for they who seemed to be somewhat in conference added nothing to me:
7 But contrariwise, when they saw that the gospel of the uncircumcision was committed unto me, as the gospel of the circumcision was unto Peter;
8 (For he that wrought effectually in Peter to the apostleship of the circumcision, the same was mighty in me toward the Gentiles:)
9 And when James, Cephas, and John, who seemed to be pillars, perceived the grace that was given unto me, they gave to me and Barnabas the right hands of fellowship; that we should go unto the heathen, and they unto the circumcision.

Ane example of the contrasts between Paul's ministry and the ministry of the Twelve under Peter is found in the blotting out of sins:

Israel's sins will not be blotted out until the beginning of the Millenium:

Ac 3:19 Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord;

Your and my sins are forgiven now:

Ro 4:7 Saying, Blessed are they whose iniquities are forgiven, and whose sins are covered.
Eph 1:7 In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace;
Col 1:14 In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins:
Col 2:13 And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;

Tandy, 25 years ago I was a saved man who was afraid of the Bible, I didn't understand it. It took Pastor Richard Jordan 30 minutes to show me what God did yesterday, what He is doing today, what He will do in the future. In those 25, almost 26 years, I have not had one single doubt about the Bible.

I'm certainly not the apostle Paul, but I understand the man. If ever there was a good candidate for the anti-Christ outside of Judas Iscariot, it was Paul. 25 years ago I was dispensational teaching's worst enemy, as Paul was to Christianity. What changed my heart about dispensational teaching is that God is the Author of it, not Darby, Stam, nor Bullinger.

Grace and peace brother

Tony


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 05:53 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions Inc.

Website © AV1611.Com.
Posts represent only the opinions of users of this forum and do not necessarily represent the opinions of the webmaster.

Software for Believing Bible Study