About David Cloud
 

What should I know about this man and his site http://www.wayoflife.org ? I found my churches name on his list and then read his 'questionaire' which attacks a teacher I'm fond of; that is PSR. What is this mans problem with Ruckman? Is there more to his anti-Ruckman stance that I should know about?

Peace and Love,
Stephen

Cloud hates Ruckman and belittles him and ridicules him. He also lies about him and takes his quotes out of context to make it look like he believes evil things that he does not. He's also overly concerned about externals...women wearing pants is taught as a definite sin. My opinion is that David Cloud is extremely Pharisaical. The man annoys me lol. Many Fundamentalists look up to him almost like he is a god (in my opinion) and that is why I personally see him as a Fundamentalist pope...since many take what he believes and writes to be gospel.

Here is a link to something that I wrote on Vince's blog about Cloud and the pants on women thing. I addressed this because I couldn't believe the question would even be considered as it had an obvious answer. I will dig up the stuff he says about Ruckman if I have time so that you can see it for yourself, but with two small boys I wouldn't guarantee it. But I'm sure Vince or Kathie knows exactly where his articles about Ruckman are.

I only show you this to show you the logic of the man you are dealing with.

http://wordofaking.blogspot.com/2008...ariseeism.html

Here is a good start to what Cloud has to say about Ruckman. He links to other articles that he has written at the bottom.

http://www.wayoflife.org/articles/ruckman.htm

I agree with Katy-Anne that his attitude in his articles tends to be pretty annoying. Really, the only ones I've read are the Ruckman ones, something about women and pants, and the article about Myspace (which I really think is ridiculous... Myspace isn't evil, but just like any other social network, you can get in trouble on there if you're looking for trouble).

I heard from another friend that met David Cloud in real life that he's actually a pretty nice guy. So, I'll give him the benefit of the doubt on that.

I just don't pay much attention to his articles because of his attitude. :)

David Cloud, Ruckman, John MacArthur and many more.

Why is so much energy spent trying to prove, or disprove our likes and dislikes for these men as personal attacks?

(bold is my emphasis)

Why would we not spend some of that negative energy using our Gift from God glorifying HIM and edifying each other through his Holy Spirit? Discerning and sharing is word to teach each other and lift HIM up in praise and glory.

This and other forums of expression would then become another means to worship HIM rather then condemnation pits of men and eventually it works into each other.???

He's a professional watchdog: his entire ministry, at least on the Internet, consists of criticizing anyone who does or says anything that displeases him. He devotes particular attention to: "modest apparel," Ruckman (against whom he seems to have a personal grudge), the Southern Baptist Convention, Gail Riplinger, Independent Baptists, contemporary Christian music, and the charismatics. To me, he is an annoying, self-righteous blowhard, but sometimes he provides good information.

He's written extensively in defense of the King James Bible, but his books are kinda pricey. To his credit, he does meticulous research.

The worst thing I know about him: when a prison inmate (with whom I am personally acquainted) wrote him a long, heartfelt letter, and asked for a reply, Cloud didn't even bother to respond; didn't even put the guy on his mailing list. Most men of God jump at the chance to communicate with prisoners.

The best thing I know about him: he's written an excellent book, The Pentecostal-Charismatic Movements: Their History and Error. I'd highly recommend it.

His strange obsession with women's apparel is something fairly recent: he has literally written a book instructing women how to dress. Perhaps that's why he's too busy to answer mail from prisoners: anyway, jailbirds can't buy very many books.....

As a young Christian, I was greatly blessed by his ministry, and found it a sure way to stay out of harm's way. Generally, whenever I was about to read a new book, or heard about some preacher, I would generally type in the preachers name followed by "wayoflife" into google, and see what came up. As VD said, his ministry is that of a watchdog, which is a neccesary ministry, but he does attack his own too much, usually over semantics.

He never replied to me either when I sent him a very long email over struggling with certain things in my life. Having said that, a lot of his articles are well done and documented.

Luke. My beloved brother. My initials are not "VD," thank you very much.....

good post! :)

Haha, I just noticed that. All this time, I have been thinking.. how can I shorten Vendetta Ride to something smaller... without having it sound like disease. I guess VR will do. I have no idea why I thought the initials were VD. Sorry Brother.

David Cloud has those who find his work very worthwhile and may even hang on his every word, and those who literally hate him. Peter Ruckman has those who find his work very worthwhile and may even hang on his every word, and those who literally hate him. Interestingly, the two men are adversarial with each other and the followers of one are often the haters of the other. What is sad is that both men have much beneficial material. If we examined the materials written by the both of them objectively without knowing about the authors themselves, most of us who are KJBO would be in nearly 100% agreement with either one.

I will openly admit my appreciation of the work of David Cloud. I have several of his books (and, no, they are not overpriced) and they have a great deal of valuable content. I will also openly admit that I keep Dr. Ruckman at a distance, not because of Cloud's comments, but primarily because of some of Dr. Ruckman's disciples' attitudes.

Just a note about emails to David. He has a weekly email newsletter. In one of the issues, he stated that he rarely responds to emails. He apparently receives a very large amount of mail, and so he has made a choice not to respond as a rule. He should be granted that right.

My one and only (odd) :confused:, exchange with Mr. Cloud, given my beliefs about the AV, it was in God's perfect plan to "use" the English (Anglican) Church, to complete THE ENGLISH Bible for English speaking people. (I am NOT saying the Anglican church is perfect AT ALL, then or now, you can find heretics in ANY branch of the Lord's Church, the Anglican Church "happened" to be in the right place at the right time in History and with the Holy Ghost an institute, to carry out this work: ANY-WHO, I was actually writing to both applaud and ask for clarification on an article (there are a few decent ones), well, he found I was Anglican, and began an attack (he attacks a LOT of people). NOTE: I NEVER said the Anglican Church "wrote" the AV. I stated that God simply used that branch of the Church....God has used individuals and groups of people to carry out His Divine will throughout History, who would argue that...) in any event, I was shoved aside after a few cordial emails on my part....strange...

His rights are not in question. But my friend in prison did not write him an e-mail; he wrote him a two-page, single-spaced, typewritten letter, and sent it snail mail. Prison inmates don't have Internet access.

Please understand that I am not supporting David's lack of communication, I am simply indicating that he has explained his reasons. Interestingly, one of his emails this week addressed this very issue.

David Cloud and Peter Ruckman both have similar problems. They both are at the forefront of the KJB fight and therefore draw heavy fire from all sides. They both are very likely overwhelmed with incoming letters, electronic and otherwise. David estimated that he could spend 4 hours a day just responding to emails. And to top it all, both of them have hair-trigger tempers and sharp tongues/pens. Neither shows much in the way of humility when challenged.

That's interesting, since Cloud's beef with Ruckman is Ruckman's "Bad Attitude" and "Temper"

LOL, why doesn't this suprise me. :D

Peace and Love,
Stephen

After thinking about brother Cloud and his ministry I've decided to subscribe to his newsletter. If his view that women shouldn't wear pants is the only real complaint that people have against him, then I can deal with that (I for one agree with him on this). I can also deal with his complaints against Ruckman. I love Ruckman and will continue to be a student of his writtings, but Ruckman isn't free of undesirable qualities, so his objections to the man aren't really any sort of suprise. The only thing I can find out about brother Cloud that I'm not very fond of is that his views on the AV1611 aren't as staunch as mine are. I agree 100% with Ruckman when it comes to the KJV. Anywho, I think I will add some Cloud books to my library when the funds permit, and I'll share my thoughts on his them when I get to that point.

Peace and Love,
Stephen

Dr. Cloud, along with Dr. Waite and others, believe that the King James Bible is the only acceptable English Bible, not because they believe the Book itself has authority, but that it derives its authority from (in Cloud's case) the Textus Receptus, and in Waite's case, the "Divine Originals."

I've refrained from getting involved because of past disagreements with those that hold strongly with him and his teachings; on the last board I got banned from (last in a long line ;) ), many of the people firmly believed basically everything the man wrote and said, so it was difficult to have a truly Biblical discussion since they always posted stupid links to his articles or outright pasted them, which is verboten in the header on every page of his site. Basically Bro. Cloud seems to suffer from a touch of arrogance, as he, like others on the aforementioned board, tend to feel like they have all the doctrine laid out and settled, and as such refuse to contemplate the possibility that they are wrong on something. Whether it's his obsession with the attire of women (why's he looking in the first place?!?) or his insistence that the King James is simply an "edition of the TR," he seems to simply refuse to entertain the concept that he could be wrong. Add that to the fact that he outright lies about Dr. Ruckman, and goes out of his way to slander him, as well as takes Doc's words out of context to further discredit him, and you can see why I don't put much stock in what he says, though I don't go out of my way to attack him.

Yeah, I'm not fond of what I've read on his page in regards to Ruckman. Like I said previously Ruckman isn't immune to character defaults, but I don't agree with bearing false witness against any of the brethren, and if Cloud does this it is unacceptable.

I'm going to hold off on commenting on this "why's he looking in the first place?!?"....

Peace and Love,
Stephen

I don't know that I've ever met or read behind anyone that I agreed 100% with everything they say. I know folks get upset with Cloud over some of his remarks (i.e. Ruckman), but overall he has some very helpful material on his website particularly concerning the defense of the KJV and ecumenism.

Actually, brother, he lays on the divorce stuff pretty heavily, too. He takes the position that Ruckman is not qualified for the ministry, which, of course, is none of his business.

Re: About David Cloud
 

Agreed brother,

Back in April and May (of this year) the subject about David Cloud's and Peter Ruckman's "feud" came up, and was dealt with on several Threads. I think that you have been very "fair & balanced" in your estimation of the man and his work.

I posted this statement from Cloud's site at that time and I believe it is appropriate to re-post it again.

I never got a satisfactory answer from his followers and supporters then and I don't expect to ever get one! :lol:

Yeah, this is my issue with him as well. He thinks the Scriptures are preserved in the greek (even though he might not use those exact words) and he says that he isn't against updating and or translated differently. What on earth does that mean anyways? If there are no errors in the KJB why would it need to be updated? My goodness, this is just text book definition madness!

For Jesus' sake,
Stephen