What's good for the goose.....
 

Until a few weeks ago, I did not know of the FFF (Fighting Fundamental Forums). But I saw it mentioned quite a few times, especially in Tony's posts, so I asked about it. Since that time I have visited a few times a week to see what goes on there.

There are quite a few there that take great interest in this site. And most do not care for us KJVO's. Imagine that. :)

Anyway, since a few there seemed almost obsessed with spying on this site, I figured what's good for the goose is good for the gander.

This fellow especially despises us here. I believe he was banned some time ago. Poor fellow, can't stay away.

http://www.fundamentalforums.com/bib...-the-kjvo.html

Now, I posted this as a joke really. When he comes a spyin' he will see his own posts. :pound:

Ah sure just leave them there to their manuscripts and intellect, vain swelling words and fair speeches. They really do appear to hate anyone that submits themselves to a final authority, and hate is not too strong a word some of those posts are poisonous.

Romans 3:18 There is no fear of God before their eyes.

I should have minded my own business. I went back over there and freesundayschoollessons wants me to come debate him.

So, I registered, I do at least owe him an answer, but I am not going to get entangled over there, I belonged to another "bible-believeing" forum that had many anti-KJVOs awhile back and discovered that we are simply in different worlds. They cannot understand us, just as we cannot understand them.

I have to wait until I have permission to post.

Well Winman, I checked out that thread (first time ever there) and it really is a joke.
They actually think Bible-believers don't have a standard as to what rightly dividing means? Its dispensationalism in a nutshell.

I dunno about that, every KJB believing 'apologist' (as if its an apology!) I've ever read or heard has a very accurate understanding of what's going on in the minds of the Bible-denying, correcting and twisting apostates. Its them that can't come to an understanding of this truth. It's quote sad. Even the ones that try to debate their view, are consistantly shutdown with hard evidence, yet they still just can't see it. Just like an evolutionist utterly incapable of properly assesing the hard evidence because of their presupposition. Its a mental block that began in the heart.

I was kind of appaled to see the user sub-titles on FFF: Fundamental Master? Fundamental POPE !!!???!!!
I was also mildy surprised to see people we 'know' over there, posting with unbriddled despising of the Holy Bible. I won't even bother reading any of the rest of the forum. If I taste dung once, I really don't need to keep sampling in case it gets any better, and I've had my share of the humanist dung over and over.

Isn't anyone else around here thinking a few bannings are in order, so the brethren can get back to edifying?

I remember going there a few years back.

At the time, I thought it had been invaded by unbelievers or something. I was so naive to think that all fundamental baptists believed the book.

About a year ago I realised that the FFF was full of Christians...

I got a water baptism thread takes a lot of time here, plus my triple inspiration series and other messages, soon as I get some time I'm gonna show Barry never to debate with a "KJVO": you both get bloody and the "KJVO" likes it.

Grace and peace

Tony

I used to love it too.. I've become a bit rusty lately. Perhaps I should sharpen my sword (well, it doesn't need to be sharpened. It already is the sharpest one out there, even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and the joints and marrow. I just need to unsheathe it a bit more!)

Proclaiming the perfection of the KJB was a joy! I want that back Brother.

Brother, you have to crucify the flesh with it's afflictions. and contend for the faith with something they cannot counter: Scripture. Examine all the Scriptures pertaining to what a prophet is. A prophet is not someone who merely prognosticates, he is not a fortune teller, a prophet came and said, Thus saith the Lord. A prophet speaks the word of God. Paul said prophecies shall cease, yes. But when Luke declares, It is written, Brother Luke is no different than Jeremiah or Ezekiel.

In this Grace Age, the Church Age, God is not going to make His Presence known as He did in OT times, because they were under a faith/works program. In this Age Paul says we walk by faith, not by sight. If God sets up a pillar of smoke in Jerusalem, where is the "faith"? That is sight, and not by 100 percent faith. I want to transpose this over to "manuscript evidence" for you.

Jesus told the Jews:

Joh 5:46 For had ye believed Moses, ye would have believed me: for he wrote of me.
47 But if ye believe not his writings, how shall ye believe my words?

Barry over in FFF has his pet fetish as being Psalms 12 and it's promise by God to preserve His words. If he doesn't believe the Scripture promise of preservation, then were John W. Burgon or King David to rise from the dead and demonstrate for him the accuracy of the reading of the verse, is he going to believe it? I studied Greek and Hebrew for 7 years which by and large has been a waste of time. I can demonstrate the "nu- epithent" rule of Hebrew grammar of Gensenius to him, Barry will just jump to and appeal to some back-alley Hebrew grammarian to impeach Psalms 12 to conform to the corrupt LXX reading written in the 4th century AD, not 250 BC, which is actually Vaticanus.

Ps 12:6 (11:6) The oracles of the Lord are pure oracles; as silver tried in the fire, proved in a {1} furnace of earth, purified seven times. {1) Gr. the earth}
7 (11:7) Thou, O Lord, shalt keep us, and shalt preserve us, from this generation, and for ever.("LXX" Vaticanus)

I guess there are some immortal Jews out there somewhere, eh brother? Or is immortality in HIM and in His words?

I Tim. 6:14 That thou keep this commandment without spot, unrebukeable, until the appearing of our Lord Jesus Christ:
15 Which in his times he shall shew, who is the blessed and only Potentate, the King of kings, and Lord of lords;
16 Who only hath immortality, dwelling in the light which no man can approach unto; whom no man hath seen, nor can see: to whom be honour and power everlasting. Amen.

Mt 24:35 Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away.
Mr 13:31 Heaven and earth shall pass away: but my words shall not pass away.
Lu 21:33 Heaven and earth shall pass away: but my words shall not pass away.

Luke, these people want to win arguments, to reinforce their own deflated egos, and in any discussion with them it boils down to My Scholars and Lexicon vs Your Scholars and Lexicon.

They can't prove their position that God never gave us all the counsel of God from Scripture.

John R. Rice tried, in his book, Our God-Burped Babble, The Original Manuscripts, he tried to prove that "only the original manuscripts were inspired" by quoting II Tim. 3:16 from the KJV, the very book he said has "mistakes" in it! Here are Rice's exact words:

"There Are, Then, No Errors In The Original Word Of God,"

How does he know, since he never saw it? Yea, hath God said?

How does Barry know Ps. 12 is "mistranslated", since he is not a Hebrew grammarian. I am. What Dr. Robert Gromaki taught me in Hebrew grammar was not error.

You need to look up and study the ministry, translation work, and scholarship of John Hinton. John lives just 65 miles from me, he is out of Columbus Ohio here in the USA.

They don't believe Burgon, Hills, they are trying now, the Junior Jesuit Kutilek, to impeach David Otis Fuller because Fuller quoted and used the work of some alleged SDA. They don't believe the Scriptures either, so why talk to them?

Ezekiel 2:1 And he said unto me, Son of man, stand upon thy feet, and I will speak unto thee.
2 And the spirit entered into me when he spake unto me, and set me upon my feet, that I heard him that spake unto me.
3 And he said unto me, Son of man, I send thee to the children of Israel, to a rebellious nation that hath rebelled against me: they and their fathers have transgressed against me, even unto this very day.
4 For they are impudent children and stiffhearted. I do send thee unto them; and thou shalt say unto them, Thus saith the Lord GOD.
5 And they, whether they will hear, or whether they will forbear, (for they are a rebellious house,) yet shall know that there hath been a prophet among them.

Forget manuscript evidence, the manuscript evidence of the KJV translators, Burgon, Hills, Will Kinney, John Hinton and believing scholars mean nothing to them. They choose Westcott and Hort's Sophist, Gnostic method. They study this forum, they read all the KJV websites, they've read all of Burgon and Hills. Give them one thing they never read:

The Scriptures.

That's all I give them. That's all I give in the water baptism thread here, regardless of the objections to it. The Scripture in my Triple Inspiration series is inspired, not me. And Luke, all the days of your life remember what I said in that series and never forget:

Those who attack the words of God the most are the ones who use it the least.

Brother, be baptized in the washing of regeneration, give your body a living sacrifice to the ministry of reconciliation and ambassadorship for Christ, remember, it is our reasonable service. His yoke is light, and no good work we do is done with repentance that we ever volunteered for His Army.

Grace and peace brother Luke, my friend.

Tony

I hope some of you make your way over there to have a discussion bathed in truth and seasoned with salt.

How about this, we here on this forum just so happen to believe that God has preserved his word in the KJB , we live by faith and not by sight, you guys on the other hand believe there is no pure inerrant bible that God has left on this earth, the complete counsel of God, but his word is spread between texts and different versions, your prerogative.
Why don't you stay on your forum and discuss your textual beliefs and theology and use your fancy words I truthfully don't understand, I don't understand as much as you all do in regards to texts, Greek, Hebrew, my IQ is not high, I am a simple man and I do not take kindly to those of a Higher intellect coming here and telling me I am wrong for trusting that God preserved his word in the KJB, blinding me with your intellect and in all honesty making me feel unworthy to understand Gods word because I am not as smart as you all.
Why don't you stay on your own forum, not take on different identities on this forum. There is no profit in any of us going to your forum, your minds are made up, just as ours are made up that Gods word is the KJB and there is no profit in you being here. If this was a Church, would you come on in during a service and tell us we are all wrong? Some of you are really obsessed that we hold one book in our hands and accept it contains all of Gods words.
I thank the Lord we do have some learned men on this forum who can refute your never ending line of questions, I just do not see the fruit from any of you visiting this forum, you can call me unchristian all the day long but let me tell you this, coming to a "Bible Believing" forum using intellect, fair speech, humanistic reasoning and the deceitfulness pretending to be something or someone else and posing questions that cause division and strife is more unchristian than anything I may have said.

1 Timothy 6:3 If any man teach otherwise, and consent not to wholesome words, even the words of our Lord Jesus Christ, and to the doctrine which is according to godliness;
1 Timothy 6:4 He is proud, knowing nothing, but doting about questions and strifes of words, whereof cometh envy, strife, railings, evil surmisings,
1 Timothy 6:5 Perverse disputings of men of corrupt minds, and destitute of the truth, supposing that gain is godliness: from such withdraw thyself.

Stay on your own forum, If you do not believe that God has preserved his word in the KJB it is simple, no need for intellect, theology nor degrees to know that we DO and no amount of theological reasoning or intellect will ever change that, it is way beyond that, it is spiritual.

1 John 4:6 We are of God: he that knoweth God heareth us; he that is not of God heareth not us. Hereby know we the spirit of truth, and the spirit of error.

Your posts are fruitless, can you not see this? they only cause contention

Proverbs 22:10 Cast out the scorner, and contention shall go out; yea, strife and reproach shall cease.

Take the contention between you theologians and pursuers of "the Greek" and Hebrew and us "Bible believers" and depart from one another for there is NO PROFIT of you being here, neither is their any profit in any of us on your forum.

Acts 15:39 And the contention was so sharp between them, that they departed asunder one from the other: and so Barnabas took Mark, and sailed unto Cyprus;

Proverbs 25:17 Withdraw thy foot from thy neighbour's house; lest he be weary of thee, and so hate thee.

POTW

1 John 4:6 We are of God: he that knoweth God heareth us; he that is not of God heareth not us. Hereby know we the spirit of truth, and the spirit of error.

You hit the nail right on the head right there. Because they try to understand the scriptures through scholarship, instead of through faith and the Spirit of God, they are blinded and cannot understand.

1 Cor 2:14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

These folks got it all backwards. They want us to provide proof before they will believe, but the Bible says you must first believe before you can receive the things of the Spirit of God.

Yes Brother, I find it quite frightening how many will happily correct the Bible. Maybe these men believe that they are somehow amplifying Gods words, or expounding them, but they are unwise and deceived in their own conceit.
Every Major revival within the last 400 years has been through the KJB not from "The Greek" in fact God has used the KJB more than any other Bible in any other language.... period. The last revival from expounding the greek probably dates back to the 1st century which just strengthens my hold on the KJB as Gods preserved word for us ...today. The "Greek" does not belong in the pulpit.

But enough of them really, by carrying on we are only giving them stage space, lets get back to the edification of the Brethren through Gods word and ignore the "show offs".

1 Timothy 4:6-7 If thou put the brethren in remembrance of these things, thou shalt be a good minister of Jesus Christ, nourished up in the words of faith and of good doctrine, whereunto thou hast attained. But refuse profane and old wives' fables, and exercise thyself rather unto godliness.

Yes brother, the same salt Christ gave the moneylenders in the Temple, the generation of vipers known as Pharisees, Paul's salt to Hymenaeus, Alexander, Demas, the demon possessed girl of Acts 16, the Jews of Acts 28, the same salt I give any self-appointed holy ghost who would encompass heaven and earth to destroy the faith of any young person called to preach and teach the word of God, to make themselves Satan as Peter was to Christ in Matt. 16 and Mark 8. I don't go bearing olive branches and doves, but a sword, and they better be at least as Scripturally knowledgeable as the gift I begged God for. I sat in classrooms and saw a school replace God as the Authority on the Scriptures.

I don't know what all the responses in this forum has been to you as I have not followed every message you posted. I don't speak for everyone here, but from what I have seen I alone have accepted, even where we may disagree, you as sincere Tim and if I have said anything unbecoming to you, I apologize. But in my dealings with the self-appointed holy ghosts whom I do not accept 90 percent of them as being either sincere and honest, and where you follow along with me outside this forum in dealing with these Frauds, you will need the air conditioning turned up because hell has come to breakfast.

Grace and peace

Tony

When you take God's word, that Peter said was incorruptible, and try and judge it by evolutionary methods, you get Barry, FFF, and Catholic Churches.

Grace and peace Win

Tony

What does revival mean to Karl Barth while writing 40 years of gibberish while having an affair with his secretary? What does revival mean to Sword Of The Lord, if the revival is without their instigation and book tables? What is revival to James White, Doug Kutilek, Dave Hunt, Hal Lindsay, Daniel Wallace, or any other mercenary? You ever read any Frederick Forsythe, Steve? You know a mercenary will change his allegiance in the middle of a battle if the salary of the other side is better? Just like Gary Hudson and all the rest of the "ex-Ruckmanites" and "former KJVOs". They can't go on and preach Christ, or try to, from their "new" version but are like hardcore UFO enthusiasts: Nearly 99 percent of all "scientific" UFO investigators eventually wander off into the occult. Thus all the "formers" become Inquisitioners rather than edifiers.

So as far as my "ministry" goes they'll get a taste of their own medicine from a source they can't refute, but only undermine: The Scriptures. They are not the ones God wants, God wants the millions sitting on the sidelines watching and listening. The Frauds are in the same boat with Demas as far as I am concerned.

I've sat in classrooms and saw a school replace God as the Authority on the Scriptures with itself.

nu-epithants and Granville-Sharp means nothing to me, David Brainerd coughing his lungs up at the age of 26 witnessing to American Indians mean something to me.

Grace and peace to you brother, you have a good week.

Tony

Hey Brother

I am certainly resting assured that we have Brothers like yourself on the forum, Bibleprotector, Brandon, George, Will Kinney etc (don't feel left out if I never mentioned you, there are many that know a vast amount) who have some knowledge on these matters, I am new to manuscripts, history of texts, scribes, scholars and theologians from the 1st century until present but I know they all point to one Book and I have that on my lap.
I read Gary Hudson's 40 "unanswerable" questions and I also read the refutation of them which I thank the Lord for, these men come along and try and cast doubt, correct and malign those who Believe in one Book and the Book itself. I know from my point of view, If I was indeed blessed with a higher IQ I would spend my God given time in scripture and looking for evidence FOR the Bible, not against it.
God Bless those that have chosen this path, that God has given wisdom so his words can be Defended, not doubted.

Romans 12:14 Bless them which persecute you: bless, and curse not.

I think I'd recommend against the FFF. I've had civil discussions with people in their Bible Versions section, (yes, there are some over there who act Christlike), but regardless, it's all been fruitless. There has been no profit in it, at least for me. It's become to me mostly vain jangling. It wasn't what I'd call "edifying" by far, although I enjoyed talking with a few people.

I see nothing wrong with your IQ my friend. Faith and devotion is not based on IQ. I see men with 160 IQs are dumber that a sack of banjos Scripturally.

Grace and peace

Tony

Brother, I don't recommend everyone do things I do or have done. You don;t write for the people in the FFF forum, you write for the observers.

Grace and peace Paul

Tony

Hey Brother Tony, thanks for that. But what I also meant by that statement is that of course we don't NEED a high IQ to be spiritually discerned, the simplest of minds can be used for Gods glory through his Holy written word. Solomon was blessed with wisdom no man has ever matched or ever will, but what was his final position with God before he died? He led Israel into Idolatry, his wisdom made him "worldly" and his heart was turned away from God by his wives.

1 Kings 4:29 And God gave Solomon wisdom and understanding exceeding much, and largeness of heart, even as the sand that is on the sea shore.

1 Kings 10:23 So king Solomon exceeded all the kings of the earth for riches and for wisdom.

God Gives him wisdom beyond measure of any man that was to walk the earth (except the Lord Jesus Christ)

Proverbs 1:2 To know wisdom and instruction; to perceive the words of understanding;

He acknowledges and exclaims! That God is the one behind his wisdom

Proverbs 2:6 For the LORD giveth wisdom: out of his mouth cometh knowledge and understanding.

Proverbs 2:7 He layeth up sound wisdom for the righteous: he is a buckler to them that walk uprightly.

Solomon also realises that to gain wisdom, a healthy FEAR of the Lord must be understood

Proverbs 9:10 The fear of the LORD is the beginning of wisdom: and the knowledge of the holy is understanding.

Proverbs 15:33 The fear of the LORD is the instruction of wisdom; and before honour is humility.

My point is this
Solomon IN ALL HIS WISDOM ended his days with his heart "turned unto other gods" and before a righteous God, his heart was NOT perfect.

1 Kings 11:4 For it came to pass, when Solomon was old, that his wives turned away his heart after other gods: and his heart was not perfect with the LORD his God, as was the heart of David his father.

Whats a sad picture that is, this man, blessed with so much wisdom and understanding it turned him AWAY from God. Now I truly do believe that Solomon was of course saved, we only have to read Ecclesiastes which is a beautiful book, but his "wisdom" was his downfall. The end of the Book of Ecclesiastes reads.... (Bold emphasis)

Ecclesiastes 12:8-14 Vanity of vanities, saith the preacher; all is vanity. And moreover, because the preacher was wise, he still taught the people knowledge; yea, he gave good heed, and sought out, and set in order many proverbs. The preacher sought to find out acceptable words: and that which was written was upright, even words of truth. The words of the wise are as goads, and as nails fastened by the masters of assemblies, which are given from one shepherd. And further, by these, my son, be admonished: of making many books there is no end; and much study is a weariness of the flesh. Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter: Fear God, and keep his commandments: for this is the whole duty of man. For God shall bring every work into judgment, with every secret thing, whether it be good, or whether it be evil.

:amen:

1Co 1:27 But God hath chosen the foolish things of the world to confound the wise; and God hath chosen the weak things of the world to confound the things which are mighty;

Always remember the words of Bob Jones Sr.: You and God constitute a majority.

Grace and peace brother

Tony

Good words! I try to remember that whenever I have to do something far beyond my own ability and talent. I have been truly amazed at how much God can do with so little!

Same here brother. When we reach that limit, turn it over to Him, as brother Tim's signature states, when I rely on Him, He is always reliable.

Grace and peace to you

Tony