A question about reading and study plans...
 

Forgive me if this topic is discussed elsewhere, but I generally access this site from my phone, which makes it difficult to do searches. Anyway, I want to know how to get started reading and studying the Bible. I'm 28 and, as yet, have not read through the Bible, nor have I read it with any consistincy. I WANT to read the word. I want to study. I just don't know where to even start. Some say keep a notebook. Some say mark your Bibles. What do I mark? Of what do I take notes? How much do I read a day. Where in the Bible do I start? How much should I study. Sorry if these questions seem dumb, but, despite having grown up in a kjv church, I feel lost!

Can I ask this question of you Buzz. please don't be offended I just want to see your heart

Why do you want to read and study the Bible?

Here is a link to another thread from George that gives some info on study.
http://av1611.com/forums/showthread.php?t=320

buzzoff1031,

There are no hard fast "rules" as to where you should start to read the Bible. I recommend starting at Psalms, Proverbs, and Ecclesiastes; and then after reading through Psalms, Proverbs, and Ecclesiastes several times, I would recommend starting with the Gospel of John in the New Testament, and then read through the Apostle Paul's "Epistles" (Letters) Romans - Philemon.

You should have a Concordance (to look up the English words only - never mind the Hebrew & the Greek "definitions") an electronic Concordance (SwordSearcher) is far faster and more convenient than a book.

Read slowly and take your time. I recommend that you DON'T mark your Bible, especially when you are just starting out. You will end up with marks, cross references, and notes that you may regret later on. Instead get some letter size yellow note pads and write down any questions, comments, or cross references that you think are appropriate and check them out with the Concordance.

I have some "guidelines" on how to study the Bible at this link: http://av1611.com/forums/showpost.ph...7&postcount=10

I also have a little longer study on "How To Study The Bible" on my web site http://www.thywordistruthkjv.com/.

At some point you will have to find a Bible believing church where you can not only receive instruction, but where you can worship God together with born again brethren, and where you can fellowship together with them. A Christian without a Bible believing church is like a "fish out of water"; God instituted the church to preach the Gospel; instruct the brethren; and to meet the needs of His children (born again saints).

From reading your "Threads" & "Posts" you sound like a very confused young man with a lot of serious problems. Those of us on this Forum can only do so much for you (we aren't a church). You need some personal counseling (Biblical "counseling" - NOT psychological "counseling") from a genuine Bible believing man (or men) who can meet with you "face to face" and try to help you iron out your problems and answer some of your many questions.

You need to establish some "stability" in your life, and you need to get "rooted" in the word of God - instead of being "carried about with every wind of doctrine". [Ephesians 4:14 That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive;]

No one can live your life for you, and it's impossible for us to know how to advise you, when we know so little about you and your situation. But this one thing I do know - you have got to determine in your heart to seek out God and His Holy word, and if you are not sincere, I can guarantee you that God is not going to give you very much discernment or understanding of His Holy word.

To be honest with you - I am "puzzled" by your Threads & Posts. I have noticed on several occasions (by your comments) you seem to know more about the Bible - or should I say "bibles" (Old Scofield, the New Spirit-Filled Life Bible, the Evidence Bible, The Student Bible, and Strong's & Vines, etc.) than you are leading us to believe. In the Thread on "Lordship Salvation" In your Post #10 - you demonstrate "more familiarity" with the Gospel of John than you should have, if you haven't read the Bible very much.

I suspect that you are being deceptive, and may not be who or what you portray yourself to be. If you are "playing" with us and "leading us on", I would advise you to think twice about what you are doing. And if you are not "leading us on", you need help - more help than we can give. In either case, after 7 "Threads" & 42 "Posts", it's obvious to me that unless you determine in your heart to seek the Lord and turn away from the chaos and confusion in your life, there is very little I can do for you other than pray. :(

Proverbs 26:18 As a mad man who casteth firebrands, arrows, and death,
19 So is the man that deceiveth his neighbour, and saith, Am not I in sport?

I recently bought the book "The Next Step" by Jack Chick. I wish I had bought it when I first got saved.

It has a bible reading plan in it.

I have been following along quite faithfully

5 Chapters a day

One history (Genesis - Ezra)
One poetic (Job - Ecclesiastes)
One Prophetic (Isaiah - Malachi)
One Biography (Matthew - Acts)
One Pauline Epistle (Romans - Philemon)
One General (Hebrews - Revelation) - I added this one in myself so I would read more NT stuff

I also highlight verses that stand out with color coded pencils

Red/Orange for a verse about salvation or blood
Blue for a verse about prayer
Green for a growth verse
Brown for a doctrinal

Brother George, I fully appreciate your honesty. But I assure you the questions I ask are genuine. The only knowledge I do have of the Bible is from growing up in the right kind of church. I grew in a kjv Bible believing and preaching church. I left the church as soon as I could and met my wife while in school, but in an unbelieving state. I spent a great deal of effort trying to get away from God and church, so she now wonders why I'm trying so hard to get back, and basically fights me every step of the way. I know I need more help and counseling than I can get on this forum, but I want a start. I need to start reading the word and ground myself in it, so I can stop wavering once and for all. I need to do this for myself, but I want to do it for my wife, so she can see that God, and faith in Christ, really does change lives. Again, thank you Brother George for your honesty, you and all the others have been a great help. I'd love to post on other topics, but I neve know what to say. thanks again!

Buzz you answered my question in post #5.

What I am about to say I say in love.

I don't think you were ever saved as you grew up in this KJV church. you may have knowledge but it must also be something of the heart not just the mind. you must come to a point of brokenness over all you are and have done up until this point. Your having a hard time with the Bible because you don't have the Holy Ghost indwelling you which happens at the moment someone really truly believes.

1) recognize you are a sinner in need of salvation 2) trust Jesus' work of the cross to save you and that only, 3) turn your life over to him. you may need to really go to Christ and seek him earnestly with not just your mind but your heart as well.

Pray for your wife to do the same.

It is not about making Jesus your Lord it is about you truly believing from your heart all the He has done for you.

once you have truly believed on Christ then the Holy Ghost will begin to teach you when you read the Bible and even how to study it.

Now, if I am wrong in what I have said. there is no harm done in saying it.

It's very possible you are right. I believe in my mind that I'm a sinner. I believe in my mind that Jesus's death on the cross is the only reason I would be spared the torment of hell, because He had to say the price of my sins, which 47 death. I believe these things! But how do I if past mere belief? Must I rely on God for everything including my faith? Must I realize that I can't even have faith without Him? must I simply begin reading the Bible and going to a Bible believing church and rely on God for the rest? I just don't know what to do. I relate to two phrases out of the Bible that I don't know where they are. One: What must I do to be saved? Two: Lord I believe. Help Thou my unbelief.

Buzz, you sound a lot like a minister. Are you in Bible college or seminary? When the people in Acts 2 cried out, "What shall we do?" it was because they were pricked in their heart by Peter's preaching. Please forgive me if I'm wrong, but I perceive I'm not reading the post of a man pricked in his heart.

Luke 18:13 has this prayer, "God, be merciful to me a sinner." Ask the Lord to help you get to this point. Review the 10 Commandments and know that if you even break one in your lifetime God sees you as a transgressor of the Law, a sinner, and you can never undo that. For that sin you earn death. Your only hope is for someone who is not guilty to come and take your place. This is why it was important that the Lord Jesus Christ never sin. Not in word, thought or deed, and not even once. He took our place. Because he satisfied the judgement against us, we can go free.

Romans 10:9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
Romans 10:10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

My Friend you cant buy it, you cant work for it you simply have to accept it.

Romans 3:23 For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;

Every single person on Gods earth is a sinner, we all sin, even when we get saved we still sin, sin is in our nature, but when you realise in your heart that sin is destroying you and will finally finish you off in eternal damnation, unless you simply come before the Lord Jesus Christ and admit to him in your heart that you cannot deal with your sin on your own, and take it all to the foot of that blessed cross, the filthy rags that are your life, leave them at his feet and ask him for forgiveness and ask him to save you and if you mean it with all your heart you will be saved.

Dont look for a sign or a feeling, don't let anyone tell you you didn't do it right, just believe what it says in the word of God

Ephesians 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

Its a Gift, its Free and you seem to be looking for it in all the wrong places, just take it all to the cross my friend, lay it down at his feet and accept his free Gift by believing in your heart he is on that cross for YOUR sins.

God Bless and I pray you accept it if you haven't already and your life through Gods spirit is forever changed.

George stated something similar Brother and I would sincerely hope this isnt a trick by buzzoff to bring about a conversation on "repentance".
That would just be utterly devious and unscriptural

Sorry I didn't catch that earlier. I edited that out because I felt I was reading too much into what he said. It's true, that was my first reaction. I hope that's not what he is doing, though. Unfortunately, recent posts by others have made me a bit jaded. Perhaps Buzz can appreciate that!:)

If I wanted a conversation on repentance I would have posted again in the thread I started on Lordship Salvation. I simply want the truth. Most of you guys seem to know you have it. I, on the other hand hear things like Way of the Master and McArthur, and my wife telling me I need to go to a catholic church, and I get unsure. I am no minister. I think I have above average intelligence. I also over-analyze things. I just want to be saved. I want to know I have the truth, as so many of you here seem to.

Please Read the following My Friend, please read without "way of the master", Macarthur, repentance as described by these men and indeed anything you may be over anylzing, read over this prayerfully and focus on one thing
YOUR position with God, not anyone elses or indeed what anyone else says your position with God is.

God's Word For Anxious Souls - by Murray McCandless

How often we have heard anxious souls declare in their frustration, “ I believe, but I am not saved!” They hear the same message of the gospel as others, read the same Bible verses, and yet they are described in the sad words of Jeremiah 8:20 “not saved”. We must remember that salvation is not merely the result of human understanding. Salvation is the result of revealed truth from God’s Word to the anxious soul, accepted by faith. I cannot over emphasize the value of the personal, careful reading of the scriptures: “What saith the scripture?” (Galatians 4:30).

It will be helpful to open your Bible and read the passage, John 4:46-54, concerning the nobleman’s son. This is one of the clearest passages in the gospels to prove conclusively that one must accept His Word and that alone. “He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day” (John 12:48). “Wherefore neither thought I myself worthy to come unto thee: but say in a word, and my servant shall be healed” (Luke 7:7). “Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever” (1 Peter 1:23).

The nobleman had made his way to the Savior with burdened heart concerning his dying son. When he met the Savior, he was greeted with these words: “Except ye see signs and wonders ye will not believe.” At this puzzling statement, the man had one of two options: forget what he heard and go home and bury his son; or he could do as he did, accept the same and in faith and humility exclaim, “Sir, come down ere my child die” (vs 49). The Saviour immediately said, “Go thy way, thy son liveth.” Please note the period after the word “liveth”; nothing more was needed to heal the boy. I would like to present two questions: (1) What if the man didn’t believe the word? Would his son have lived? (2) What if the man didn’t go his way? Would his son have lived?

Now here is where we must be careful. The answer to both questions is an emphatic, yes. For this one reason: Jesus said it. He did not say, “Thy son liveth, if you believe.” He did not say, “Thy son liveth, if you go your way.” His believing had nothing to do with it. Believing didn’t make the boy better; the Savior did. So often we want to put something in the scripture that is not there, or take something away that is there.

Suppose we were to encounter this man joyfully making his way home. We stop him and ask him why he is so happy. Would he not with joy tell us his son is living? If we were to ask him how he knows that, would his reply not be “because Jesus said it”? Suppose later the same day we meet the same man, and now he is very disturbed; joy is gone, no peace. Is his boy better, is he living? Most certainly; his feelings have nothing to do with the fever being rebuked in the boy by the Son of God.

Now an interesting thing happens. He meets his servants. Normally they were not to leave the property of the master. Possibly as the mother cradled her once dying boy in her arms she saw him sitting up and noticed the fever was gone. So she would send the servants to get the master in the belief that the Savior isn’t needed. The boy is better. She doesn’t realize that the Savior had spoken the word and the boy would live for this reason. To prove how little this man’s faith was, he asks the servants when he began to get better (vs 52). Did he think it was something gradual? Salvation is not gradual; it is the miracle of a moment, because it is a birth (John 3:3). How come he doesn’t announce to the servants upon meeting them that he knows the boy is living? Maybe he wasn’t sure. Did that change anything? Not a thing. He now knows that it was the same hour in which Jesus said unto him, “Thy son liveth”, and himself believed and his whole house. Again let me remind you, it was not “thy son liveth if you believe”, or “thy son liveth if you go your way”. It is true, he believed, and it is true he went his way, but it had nothing to do with the boy living or dying. IT WAS ALL IN WHAT JESUS SAID.

The blind man in John 9:35 is asked, “Dost thou believe on the Son of God?” Notice, the man does not confess to more faith than he possesses, and replies, “Who is he, Lord, that I might believe on him?” Listen to the delightful and assuring reply of the Saviour: “Thou hast both seen him, and it is he that talketh with thee” (John 9:37-38). And he said, “Lord, I believe,” and he worshipped Him. He had to take His Word for it that He was Jesus, the Son of God.

So the anxious sinner asks, “Is my believing needed then?” Yes, it is, and for this reason. The work of Christ on the cross is complete and it is enough to save all. But God gives the free gift of eternal life to those who accept it as repentant sinners. So they believe God’s Word.

Sometimes we treat the word “believe” as if it were a poor choice of word for God to use, and it has stumbled so many people. What stumbles them is not so much the word as their unbelief and their futile efforts to make belief, rather than Christ, their savior.

There are, of course, other words used for the same experience, but in the end we place our trust in the Savior or we fail to do so. That is exactly what His Word tells us. We reject it at our peril.

“He that believeth on him is not condemned; but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God” (John 3:18).

“He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life; and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him” (John 3:36).

“Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life” (John 5:24).

If you have never been convinced that you are going to hell, it is not going to be possible for you to be sure that you are now on your way to heaven. The Word of God and of the Lord Jesus is our authority for both. If the words of Christ mean anything they mean everything. He assures us of our being lost without Him. He assures us of His power to save those who trust Him. The question is, do we trust His Word alone?

“But what saith it? The word is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach; That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved” (Romans 10:8-9).

2 Corinthians 11:3-4 But I fear, lest by any means, as the serpent beguiled Eve through his subtilty, so your minds should be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ. For if he that cometh preacheth another Jesus, whom we have not preached, or if ye receive another spirit, which ye have not received, or another gospel, which ye have not accepted, ye might well bear with him.

Don't "bear with" them. Anyone who wants to add something to your salvation should be ignored.

I think I'm starting to understand. It's just so hard for me to get past myself and get to Jesus. It's hard for me to realize the work is done. It's hard for me to get past "head knowledge" and get to "heart belief". Should I just accept what the Bible says, even though I struggle with unbelief, and read the Word praying that God will eliminate that very barrier?

I have wondered this at many times. How does one determine the difference between head belief and heart belief, especially when the Bible makes no such differentiation?

How do I know that my faith is real, since I often have the same questions and concerns as buzzoff

The other question is "How much guilt and sorrow must a sinner express in order to be saved?"

Luke My dad believes in Jesus in his head, he acknowledges that Jesus is a historical figure, real and not imaginative but he does not believe that if he wont accept him as his personal Saviour and admit he is a guilty sinner who will suffer an eternal punishment in hell and that being "born again" is the ONLY way to heaven. That's mind belief, hes not saved :(
To believe that without Christ you are a guilty sinner heading for eternal damnation, to acknowledge that Christ is the ONLY way to heaven
John 3:3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.

To believe in his finished work on the cross for YOU because he loved YOU enough to send his only begotten Son to die for YOUR sins
1 John 4:10 Herein is love, not that we loved God, but that he loved us, and sent his Son to be the propitiation for our sins.

Luke Bro you really need to get over the repentance issue you have, some people are taken to the brink, the edge of life broken and destitute before they see the truth, through drink, drugs, abuse, broken homes, broken marriages, death of loved ones etc and their sorrow may be greater than someone who is just not satisfied with life but as long as they both come before a risen Saviour in need of his salvation, guilty sinners before the cross and damned to an eternal hell without him and BELIEVE his words, they WILL be saved. its in the heart and with the heart we BELIEVE onto righteousness

Romans 10:10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

Just like the nobleman it dosent matter if you doubt it, Jesus said it and no amount of doubting on your part will ever change what he said
“Go thy way, thy son liveth.” DONE, DUSTED, SETTLED
Yet I am sure he doubted all the way home and even when he got home he doubted the hour his son began to amend, but eventually believed, was he only saved then NO, as soon as Christ said “Go thy way, thy son liveth.” it was done, the rest was doubt on the nobelmans part, Bro Luke you can doubt all the way to the end of your days, until the judgement seat of Christ, but nothing will ever change your position in Christ, from you asked him to save you it was DONE, DUSTED, SETTLED, the doubt is all on your part Not the Lords. There is no certain amount or strength or measured breadth depth or height of repentance to be saved, if you realise you are hellbound, dead in your sins without Jesus Christ and his free gift of eternal life you have already accepted in your heart you need him, can you live without him? I doubt you will answer no Brother, therefore in your Heart you know he is your Saviour and you are saved.

John 10:29-31 My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand. I and my Father are one. Then the Jews took up stones again to stone him.

Buzz, I've read this whole thread and I have not seen one piece of bad advice given to you by the others. The difference in this forum as opposed to others is these people here are all caring and compassionate people. This is not a boxing ring as many forums are, and the only one I care to hang out in and interact with people in.

You are not "lost", in my opinion, but are confused. What advice do I give you? You need to start reading the book of Romans and read on through Philemon and then start back at Romans again, Buzz. I make it no secret I am a dispensationalist nor do I keep my views a secret. You need to know who you are in Christ, you will not find this in Leviticus or Hebrews, but in Romans through Philemon.

You need to understand all the Bible is for you, but not all of it is written to you.

You need to understand what God did yesterday(Genesis-Acts 28), what He is doing today(Romans-Philemon), what He will be doing in Ages To Come(Hebrews-Revelation).

If you start in the OT you will hit the begat who begat who begat who begat and you will tire and stop there, and next thing you'll be shaloming and el shadai'ing left and right and trying to keep the Law. The Law was to lead the Jews to Christ and His revelation through Paul to you today in Romans through Philemon will tell you His will for Buzz today.

You cannot fulfill the "Great Commission", it is not to you, your "commission" begins with your next door neighbor and your community, to be a minister of the reconciliation and an ambassador for Christ.

You need to know the difference between a Jew and a Gentile and the third race, the church of the Living God. You need to know the difference between Israel and the Body of Christ, the mystery of Jew and Gentile now together and equal in one Body that was only revealed to Paul. You will only find this in Romans through Philemon because Peter, James, and John did not receive this revelation until Paul got it from Christ Himself. They then continued in the kingdom of heaven gospel because that was their Commission, while Paul preached the gospel for today, the grace of God through Christ crucified to Jew and Gentile apart from the works of the Law.

Find out God's will for today, and you'll only find it in Romans through Philemon, then you can know what He did yesterday and what He will do in the future. Be thoroughly furnished unto good works, be prepared to endure hardness as a good soldier for Christ, preach Christ crucified because that is what He is doing today, the ministry of the reconciliation to wit, God was in Christ reconciling the world unto Himself.

Find out what His will is for you today.

Grace and peace to you Buzz.

Tony

This is how you know you are a saved man Buzz, that internal conflict. Lost people do not have that internal conflict but continue in their sins without any thought or conviction.

Read Romans 8, all of it, and tell me then who can separate Buzz from the love of Christ? Read Romans through Philemon and find out His will for you, and who you are in Christ today.

Grace and peace.

Tony

Luke, when Christ died for your sins, how man of them were yet future?

All
Of
Them

You need to get into Romans 8, and realize this internal conflict does not take place in lost people. I spent 4 hours Sunday teaching a young Jewish woman, a convert to the gospel of Christ, a co-worker of my wife, the realities if what God is doing for her today(Paul's gospel and doctrine for today, Roma's through Philemon) and the internal conflict and Christ's love for her that nothing can separate her from.

Grace and peace to you brother

Tony

Tony, thank you. THANK YOU! Not that I don't appreciate everyone else's advice. I do. It's just that Tony, you're the first one to offer it without thinking I had some hidden agenda or alterior motive. I believe I have been open and honest. Hopefully, everyone can realize that, really, I AM just confused. That is why I ask the questions I do. Not to start an argument or pick apart some doctrine or another. I just want the truth. I look forward to further discussions with you all.

Buzz, I don't mean to contradict myself, but brother, we all have an ulterior motive. We're all sinners saved by grace. I don;t know what I could possibly accuse you of or even hint at since I'm a cross between Jack The Ripper and Dracula myself. Yet due to His mercy and to His glory He died for all of us.

Confusion and struggles in the flesh are like laying a floor with green lumber. You get one end nailed down and the other one pops up. You nail it down and the end you just nailed pops up. Do you know through your own effort and labor, you can't fix that floor?

The Lord can.

You need to continue to be open and honest Buzz. I have been and will continue to be open and honest in the Dispensationalism thread. I have been and will continue to be open and honest in the Water Baptism thread. Whether I am right or wrong is not the issue to me, I was open and honest is what counts to me. The first Person you need to be open and honest with is God, we'll wait. Be open and honest with Him and the confusion disappears.

I'll tell you what you need to read before you read anything. You need to read the book of Philemon. Do you know everything Paul ever wrote could be condensed down into that one little letter? Paul(Jesus Christ) is addressing Philemon(God the Father) on behalf of Onesimus, (a sinner). Whatever he stole from you I'll pay for it. Paul(Jesus Christ) steps in between two brothers, one who has offended the other, and says to Philemon(the offended), hey, I died for Onesimus(the offender) just as I died for you, because you offended Me once, I accepted you now accept him.
The references and similitudes and like figures are almost endless. That's why in my own scholastic fury I call Philemon the "capstone" of Paul's "theology". Christ was the foundation of Paul's writing, He is the roof also.

He is the whole Building. And we are His living stones.

For my part I thank you for your kind comments. In this forum, even when we disagree, we complement as a unit each other rather than oppose each other. He is One Body and we are all part of it. A body is not fragments but each part a part of the other.

Noah's Ark, Balaam's ass, the Law, the anti-Christ and the Millenium are all yesterday and tomorrow. Romans through Philemon is who, where, and what Buzz is today.

Grace and peace to you buddy

Tony

buzz,

Just be sure it is really from your heart you will know. I said what I said to get you to a point to really seek God about it. what Tbones said is true the fact you are having a great struggle could in fact show your salvation.

I recently had one of the strangest event in my life, I fasted and cried all night because of one thing a man said to me. I can't go into the whole details but a confrontational meeting with a man who had spread rumors and lies about me in a half truth fashion ended with me being quite upset that the man refused to see it, and right there in the presence of others right to my face had lied again. Aand acted as nothing was wrong. I was ready to fume.

anyway, the mediator asked me in private after the unsuccessful meeting, "Are you saved?"

I answered, "what! of course I am saved"

he asked another Question, "They why didn't I see Christ."

If floored me. I mean it it really shook me up. I spent the next 12 hours in prayer and fasting. about 3 hours into crying out to the Lord from the roof top all alone, the Lord took me to Psalm 136 every verse said, His mercy endureth for ever.

I knew then my salvation was secured. My flesh had been in control and he took me to some other verses in James and in Philippians which guided me into what was happening as far as I was concerned.

that little event was needed and I will never will doubt again about my salvation. it involved my intellect, my emotions, my heart and my body. There were no feelings per se the Bible verse in them selves were marvelously inspirational. the tears I shed were needed forgiveness went forth to this man without him ever admitting his error. and I was free from the years of holding it in my heart all the hurt and anger and disappointment of someone who was supposed to be a leader and a living example to those of lower rank and file within our organization.

Sometimes we need times alone with God to get us where he wants us. that is why I asked the questions and proposed what I said.

God bless and we are praying for you.

Brother we can all see clearly that you are confused and the amount of advice given is certainly an indication that we care for you, we care for your position with the Saviour. If I may I would like to point you to some posts by Brother Forrest. Its based on doctrine for Christian Living, and I would have that prayerfully you read his posts that magnify the need to rest in Christ, to be content in the fact that we can DO nothing, we need to just be, for without him we are and can do, nothing.
Leave the outside world "outside" for a moment, forget the "Lordship salvationists" like comfort and Macarthur, forget the RCC, forget ALL these people that are adding to your salvation, looking for signs and wonders as "proof" you are saved. Your struggle is a war between flesh and spirit, quit seeking signs in the flesh (feelings) and concentrate on the spirit, concentrate on the word of God.

2 Corinthians 10:3 For though we walk in the flesh, we do not war after the flesh:
2 Corinthians 10:4 For the weapons of our warfare are not carnal, but mighty through God to the pulling down of strong holds;
2 Corinthians 10:5 Casting down imaginations, and every high thing that exalteth itself against the knowledge of God, and bringing into captivity every thought to the obedience of Christ;

Have a read over Brother Forrests Posts here.

http://av1611.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1094

Ok. So let me ask one other thing. And please don't think I'm trying to "stir anything up", or anything like that. I'm pretty sure I understand Br. Forrest's posts you linked to. But is believing not doing something on our part? Or is that the whole point? We didn't even come to belief on our own. I'm still a bit confused, but I think it's clearing up a bit. I just want correct doctrines. I get that I am saved. I don't have to DO anything. It's already done. Jesus took care of it all. But again is belief not action?

Buzz,

No believing is not a work. works are outward things that can be seen, belief is an inward event that is between you and God and cannot be seen by anyone other than God. Faith is not a work it is a heart response. they are different.

Bro George said it better but I can't seem to remember to quote it. I will look for the link.

Buzz, belief is an inner operation of the spirit Read these verse, read them again, let them all tie together in your spirit:

Job 32:8 But there is a spirit in man: and the inspiration of the Almighty giveth them understanding.

Ro 10:17 So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.

2Th 2:13 But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth:

Your fleshly, natural mind says there is no Jesus, there is no salvation, there is no life after this life, that you just die and rot in a grave, winked out of thought as if you never existed:

1Co 2:14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

You've been made alive brother, by His Spirit through His word:

Ps 119:50 This is my comfort in my affliction: for thy word hath quickened me.
Ps 119:93 I will never forget thy precepts: for with them thou hast quickened me.
Eph 2:1 And you hath he quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins;
Eph 2:5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved;)
Col 2:13 And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;
1Pe 3:18 For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit:

We have to die inside, and let His Spirit make us alive again:

Ro 6:11 Likewise reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin, but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord.
1Co 15:36 Thou fool, that which thou sowest is not quickened, except it die:

The "actions" we perform are done after we are made one of His:

Eph 2:10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

I don't know what MacArthur teaches about belief, the Church Of Christ, in order to damn everyone who don't follow them or their dead works, try to say belief is a "work". They do err, not knowing the Scriptures. Christ did all the "work", then out of gratitude we do good works because we were created
to do good works, not before salvation, but after.

Eph 1:19 And what is the exceeding greatness of his power to us–ward who believe, according to the working of his mighty power,

I wouldn't use the books of Sadducees like John MacArthur for toilet paper, brother Buzz, I don't want to contaminate myself. MacArthur is another Yea HAth God Said fool who denies the literal blood sacrifice, and probably the next thing he'll be saying is the cross was not necessary, only His "death" and they may as well have stuck him full of spears or beheaded Him as was the common Roman fashion. You remember this all the days of your life, this is one of the Commandments Of Tony Bonesism: If you depart one period from doctrine, you may as well depart from the whole sentence.

1Co 2:14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

Belief is an operation of your spirit, not an "action", your mind and flesh don't believe, can't believe.

Grace and peace brother

Tony

Faith.

What was the first thing that Jesus Christ almost always said to those who were weak?

“Ye of little faith”

What can you move mountains with?

Answer: Faith.

Faith is so potent that even faith the size of a mustard seed can move those mountains.

Without it God will not be pleased.

When we start leaning on other “guides” besides the Bible, we testify against ourselves that we don’t have faith in his Word.

Believing is not a work but it is a "do:"

Acts 16:30-31 And brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved? And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house.

Why is this so HARD for me. Why can't I just accept the gift as I once did. I know I accepted the gift at one point in my life, so therefore, I'm saved. But I've allowed myself to be so confused. :(

Take a day or two away from people entirely, just you and your Bible, a beach, a mountain, forest park etc.
It has been men that have confused you and you have allowed them. Since the devil cannot undo any mans salvation, his next attack is to cause them to doubt it, never forget that anyone who comes accusing, you can be sure the devil is behind it. Put on the helmet of salvation, (You know a helmet is on your head, know you are wearing your salvation) it makes you immune to vain janglings, fair speeches and accusers and the sword of the spirit will do the rest.
Still praying for you, but the rest is down to you and the Lord by and through his spirit, which is why I suggest a day at least away from all people and immerse yourself in the Lord and his Holy written word.

Ephesians 6:17 And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God:

I agree with Peopleoftheway.

You said "as you once did" If you are saved it is all about getting back to where God can use you and that is a heart issue at this point.