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Old 04-10-2009, 09:34 PM
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George George is offline
 
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Default Re: " Dr. Greg Estep's Daniel's 70 Weeks"

BornAgainBibleBeliever,

In regards to your Post #29:

Your Quote:
Quote:
Its interesting that you brought up Apollos:

1 Corinthians 3:6 I have planted, Apollos watered; but God gave the increase.
1 Corinthians 3:7 So then neither is he that planteth any thing, neither he that watereth; but God that giveth the increase.

Paul planted (inspired), Apollos watered (not inspired), but God gave the increase.
Its also very interesting to note that Apollos was an heretick before he got straightened out, and THEN God used him for great things
.”
Your statement: “Paul planted (inspired), Apollos watered (not inspired),” demonstrates (once again) that you have very little spiritual discernment. First of all - you just ADDEDwords” to the Holy words of God, i.e. the words - “inspired” and “not inspired”!

Your “private interpretation” of these verses is a gross misunderstanding of what Paul was saying. Have you ever done any Gardening (“husbandry”)? Paul said that he (Paul) “PLANTED” (the churches - God’s “husbandry”, in the Mediterranean area); and that Apollos “WATERED” (the churches - God’s “husbandry”, in the Mediterranean area). There is nothing said about Apollos “not” being “inspired” (i.e. “not inspired”). Paul was describing TWO DIFFERENT JOBS done by TWO DIFFERENT KINDS OF WORKMEN (“labourers”). (PLANTING & WATERING!)

Read the verses in the context – don’t take my word for it:

Quote:
1 Corinthians 3:5 Who then is Paul, and who is Apollos, but ministers by whom ye believed, even as the Lord gave to every man?
{Both Paul and Apollos are “MINISTERS”. Both men were called of God. – NOT just Paul! Both men were called of God to do DIFFERENT JOBS, but they were BOTH MINISTERS OF GOD.}

Quote:
6 I have planted, Apollos watered; but God gave the increase.
{Read the Book of Acts – Paul “PLANTED” all of the early churches - God’s “husbandry”, in the Gentile world in the Mediterranean area, Apollos came along AFTER and “WATERED” them. It’s that “simple”.}

Quote:
7 So then neither is he that planteth any thing, neither he that watereth; but God that giveth the increase.
{Paul establishes the fact that the missionary, evangelist, and preacher ARE NOTHING! IT’S ALL ABOUT GOD! The labourer (Paul) who “PLANTED” isn’t anything, and neither is the labourer (Apollos) who “WATERED” anything. It (the church) is God’s Garden (i.e. “husbandry”) – NOT theirs! The teaching is clear: God’s “husbandry” (His church) belongs to Him – NOT the MINISTER (i.e. “labourer!”}

Quote:
8 Now he that planteth and he that watereth are one: and every man shall receive his own reward according to his own labour.
{NOTICE: BOTHhe that “PLANTETH” and he that WATERETH are ONE! Where does “inspired” & “not inspired” come into the equation? Both Paul and Apollos are labourers “working for God” in God’s Garden (i.e. His church) – they are both said to be ONE! The Scriptures don’t say anything about one of them (Paul) being “inspired” and the other one (Apollos) “not inspired”. That’s your “private interpretation”, which has absolutely nothing to do with what God is teaching here in these verses. You just ADDED to the Holy words of God in order to “make sense” out of God’s Holy word!}

Quote:
9 For we are labourers together with God: ye are God's husbandry, ye are God's building.
{Paul clearly and distinctly says that WE (BOTH Paul & Apollos) are labourers TOGETHER WITH GOD! The testimony of Scripture is so clear: BOTH Paul & Apollos are working TOGETHER – “WITH GOD”. WHY would you “think” that One of them (Paul) was “inspired” and the other one (Apollos) was “not inspired”? WHERE would you get such an idea? It couldn’t possibly be one of the “preaching tapes” that you’ve been listening to, could it? NOTICE TOO: That Paul SWITCHES from using “husbandry” as a “SIMILE” to explain the difference between his job and Apollos’ and he now begins to use “carpentry” (building/construction) to further explain his ministry, (and those that may “build” upon his foundation) in terms that ordinary people could understand (at least back then). I was a carpenter/builder for over 25 years, and I have done a whole lot of farming (wet land, dry land, hydroponic, sprouting, etc.) The words that Paul is speaking here have special meaning to me since I have participated in all of these activities.}

Quote:
10 According to the grace of God which is given unto me, as a wise masterbuilder, I have laid the foundation, and another buildeth thereon. But let every man take heed how he buildeth thereupon.
{Paul is the “masterbuilder” (of the church). He “laid the foundation (of the church); and if “another” – (Apollos or anyone else) “buildeth thereon”, they had better be careful HOW they “buildeth thereupon”. God called the “masterbuilder” (Paul) to lay the foundation for the church/ Anyone who built upon that “foundation” better “take heed”!}

Quote:
11 For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ.
{So, if “another” comes along and claims that there is “another foundation” (like the "pastor" is the "HEAD")– other than Jesus Christ – You can be absolutely sure that they are not following the “foundation” that the “masterbuilder” (Paul) laid, and you can know for sure, that they aren’t working for God, because - “ALL HIS WORKS ARE DONE IN TRUTH.” Psalms 33:4}

Quote:
12 Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble;
{The “any man” in the verse is specifically talking about men (“any man”) that are called of God to “build” upon Paul’s “foundation”, i.e. ministers, labourers, workers.}

Quote:
13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is.
{The “every man”, in the context, is still talking about God’s workers, i.e. those who are called of God to “build” upon Paul’s “foundation”.}

Quote:
14 If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward.
{The “any man”, in the context, is still talking about God’s workers, i.e. those who are called of God to “build” upon Paul’s “foundation”.}

Quote:
15 If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire.
{Paul is still speaking about “any man”, in the context, he is still talking about God’s workers, i.e. those who are called of God to “build” upon Paul’s “foundation”.}

Quote:
16 Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you?
{The “YE” in the context is the church. The church is “the temple of God. The Spirit of God dwelleth in the church. “YE” & “YOU” are always plural pronouns in the King James Bible.}

Quote:
17 If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are.
{The “any man”, in the context, is still talking about God’s workers, i.e. those who are called of God to “build” upon Paul’s “foundation”. NOTICE THE SEVERITY OF THE OFFENSE OF DEFILING THE TEMPLE (i.e. the church) OF GOD! Those men (“any man”) who DEFILE “the temple (i.e. the church) of God”, him shall God DESTROY”! WHY? Because “the temple (i.e. the church) of God is HOLY! Perhaps now you can understand WHY I get so upset with “false teachers” and hereticks. “Any man” who messes with God’s temple (i.e. the church – the saints) is committing a most serious offense, and you can be sure - NO MAN who “defiles the temple of God” is going to get away with it!}

Quote:
18 Let no man deceive himself. If any man among you seemeth to be wise in this world, let him become a fool, that he may be wise.
{The “no man” is still in reference to the “any man” who is supposed to be one of God’s workers. The warning is clear: “Let no man deceive himself” – If you are going to work on God’s temple (building, i.e. the church) you better take heed; you had better NOT MESS WITH IT!}

Quote:
19 For the wisdom of this world is foolishness with God. For it is written, He taketh the wise in their own craftiness.
20 And again, The Lord knoweth the thoughts of the wise, that they are vain.
21 Therefore let no man glory in men. For all things are yours;
{Did you get that? Do you understand what God is warning against? The “no man” is still in reference to the “any man” who is supposed to be one of God’s workers; and “no man” (who is building upon Paul “foundation” i.e. the temple of God - the church of God) is to GLORY IN MEN! God’s workers (“labourers”) are NOT TO GLORY IN PREACHERS, EVANGELISTS, TEACHERS, ETC. OR ANY OTHER MEN, FOR THAT MATTER. We are not to be GLORYING in any man’s “work”, or his teaching, or in the man himself, instead we are supposed to GLORY in God and in His Holy word.}

Quote:
22 Whether Paul, or Apollos, or Cephas, or the world, or life, or death, or things present, or things to come; all are yours;
{Please Notice: Paul closes by identifying the “any man” and “every man” as being himself (Paul), and Apollos, and Cephas (Peter) – ALL MEN, who were “labourers together with God”. ALL MEN - who were workers (“builders”) involved in building the temple of God (i.e. the church of God) at that time.}

Quote:
23 And ye are Christ's; and Christ is God's.

And now on to your outrageous statement about Apollos being a "HERETICK":


Your quote:
Quote:
Its also very interesting to note that Apollos was an heretick before he got straightened out, and THEN God used him for great things.”
In an effort to PROVE your point (that a HERETICK {like "someone" who has been discussed here recently?} can “change” and be used of God) you have ended up ADDING to the word of God (once again) and twisting and wresting God’s word out of context to justify your “private interpretation”.

No where’s in Scripture does it say that Apollos was a HERETICK!

Quote:
Acts 18:24 And a certain Jew named Apollos, born at Alexandria, an eloquent man, and mighty in the scriptures, came to Ephesus.
{Apollos was AN ELOQUENT MAN - “mighty in the Scriptures” – NOT A HERETICK!}

Quote:
25 This man was instructed in the way of the Lord; and being fervent in the spirit, he spake and taught diligently the things of the Lord, knowing only the baptism of John.
{Apollos was a man who was “was instructed in the way of the Lord– He did NOT embrace HERESY! He “taught diligently the things of the Lord, knowing only the baptism of John.” Apollos was NOT teaching “FALSE DOCTRINE” or “HERESY”; he just DIDN’T KNOW the “whole council of God”. You could say that God hadn’t “brought him up to date” – YET! But you can’t say that he was a HERETICK, or that he was teaching "HERESY"!

Every thing that Apollos was teaching was TRUE; it’s just that God had revealed to Paul the “mysteries” (one of which was “the church) that He (God) hadn’t revealed to Peter, James, John, or even John the Baptist. Apollo’s preaching was “out of date”, but it was NOT “FALSE DOCTRINE” or “HERESY”. Apollos was NOT a “HERETICK”!}

Quote:
26 And he began to speak boldly in the synagogue: whom when Aquila and Priscilla had heard, they took him unto them, and expounded unto him the way of God more perfectly.
{When Aquila and Priscilla heard Apollos speaking boldly in the synagogue, they took him aside and “expounded unto him the way of God more perfectly”. Apollos’ preaching in the synagogue was TRUE, it’s just that God hadn’t revealed to him “the way of God more perfectly”. When you claim that Apollos was a HERETICK, you are guilty of disparaging and maligning a “faithful” servant of God who wasn’t even “mistaken” - God just hadn’t revealed to him the “mysteries” that he revealed to Paul – NOT UNTIL Aquila and Priscilla “expounded unto him the way of God more perfectly”. To accuse Apollos of being a HERETICK is to make FALSE ACCUSATIONS against a man of God, WHOM God used mightily, and of whom the Scriptures have NOTHING BAD TO SAY!

Quote:
27 And when he was disposed to pass into Achaia, the brethren wrote, exhorting the disciples to receive him: who, when he was come, helped them much which had believed through grace:
28 For he mightily convinced the Jews, and that publickly, shewing by the scriptures that Jesus was Christ.
It is amazing (to me), the “lengths” that modern day Christians will go to, in order to support their own private interpretations of Scripture, or to prove and justify their own opinions about spiritual issues and matters. Before “expounding” on Paul and Apollos “ministry”, you should have read the Scriptures - rather than “jumping to unscriptural conclusions”, that you cannot possibly support. And before accusing a “faithful” man of God of being a heretick, you should have first tried to determine what the Scriptural “DEFINITION of a heretick IS!

Instead, you have ended up ADDING to the Holy words of God; TWISTING and WRESTING God’s word; taking the Scriptures OUT OF CONTEXT; and bad-mouthing a faithful servant of God from the past. It is apparent to me, that “listening” to all of the “sermons” that you have been listening to – hasn’t helped you to discern or understand God’s Holy word. And that’s because “sermons” can only give you “knowledge”. In order to acquire spiritual discernment, understanding and wisdom, you must study the Scriptures and look to the Holy Spirit for those things – NOT MEN. All the “sermons” in the world are but a poorsubstitute” for God’s Holy word!

Isaiah 34:16 Seek ye out of the book of the LORD, and read: no one of these shall fail, none shall want her mate: for my mouth it hath commanded, and his spirit it hath gathered them.

Last edited by George; 04-10-2009 at 09:44 PM.